Alan Thompson Simulation Route Discussion/speculation Thread

The amount of care and attention to detail by ATS really shows on this route and for their first TSW project they’ve really knocked it out of the park.

I hope they consider one day extending to Crewe which is five stops after Alderley Edge, it would be a complete route then.

Either way, Day one purchase from me.

 

It’s ATSs first route so sensible to choose Alderley Edge. I am sure it will be extended eventually.

 

Nothing prevented Johannes from doing an extension to Richmond, these can't do 4 unfortunate stations to Crewe - I can't understand it at all//

 

Yeah it’s a little annoying as they were so close to the route being complete. Let’s hope they reconsider.
As you said Johannes (another first time 3rd party route builder) took notice. Any new projects he has going forward will earn him a huge amount of trust and respect. That’s hard to come by or get back when you burn bridges (Rivet).

 

On this route are 323s 3 car or 5 car variant.

 

I wasn’t enthusiastic at first because of the reused Class 323 and it’s not reaching Crewe but to be honest, it’s Alan’s first route ever for TSW. We won’t expect long routes for their first time.

Judging from the pictures, it looks well detailed and modeled, it changed my mind and I will get it day one, the price is reasonable.

A bit sad we don’t have the discount on consoles but still the route looks well done. Can’t wait to see other projects made by him.

 

As l said, I am sure it will be extended eventually. This route as it is now is head and shoulders ahead of anything Rivet have produced. Unlike Rivet l am sure ATS will listen to the TSW community!

 

And how many of the people that were getting sharp sticks and going to boycott this route because of the development drama it had will end up buying it I wonder, also see the same people still obsessively having attempts to knife Rivet because apparently the people of Cornwall are disgusted and appalled.......

 

The route looked great, but for me I don't like the 323, we already have identical gameplay in Glossop and Birmingham Cross City. If there's enough meat on the bones using other stock then I'll pick up the route.

On the preview stream the yards passed were pretty much devoid of static stock. Hopefully that was a time of the day thing.

 

Too many broken bridges, too much trust broken, too many broken promises, unprofessional comments from rivet employees on here and Rivet forums to it’s customers, no after-care on their older routes (left to rot). Rivet don’t listen to their customers…

I think the pitchforks constantly aimed at Rivet is justified.

 

I noticed that too along with no passing trains (though I only watched MAN-MIA), I suspect that maybe for the stream they loaded a version that didn't have much else in there by way of other trains (although Piccadilly had trains).

 

I watched the first part of the stream ( cut out early, annoyed by the constant ads ).

It's obvious that a lot of TLC has gone into the route building, it looks very good. The 323 is, however not very interesting, in fact I found it less fun than on BCC.

However, it's a rather straight, flat, repetitive commuter run, which I'm just so tired of any more. Just not my thing. Each station looks like the last one and the next one. And Piccadilly looks so very empty, even though it's well built. Surprising, given the reaction to that station in Glossop. And where in the world is the AI? I don't remember seeing but one passing train.

They said this wasn't quite the release build, but I don't think any enhancements for release will persuade me to get this route except in a deep sale and maybe not even then.

Players who like this kind of bus stop route will no doubt enjoy it and they should. It's just not for me.

I'm beginning to despair as to when I'll next find something in TSW I can buy with confidence In which I'll find much replay value.

 

You say it like WCL is the only bad thing Rivet have ever done, what a joke. Rivet have this bad of a reputation for a reason, one single terrible route wont do that.

 

Just hope this route does suffer the blurriness and micro freezing.

 

With you on that. I just know I’d drive it a couple of times on each possible route then, like BCC, Glossop and Goblin before it chuck it to one side. I know the introductory price is a generous discount (though a couple of years ago a short route such as this without a new train would have been £20 anyway). And unlike NLL (which I still haven’t bought) there is no ongoing commitment to extend it the decent length down to Crewe.

One for a deep sale, hasten to add no slur on the route builders or ATS but it was a poor choice for a first attempt. So many more interesting prototypes they could have picked using existing stock if they don’t have a train builder on staff, which could have given distance and something more than electric bus stop running.

 

They did say, if I recall correctly, that this wasn't their first choice, but, intriguingly, wouldn't reveal what was.

 

‘Only five stops’, but consider the size and scale of Crewe - not only is it a huge station but there is untold amounts of track and signalling for all the yards surrounding it.
It would be a hell of an undertaking.

 

No doubt. Crewe and the areas around sandbach are by far the most challenging areas to model. Alderley Edge to Sandbach is mostly all countryside though so the bulk of the time would be modelling Crewe.

 

Well, DTG tried to build Crewe for SOS,, but it was an empty shell, as are most large mainline and terminal stations in TSW.

And judging by the vacant look of Manchester Piccadilly in this DLC, Crewe might have been about the same.

Building such huge stations is one thing. Making them realistically busy is quite another. Something that seems beyond the ability of DTG to accomplish, let alone a small third party dev.

 

All 323s are 3-car. There is no 5-car variant.

 

Thanks mate must of seen two 3 coupled together.

 

But to do all that work as a free update would be madness. And we already know that paid extensions are not going to happen

 

Well if you want to get on the good side of the consumer that is the way to go about it. Johannes is doing a free update on his first TSW route, he could’ve asked to be paid for his extra work.

 

Google AI's response to 323s is that apparently they were designed as 6-car sets, news to me and it didn't cite proper sources so clearly was thinking of 2x 3 car sets together.

As for Crewe looking so empty in SoS, well that's just because they were lacking in period appropriate stuff to layer in. To be fair a modern day Crewe would actually be very busy in terms of TSW rolling stock, 150/153/158,323,350,390 as well as 66s (and possibly since it is a 2018 timetable - 20/37/86s on freight) - without even factoring in LSL "charter stock".

The issue of the complexity of the station and trackwork is what stopped them going there, hopefully they will reconsider at some point and patch it in. Heck I wish they would add Oxford Road since Northern use that for their crew changes on most services so is actually a logical start/end point but ironically there is more chance of them adding Crewe...

 

Really liking what i've seen so far from this route, of course i get the demand for wanting the route to end at Crewe, but for me because there's still the opportunity to drive the Class 390 between Wilmslow and Piccadilly that gives a nice semi-express option.

One question i have since the stream, are the Class 158 EMT services between Piccadilly and Stockport (representing Liverpool-Norwich services) only present on the Sunday timetable, or are they also present on the main weekday timetable?

i only noticed them on the Sunday option, with the Scotrail Class 158 only showing on the weekday version. It would be nice to drive the non-stop Class 158 EMT services between Piccadilly and Stockport on the main weekday timetable when the route is at it's busiest.. but other than that i'm loving what i'm seeing, and i'd really love ATS to move into developing more routes for TSW, they're a welcome addition to the game and would love to know what they have planned once this is released!

 

Watched the first part of the stream which I missed earlier, looks incredible, so much detail, breaking new ground for TSW.
One small point I noticed, I think they forgot to add some sort of approach control going towards the airport from the mainline towards Mauldeth Rd - 75 to 45mph, all green signals. If this is correct in real life then no probs, but probably should be flashing yellows? (Edit....just watched Don Coffey's vid, it's correct in the route, all greens for this turnout, apologies!)

Overall, epic route building, day 1 purchase without doubt.

edit - another junction down the line before you peel off into the airport doesn't seem to have app control ,75 to 40 mph all greens - Could be an old build?
Just watching this vid, has flashing yellows for this junction

 

To answer a few queries about routes/indications:

From Piccadilly at Slade Lane Junction. No flashing yellows.

UF to US for Levenshulme: Approach control to MP35 (No. 1 feather needed)
UF to UF: Can be greens through at 75
UF to Up Styal for Mauldeth Rd: No.4 needed at MP38 at Longsight South Junction to cross over to MP33 where another No. 4 is needed.
US to US, UF or Up Styal: No.1, No junction indication, or No. 4 respectively. Can be greens straight through.

Single flashing yellow before Heald Green on Up Styal for route to the Airport.

Double flashing yellow on Down Styal before Styal for the airport.

Double flashing yellow at Alderley Edge for route onto Down Styal.

 

I drive this route IRL and having had a quick look at the stream the route looks very impressive and a great representation. A big step up compared to Glossop which is the only other route I have reference to.

Will definitely be picking up on release and can take a good look around at my own pace.

 

Yep, I think this isn't currently implemented in the build shown, maybe it is in the newer builds? That aside, can't wait for this route.
Thanks for your route knowledge, always good to have real drivers on here.

 

I'd be interested to know if ATS will be continuing to produce route for TSW, as the quality looks phenomenal... But given some of the challenges they faced, could they confirm if this will be there 'entry level' route, or are there plans for future content? Or is this going to be standalone content and back to focusing on TSC?

 

They did mention on the stream that more routes and trains are planned but i'm guessing that will depend on how successful this route is.

 

Not going to happen I know as their focus appears to be modern Network Rail infrastructure but given they are Manchester based, would be in pole position to do the East Lancs Railway.

 

It's strange, but it seems that they said that this would be their first and last route for TSW (in early spring there was a hype with problems within the office in terms of a very difficult development of this route). Correct me if I'm wrong.

 

Do you recall where they said that?

 

Well there was a bit of dirty washing aired in public by one of the people who initially worked on the route. Not sure at this point which thread it was in or, of course, may have been quietly sanitised. Plenty of discussion around that time. As regards ATS not doing another one for TSW, well the bearded one appears to have ruled out extending the Airport route to Crewe but not sure where that leaves them doing another one. Guess it all depends on sales and/or what sort of team they have for any follow up projects, including maybe actually adding a new train next time.

 

I got the impression from the stream that this was a long ( 2 year ) and arduous project and that it was a steep learning curve. If they do build something else for TSW, it won't be next week.

But I will say that, though this kind of route is not my cup of tea, the hard work does show in the build quality, though if they had needed to make one or two new locos, it might have been more than they could chew. At least that's the message I also got from the lads on the stream.

The length of dev time and the route quality made me think of Sand Patch, which also took a couple of years. A very different project and a taller order, as it were, but there's certainly a connection between dev time and route quality.?

Obviously, DTG doesn't have the luxury of that kind of time these days, but the guys and gals who worked on the SPG project set a paradigm that is still not bettered in my opinion.

 

I´m sure they said on the stream that they will be doing another TSW route, if it sells well...

 

They’re not daft, this route will make tenfold what any TsC route makes I’m sure and the costs were higher to develop. They’ll surely make another route or some DLC..

 

I only hope the class 90 :E

 

I've never heard ATS say that.

Alan has been open about the route being the team/s first venture into TSW and building with UE. They've learnt along the way, as you do, what to do right and what you can do wrong. The route went for testing some 4 months ago, and ATS needed to correct some issues, that arose as part of the learning curve. Alan doesn't need to love playing TSW to see where, as a businessman there is potential to make money. If the route is financially successful I am sure further ATS DLC will follow, in time. If not TSC has, and continues to be successful for ATS.

 

I can see this selling very well as a lot of customer base prefers modern over vintage railway. Another route featuring a huge terminus like Manchester Piccadilly is big selling point.

 

I've a feeling that it will be, just by watching the stream - the quality, level of detail and playability (even with the low-ish route mileage) of the route looks like a new era in UK route building is here. Can't wait. Hopefully they will continue route building for TSW.

 

I‘m curious about the former spur near the airport you mentioned. Is it the same one that’s being talked about in this railway forum thread? If so, it was seemingly removed last decade and there’s a parking lot there now, so it’s interesting that it’s still visible in the route.

 

Yes that is the same one, it was a branch coming off and running around Runway 24R and down to the construction site for 24L, after work was completed it was filled in and Jet Parks 3 was built on top. There is however just a visible trace that there used to be a branch there as the embankment changes shape and is regularly used to store pallets, bits of track and other stuff as the cutting is wider there. It's sort of a blink and you'll miss it thing

It's at 22:22 of this drivers eye video.

 

Hopefully tomorrows sale brings a decent discount for Cardiff, for layer purposes..

 

Said it before but I really love the fact there is 2 timetables a weekday and weekend one. That’s really good.

 

I think thats great as well should have done that with a lot of the other routes.

 

100% as they are different to the weekday ones and adds that realism and playability and means more services to complete

 

You may have to wait until Xmas to get a decent discount. I feel it will only be a 20-25% discount this summer.

 

I think so too, but better than nothing I guess!