Upcoming Release Br 194 / E94 Railtour Pack – Coming Soon!

You've answered your own question.
It would need to come with new Reichsbahn coaches or goods vans even for railtours.
For it to make real sense it would need to be a backdated timetable, but on a backdated route as well. And that route is set in this millennium and there is no existing fitting rolling stock. The BR143 wasn't that spread when the 254 was still in service, as well as it's successor the 155, of which we don't have a period appropriate version either. Also not a single existing passenger coach or goods van are in the game.

I agree we need more routes in Eastern Germany, possibly even some backdated ones so we can do auch shenanigans like an 80's timetable, but right now it'd be pointless I'm afraid.

 

Very excited for this indeed. As others have noted, the screenshot of the orient red 110 and mint green n-Wagen is very odd for a 1984 timetable. I’m hoping TSG will clear the confusion up before release.

 

Agreed, but I think it has been done to add a little more variety to the screenshots. In my opinion, they should have gone for the blue/beige 218 with steel n-Wagen instead. We've still not seen any officially released pic of it so far.

The whole route will be a bit of a compromise in terms of style. Most of the station accessories along the route, like clocks, station signs and so on have been introduced in the late 80's, around the time the orient red and mint green colour scheme came out. I also just noticed the surveillance cameras in the picture above the 110, which have definitely not been there in 1984.
But as long as the timetable is fun and the vehicles are great, I'm willing to cut it some slack and take the compromise

 

True. I think we’ve even talked about this before - it’ll be a bit of a wild mix, but I’m sure the end result will feel more real than the arguably actually closer to reality DTG timetable. We’ll see what they come up with but the pack is too enticingly up my alley for me to complain too much.

Are you sure?

Source

 

I think so too. I enjoy the DTG 1998 timetable, but it's still rather bland. With more variety in the freight rolling stock and the addition of many, many shunting operations (or just shunting operations at all) it could be much better.
Let's wait and see what TSG's got in store for us

OMG why didn't I think of that?

 

Theres no other option but to use the Orient Red 110 and Mint Green coaches, without them everyone would be required to own Mittenwaldbahn just to have basically any passenger trains at all. I think the Silberlings will mostly sub for the mint greens if you have Mittenwald, although due to the lack of Cab cars those will always remain Mint Green. Again reskinning the 110/Kako is way beyond the scope of this pack! That really would be a scope creep too far!

 

Hmm... ok. Thanks for the insight! I definitely understand the reasoning behind this, but selling it as a 1984 timetable is just plain wrong then.

Completely understandable, wasn't expecting it. Although I was under the impression that, since there weren't any on the screenshots, no cab cars would be used on the route at all... similar to Mittenwaldbahn. The 110 wouldn't be equipped with Wendezugsteuerung in that era anyway.
Does that mean, no cab car services for the 218? Since the diesel cab is only available in modern red at this point.

I guess I'm just gonna pretend it's a late 1987/early 1988 timetable. The E94 was still in service (just barely) back then, so were the Umbauwagen.

 

Well lets face it in an ideal world it wouldn't be a 110, it would be a 141 and either Kako or Hasenkasten, none of which we have! Even in the time period the base route is set, it wouldn't be a 110 on local trains. At the end of the day its still the 1984 timetable, just what is running it well, isn't due to lack of period stock. But who knows what the future might bring

 

Agreed. We're getting there, step by step

 

Besides, the modding community will be on it quickly. I already have two silver KaKo variants, and ivory/blue and cobalt blue 110s.

 

Quite diappointing to hear we’ll have mint green n-Wagen and orient red 110s in a 1984 timetable. Wouldn’t it at least be possible to set up substitution in a way that the Mittenwaldbahn Silberlinge always replace the mint ones when owned, DominusEdwardius? That would help at least a bit.

Still, it is what it is. Absolutely right though that a 111+Silberlinge combo as we had suspected before would have been a massive compromise as well. The 141 (+ appropriate cab car) is a massive missing link we just don’t have for now. I’m definitely still on board for day one either way.

 

Um, not quite, true DominusEdwardius . While the DBBR 112 was initially ordered for the Rheingold and TEE services and were equipped with gears allowing vmax 160, they didn't solely pull these services. In those days the BD would dispatch the locos they had when required, regardless of what class of service it was. It was alos not uncommon to see the DBBR 103 pulling a set of Silberlinge and as such also the 112, if their Rotation scheme permitted or required for example transfer to another starting point instead of going as Lz.

Pictures 5 to 7 and 21
https://www.drehscheibe-online.de/foren/read.php?017,11004981

Pictures number 6 and 7 are dated pre 1984
https://www.bundesbahnzeit.de/seite.php?id=501

Picture 7 shows a DBBR 103 with Silberlinge in the periode of your timetable layer and on the same route
https://www.bundesbahnzeit.de/seite.php?id=561

This link shows the characteristics of the 112
https://www.bundesbahnzeit.de/seite.php?id=606

I think in the short term you should consider Altrot and TEE for the DBBR 218, the S-Bahn paint for the DBBR 111 for this layer to make a tad more realistic. Not sure how much the DBBR 110 and the cab control car from "Linke Rheinstrecke" different in the 1997 state from the 1980s, but in my opinion these vehicles should be added next, as should the basic m-Wagen (Am203, ABm225, Bm235, BDms273 and Dm). I understand it is work and requires to be paid for, but with this you'd have a solid foundation for future projects.

Perhaps it might be possible for you to get in touch with me, as I discovered something interesting, but don't want to share publicly as for now. I'd alos like to offer my help, if you have any questions in the future.

Kind regards.

 

If I might chime in: Please someon correct me if I'm wrong, but that already seems to be the case. Just not for the cab cars, since there simply isn't a replacement ingame (yet).
And subbing a mint service with cab car by a silver one without a cab is problematic as well, for obvious reasons. That's why I was under the impression that the timetable won't use any cab cars at all.

Absolutely. Or the 140, which is also cab car compatible and has seen widespread use with regional services
TSG probably already have got half a Hasenkasten on their hard drives and just don't wanna tell us yet

Same

Sun_King_135 Thanks for all the links, I could look at those pictures all day long

 

No problem AmityBlight , it's the same to me.

Forgot to mention in my conclusion, though, that albeit the DBBR 141 - which was the backbone for local regional services - is missing, it is not as neccessary for the moment since 110, 111 or even 103 with Silberlinge were not uncommon in the mid 1980s. But yes, basically the so called "Einheitslokomotiven" eg 110, 112, 113, 114, 139, 140, 141, 150 and 151 are sorely missed. But, we do have the 110 Bugelfalte, 112, 113, 114 with the 110 from Linke Rheinstrecke, so the gaps are closing.

I hope that the links will serve as an inspiration for the developer of the upcoming DBBR 194 pack to make the timetable layer more accurate. It is possible with what is already done. The 110, if not to different, could even be used within the Mittenwaldbahn.

Kind regards.

 

I'm fairly sure the timetable has to have cab cars for it to even be possible. I suspect due to how busy it is, having to shunt or runround or shunt release (whatever is requried) in and around the busy stations with an already crowded timetable simply isn't possible without the timetable self destructing. Koblenz and Mainz are borderline chaos enough as is!

 

Is it not possible to repaint the KaKo and 110 from Linke Rheinstrecke for the time being? The BDrnzf 740 in Linke Rheinstrecke has all visual aspects, the original had line foldable cargo doors, sliding windows etc.

Kind regards

 

Nothing is ever just a reskin. Whats worth doing is worth doing well, you start out with good intentions and then 3 months down the line having rebuilt the 110 and Kako nearly from scratch you are scarcley better off than if you'd just made a 141!

 

Did you check the links I shared earlier, DominusEdwardius ? Because there are a few images showing the 110 and 103 with Silberlinge in the 1980s. A wide variety is possible with your current loco asset. As mentioned, the 218 in altrot and TEE and the 111 with orange S-Bahn stripe. With this a repainted KaKo and 110 would not be an issue for a time being.

Kind regards.

 

Yeah, good argument. That's the point of cab cars after all, to cut down turnaround times.
Another solution would be having two locos, one at each end (sandwich), but the mint cab car is the better way to go
Makes it easier for some possible future release to sub into as well.

For some peculiar reason, this makes me even more excited for the new timetable. Koblenz and Mainz are way too static in the current one

Totally agreed... sometimes, people tend to forget just how much work is going into those "reskins" if they're being done properly and faithfully. Mittenwald's 111 is a good example.
If it were super quick and easy, everybody could (and would) do it.

 

Sorry for double post, but...

Gotta mention that in the mid 80's there was just a single 218 running around in TEE livery: 218 217. For a timetable like this, I'd say having a blue/beige 218 is absolutely sufficient. Indusi instead of PZB would be neat, but I can compromise. With PZB, the blue/beige 218 could be used well on more modern routes too

That happend, but very rarely and was usually only a last resort. The 103 is absolutely not built for this kind of services and got worn out quickly by the constant accelerating and braking. At least that's what a former depot mechanic who worked on them told me.

 

Okay, AmityBlight , but the Altrot was fairly widesüread back then. For the 218 as well as the 111 with Orange stripe, the "every resting is a new model" would not apply, as they have everything in common with their existing siblings
Yes, there were DBBR 111 orange with the destination board as known from S-Bahn Rhein Ruhr.

Here's a link:

https://www.eurorailhobbies.com//item_pics/piko/900_PK-51844.jpg

Secondly, the DBBR 103 was used pre-IC85 (which was when the largest IC network revamp took place) quite regularly for odd services, as they network of IC and TEE, EC was still quite new, was not as dense as it would be towards the late 1980s.

Answer number 3 is what I mean and what a 103 cab driver friend of mine from these days could confirm as well:

https://www.drehscheibe-online.de/foren/read.php?017,8688098,page=all

Kind regards

 

Well, until you realise that half the work you did backdating 111 to the earlier specification does not fully apply to the Orange stripe ones (111 111 onwards) which had door controls, display boards in some cases, different cab desk, different pantographs seem to be the norm, different buffers on some of the later ones, and probably many minor things besides. You'd also likely need to make some model tweaks to ensure the lines work cleanley and suddenly this simple reskin of the Mitt 111 spirals rapidly out of control!

 

I get that- but the Silberling coaches in Mittenwaldbahn are done well, inside and out, and are far more appropriate to 1984 than the mint ones with 90s interiors- even if they do have to be mated with mint cab cars.

 

And that applies even more emphatically to the E10.12s > 112s, of which there were only ever twelve and built for a very specialized purpose (Rheingold and Rheinpfeil services). And of course they wore TEE colors, not blue or ivory/ocean blue. If "normal" 110s were rare on local services, seeing one of the 160 km hotrods would be vanishingly small

 

I guess that's the exact reason for why there are so unproportionally many pictures of those services, as well as the 103/Silberling ones. It's because these were a rare occasion, so they were more "worthy" to be put on precious film

Sure, won't argue against that. Plus, the 218 is one of those locos which look good in almost every livery they ever had
But we shouldn't get too greedy here. We're already getting a load of treats, we can't just keep asking for more and more and more. Give it time.

DominusEdwardius A little question, something just came to my mind. I can recall that a long, long time ago, around the release of Mittenwald, someone (Lukas perhaps?) mentioned that the Mittenwald n-Wagen won't work well in conjunction with the other ones. I guess this issue has been resolved since then? Or do I remember wrong altogether?

 

Theres no major issues with them working together so to speak, there's an occasional weirdness with the gangways on the LFR ones which I ended up altering on the Mitt ones. The LFR ones also have some very unpleasant spongy coupler behaviour, driving the LFR N wagens from the cab car is a bit like driving an accordion. So the answer is yes they do work together, just not ideal pairings.

 

This made me laugh. I do love driving them but the rocking back and forth when starting off can be a bit jarring. I’ve never really looked to see what’s going on behind me. I’ll have a picture of an accordion in my head every time I drive it from now on.

 

Not the worst comparison, honestly
I already noticed they tend to get into this rocking-back-and-forth motion, especially on a rather steep acceleration curve, after leaving a station. The Bremen-Oldenburg ones do this too. With a 111 and its more measured acceleration at the rear, it's not as noticeable

 

Whats going on Have I missed something or is DTGs organisation getting worse?!
https://fixupx.com/trainsimworld/status/1935759579414986935

 

Thank you very much for the explanation and, especially your patience with me and my stupid questions, DominusEdwardius . I've learned a lot through the conversation with you.

I am left with two questions, the first of which arising today while playing a timetable with the 103:

1. Will the 103 get backdated for the 1984 schedules as is the case with the 218? I noticed the screen for the EBULA and the comm panel having been the newer ones in the 103 for the Rheintal.
2. How complex would it be to make an Altrot paint for the backdated ocean blue/white 218 coming with the E94 pack?

https://www.reisezugwagen.eu/wp-content/uploads/218-216-0-Regensburg-10.9.81.jpg

Once again your response is highly appreciated.

PS. Are there any plans for the VT08? I recently visited the one and only left VT08.8 and had a tour in it. Got some photos from the interior and had a talk with the lead guy who's intending to have it driveable again - but they're still looking for sponsors. Might it be an idea to do something similar like with E94? Quite a fascinating diesel unit.

Have a nice weekend altogether.

Kind regards

 

We have no plans on the 103 at present, the present 103 is a bit of a contradiction in eras anyway with an early Bundesbahn logo... in a Deutsche Bahn route, but having a very modernised cab. Any back dated would be a fairly considerable amount of work, not least due the prescence of LZB 100, not LZB 80.

I have no idea on the 218, that is Maiks project and under his remit. While we produce under the TSG brand, there are 3 seperate teams in effect. You can think of Maik and co as Team 1 with releases like the 218, G6, 420 and so on. Team 2 is us (Niddertalbahn, Mittenwaldbahn and E94 pack), and Team 3 is the Expert 101 group.

As far as our team is concerned until we are ready we won't be discussing future projects publically until its ready to try and mitigate any extended release windows as has happened in the past. The preservation scene across the world is full of many groups trying to preserve history so there are plenty to choose from!

 

So, why would you tweet that a preview is taking place today at 20h?! Am I missing something obvious?

 

Thanks for the extensive reply. Maybe, you could somehow forward the 218 Altrot suggestion to Mike, as he's a bit difficult to get hold on, which I understand considering the workload he has + private or family matters. If it is possible, it'd bring back memories from my childhood days (when I could watch the 218s in both liveries from my room window at Nuremberg Ost) and if not, I'll still be happy with what I have and what is to come.

Kind regards.

 

That's not true. I'm always here and reading. Just not answering much or at all, for reasons ^^

 

Super looking forward to this on Tuesday everything TSG release is pure gold

 

Dear Mike.

I didn't mean to harm anyone's feelings and especially not yours. I may have accidentally referred to another German forum.

I was trying to just enquire out of curiosity, as to the following:

1. The upcoming sixth series DBBR 420 would be suited very well for the upcoming 1984 timetables, which led me to my question if the older liveries for the 420 aren't considered per default?
2. Thank you for the outstanding DBBR 103. It's my absolute favourite loco and I simply love to drive her. I did however, and after some replies above, wonder if this loco is due sometime for backdating. And if, is the version without Schurze, metal DB logo and Pufferbohlenverkleidung somehow considered, too? To explain why this question came up: the backdate of the 218 arose this question.
3. Are there any plans for the m-Wagen (eg. Bm235)?
4. Are other liveries and mods in the pipeline for the existing locos (110, 111, 218 etc)? When I was young my room window faced Nuremberg Ostbahnhof and as such I always saw the V160 family running by my window. Most of the time it was the 218 in Altrot, as well as the 360 in red with the two thin gold stripes. I remember reading and hearing, that the Altrot 218 was more common than the Ozeanblau Beige. How much effort would it hypothetically take to give the 218 in the E94 pack the Altrot paint? You would bring back many memories on my childhood days in the 1980s.

I have to thank you from the deepest of my heart for all you've done for thr virtual rail community since thr days of German Railroads. I had many, if not all (Collection), of the products and truly enjoyed them.

Finally, dear DominusEdwardius , I am sorry, but I have to disagree on what you stated towards thr Diesel MU VT08 series. Yes, there are certainly many projects out there that would be happy to receive any sort of support. While I agree on that point with you, I contradict with the VT08 series. It was the one unit that, besides the E10, V200 and VT11.5, was symbolic for the "Wirtschaftswunder" in post WWII Germany and was on many billboards or ads of that time. The preserved one in Franconia, happens to be the very one former US president John F. Kennedy used during his trip to Germany back in 1963. It still has the original interior, except for the dining table and would deserve to be resembled in Train Sim. Besides the VT08.5 was the DMU that picked up the German national soccer team in Bern in 1954 after they won the World Cup.

Let me add, that I am not demanding or wanting anything impossible, I am just taking the chance to ask you guys. If it can be done, perfect, if not, the sun will rise nevertheless. I'm very thankful for what you do and your patience.

Kind regards.

 

In relation to the combinations of liveries, at the end of below video you can see a Br 218 in ocean blue ivory, pulling some silberling and a a cab car in mint green.

 

Oh, certainly there are all sorts of examples of piebald trains, well into this century. The problem in this case is that in 1984, mint green and Orient red simply didn't exist at all! DBB began that color transition in 1987.

 

I have only Linke Rheinstrecke for now, can i use this pack whitout Mittenwaldbahn?

 

Yes but makes no sense

 

Mittenwaldbahn provides the BR 111 in blue/beige and the silver N-wagons for associated timetable runs on the LFR. In addition, the Eurofima wagons for the 1984 timetable layer in the old red/beige IC design are also available for the BR 103. Without the DLC, there is less traffic on the route.

If you have HBK installed, you also get the BR 218 in blue/beige for the 1984 timetable.

The most important one is the E94, which comes in two German versions: a former ÖBB import and an original DRG version with three front windows. The E94 will also be available on other German routes as a railtour layer, but initially only for the Pfälzische Ludwigsbahn. There is also a West German rebuilt wagon type and a boxcar included. Also included are the RSN coal wagons as a reissue from the 80s.

 

During my youth in the early 90's (oh do I feel old now), this was commonplace on my home route. 218 in blue/beige or orient red, with steel or mint n-Wagen mixed together, as well as the occasional blue/beige m-Wagen thrown into the mix.
And lots of 628... 628.2 mostly, but also 628.1 and 628.0, as well as the cute little 627.1
Ah, now I'm on memory lane... all your fault

Can't wait for tomorrow!

 

As I’ve mentioned previously I have several memories of long distance journeys across Europe sat (very) upright in old Bm232 compartment coaches. Quite why DB and their partners in adjoining countries thought these were adequate with hard half back plastic seats I could never guess. Hook Of Holland to Copenhagen or Stockholm to Hamburg was a long time sat in one of those.

 

For the German Community Matin_TSP is live tonight (with DTG Lukas?) in the first preview for this pack. It starts 5pm BST and its a German only stream. Later tonight DTG will be Live as well 7pm BST.

https://www.youtube.com/live/pLkLWi9r33k?si=Jk1srzlsQoBxZGfB

 

No, as Lukas is on duty at the DTG Stream. But he'll be there for a German preview stream either tomorrow or the day after tomorrow.

 

Matin_TSP Okay so your'e alone then? Or do you mean no steam at all tonight?

 

jesper2805
Tonight, I will be alone. Or let's say: no developer is going to join me.
Tomorrow or wednesday there will be another stream, then hopefully with Lukas

 

No 218 available on any Preview Timetable
They missed this loco