Yeah it won’t be DTG who decide to stop the TSW 7,8,9 etc. At some point the store fronts are going to turn around & say “no you can’t re-release have a terabyte of DLC every year”. I get there’s value in having the marketing circus, but it’s not like the 4 storefronts don’t have systems in place to promote DLC’s & title updates. Every year something major goes wrong, this year it’s Epic users getting the shaft & the ‘curated content’ is a slap in the face, layers are a massive thing & never mind the fact that the most recent releases won’t be ported over. Personally if I was an Epic user I’d be out. Like you I don’t need to worry about download times, but there’s still issues with PS5, last year a few DLC’s never got the TSW5 icon, instead showing they were TSW4 packs, so you basically had to download multiple versions & then delete them after you identified which were which. It’s not entirely surprising they’re persistent with this system though, it aligns with their general philosophy of not dealing with issues until they completely breakdown. In all honesty though, we should all be concerned about what happens when the potential value of new customers, overtakes the value of the existing.
Well, the majority of gamedevs in the market manage to be profitable without having to engage the "new game" algorithms in the store fronts with the same game each year. I don't think, this is a valid argument anymore, especially considering what a major nuisance the whole process is for everyone else. And the "new features" are nice, but their novelty-level is kind of comparable to regular content patches in other games and don't justify a complete new release imo. Maybe the time invested every year in facilitating the re-release would be better used on improving the game itself, which can also motivate more ppl to buy in (or keep staying).
The one thing I’ve noticed to be fair is we’re seeing more well known & widely used trains & ToCs as headliner routes. Go back to TSW2020 for example with Caltrain, BR 45’s & DB IR on the games main image. Now it’s been things like LNER, AWC, GWR, ICE’s etc. The latter are likely way more relatable to non train sim customers & are more likely to at least look into the game in comparison to the more ‘unique’ offerings such as SD40’s & BR stock from older titles. Still, there’s a way for them to get that publicity out there without making their current users suffer this migration which has a 50/50 chance of breaking something significant for at least one of the 4 user bases.
Also don’t forget the cynical view that a new version of the game with “updated” DLC, nukes all previous reviews of the content on Steam at least - good or bad. And very few people will go back through the previous editions of the game to search for archive reviews, if still available once the core game comes out of the listings.
Your view seems correct as according to the TSW6 Steam Store page, all previous DLC has been re-labeled as TSW6 DLC. Re-cooked perhaps? No doubt with all bugs, previously unfulfilled promises and marketing hoax included. The complete TSW6 collection of base game with all 128 current DLC will cost you about € 3000.
One hundred percent. It definitely got me back into the game and resulted in me spending money on a fair bit of DLC in the end, whereas I didn't bother with TSW3 and 4 as it had that financial barrier which made me turn to TSC during those years lol.
I tried this method once and was very surprised when it didn't work. DTGs essentially store a bunch of duplicated data with minimal technical changes. How many more times do they need to reissue TSW so they have to rent a data center to store DLC?
DTG has said that they have to recook all the DLC for the new releases. I'm sure that the hassle of doing that and then testing, etc. is much greater than us having to simply download them, and that they'd like an easier solution if one offered itself.
Correct and after all is said and done they have to run it like a business,it's not excusing them for some of their practices but at the end of the day it's a fact
for many years what today is known as TSC did go through annual updates. The core update was free but if you wanted the new routes that took advantage of the new core features you had to purchase the bundle for a decent discount or the individual routes at standard price. It was only when they stopped doing core updates and renamed it to Train Simulator Classic did the annual updates cease. Of course, you didn’t have to redownload your DLC, but many times the updates dud break older content. .
This exact business practice is likely why Epic is saying enough is enough. I don't have inside information, but it seems logical. DTG puts tons of pressure on these content distributors (Steam, Epic, etc.). It was only a matter of time for one of them to crack.
I have no problem with the annual release. I like the free option, and I like the idea of the special editions with some content (but they seem to be very expensive this year).
This yearly Release is stupid, it brake so many Things or make Mods inkompatibel as well. Stay with one version like TSC and make a core Update plus a Bundle only
I know a lot of folks here arent 'gamers' so may not know, but its usual business model to do this, from FIFA to Farm Simulator and so on. Not a big fan of it myself, but I can see why they do this. The update is free, you get to bring all your old DLC too. This is in contrast to business models like Stellaris, Project Zomboid and Sprocket who have kept the original release but do constant updates, both big and small, which annoys the user base as it often just wrecks saves games and folks generally get bored of it. Having an annual release enables a media campaign to keep the game visible online via influencers etc. Which helps attract new players and ultimately new cash so that projects can be worked on. This is in sharp contrast to games like Kerbal Space Programme which didnt do incremental changes, but stopped development of KSP 1 and then tried to make a big leap with KSP2. It failed, it was too ambitious and collapsed the studio. That franchise is dead. For a non AAA game studio it seems this is the safest business model to ensure their survival on continual development.
I wonder how this version would have got on? TSW5 "Improved"? No new routes. New locomotive and new rolling stock only. (At least one loco for UK, DE and USA + Plus 2 items of rolling stock for each country). GWE route Update to TSW5 standards. 1 x existing European and USA routes to be Updated to TSW5 standards. Route Editor to be finished so that Community Projects can start to be released. Multiple Save slots created. Scenario Editor to be brought up to standard. (Multiple Paths / Multiple Formations). Increased layers on Livery Designer + All items of rolling stock to be made available to Livery Designer. (Any items of rolling stock that cannot be updated to Livery Designer to have an extra DTG Livery created for it.....ie Class 31). Preservation Team brought back to fix bugs ('paid' for by no need to develop new routes for a year). Personally I would pay £40-£50 for this. TBH sorting out the Editor, and allowing Community projects to flourish, would be worth £50 on it's own as that would be a real game changer.
My own strategy is to download the core game and new content first, then when that's installed, I'll play TSW6 while the rest of my DLC downloads. A full install for me takes around 18 hours because my internet isn't amazing, plus I own all available DLC for TSW. Did the same with TSW5 when that came out, worked pretty well!
My days off start the same day TSW releases, so I'm going to get home, install everything, and by the time afternoon rolls by, done. Annual downloads aren't as big a hassle as they're made out to be, as long as you plan when to do them.
Suppose it comes down to an individual's situation, we've all got different install sizes and internet speeds. The annual release thing doesn't really bother me, I don't use mods so nothing to break there and the redownloading of content is just a minor irritation. I do think it would've been helpful if DTG allowed us to preinstall all of our DLC a few days before the Early Access period, then we'd all have our content ready to play when EA starts.
If you prefer mods then maybe TSC is better suited. TSW is geared towards the off the shelf user console as well as basic pc users.
That's got to be one of the most inaccurate statements ever made on this forum. Mods only exist because DTG didn't do their job properly. There is nothing wrong with playing TSW on a vanilla installation. However, if you would prefer to see sidings full up, lots of AI traffic, extra station platforms in use, new areas of a route opened up, improved lighting, improved scenario creating, improved scenery and bugs resolved then mods are essential. Why would anyone not want that? (And "Yes" I would want all of that for Console Players too). Wouldn't you like to try something like this? (Modded scenario on TVL created using the just in-game tools but with formation & extra path mods added). It's only DTG that is stopping you from doing so.
The majority of players using TSW probably do not have any mods (certainly the console players) therefore having the platform change one a year to add extra functionality benefits the majority. If you like to tweak your code then TSC is a much better platform. I own 95% TSW DLC and pretty much all commercially available TSC DLC. If I want to fine tune stuff TSC is the better way to go!
I really don’t understand why they just don’t brand it as Train Sim World, drop the rubbish with the number at the end and just update the core every year. It’s pointless relaunching a new edition as they seldom fix the bugs relating to the previous version. They carry them over. At least by losing the number we know the bugs benchmark.
This annual merry go round may not be a problem for those with fast, reliable Internet, but it's an imposition on all of us. We shouldn't have to go through this nonsense when all we gain are 3 new routes which could simply be dlc and some new " features " which could simply be patched in to the existing core. Have all the PR and hoopla, bells and whistles you want to attract new players, while the rest of us live and play in peace.
Agree with the last few posts above. A version change should be reserved for a major change to the core game, moving to UE5 or even a new custom game engine not just a few bells and whistles adding a bit more fluff but nothing ground breaking fundamental. Announcements are nice as are random delays and TSR’s, but they are hardly a new direction or sweeping change to the overall setup.
Mr Vern how do you know? Putting in the random events could constitute to a radical change to the code. The functionality will not be backwards compatible. It is easy to be an armchair critic. DTG have decided that the new functions being added are significant to warrant a new release.
You don’t always get to bring all your DLC though, or bring the DLC as it was originally designed. Moving to TSW 6 causes the loss of the Caltrain branding in the Peninsular Corridor DLC and many on the Epic platform are going to be unable to bring across most of their DLC.
The actual redownloading of DLC isn’t a problem for me, I have a 1+ Gbps connection with Virgin Media so my entire collection will maybe take an hour to install. That’s not what irks me about a yearly release. I do feel for those who have limited data or slow connections though.
I agree it’s a grey area. As a comparison to Flight Sim, I guess FS2004 wasn’t radically different from FS2002 but then FSX definitely moved forward from FS2004. Then given the wait for MSFS 2020 no one can deny that is an all new version on all new code.
Same here. For me, it's the fact that each new version doesn't copy over settings from the previous (unlike, say, FIFA), and that my selection of mods may or may not work straightaway. Whether you think TSW is meant to be modded or not, there's a community of modders whose work I'm very grateful for, as they massively improve my PC-playing experience. My early access for TSW5 was frankly meaningless, as it took that time (and beyond) to get my setup comparable with TSW4, coupled with WCMLS being so bad on release.
that still doesnt means they should make annual releases. make updates and sell DLCs. Thats all they need to do.
DTG sell a product. We have a choice, buy/don't buy. There is really not a lot of competition in the market. We can certainly complain here on the forum, however, we do not know the reason(s) for choices being made whether they are technical or commercial. It is what it is. The fact that they have listened to ideas and have implemented into TSW we should celebrate. Is everything perfect, no. Is it an improvement, most likely. I personally am happy that changes are happening and that DTG are still investing in the product (unlike TSC). I still get my daily train driving and am thankful for what I do have. Respectfully.
I think, people critcizing and pointing out things they see as problematic is a good thing, as it shows they care about this game and want it to have a good future. If they stopped caring they'd just walk away. Criticism is essential for potential improvement. Label it as "whining", "hating" ect all you like, idgaf.
Given it copies your achievements and Journey etc. completion over, I can’t understand why there’s not a sub routine that does the same for your settings. Means before the big day, I need to trawl through and write them all down then transcribe into the new version. This is now the umpteenth DTG have put us through this rigmarole and they probably already decided on Day 1 of TSW5 it would be TSW6 this year. That's 12 months they had to task "Engineering" with finding a solution to all these version update issues. But instead they focused on the fluff.
Criticism (good or bad) is what forums are for. TSW 6 is baked in. It WILL require a full update. If you don't like it don't purchase it and keep with TSW5. Glad to see your use of suppressed expletives. Respectfully
DTG could easily just keep the same version and update, it would be less work for them and less hassle for us. But there has to be a reason why they put themselves and us through this rigmarole every year and I suspect if they didn’t it would have a serious detriment on revenue which at best case would mean less investment in development and worst case no development in the core at all or even the end of TSW.
For all we know it may be a mechanism to prevent piracy. They have a reason and it sounds like the community would like to know what is forcing this methodology. That being said it is what it is.
Highly doubtful. The Denuvo protection may be a hindrance to pirates, but not the regular version change. The trackers will just have a new version of the game with all the add-ons.
What I meant was during the process of upgrading to TSW6 some validation may occur in the background for each DLC etc.
So where is the protection against pirates? Pirated versions of games are games downloaded via Steam or Epic to which a "cure" has been applied so that the game thinks that it is launched via Steam or Epic. No differences from the licensed version. All "protection" from pirates comes down to the fact that the creator of the pirated version must spend time downloading the core of the game and add-ons from Steam and make a "cure" for the new version of the game, which, given the absence of Denuvo, may take less time than the download itself.At most, it will take a couple of days before a pirated version of the game appears. The version with an annual release supposedly against pirates does not stand up to any criticism.
none of this makes any sense from the perspective of piracy prevention, given that they removed denuvo from TSW4 and in the case of TSW5, denuvo wasn't even included in the game (and I don't think it will be in TSW6 either) and given the fact that denuvo was never implemented for dlcs, nothing you wrote makes sense or justifies a yearly release In the end, it's all about marketing and nothing more
I completely agree. The way they advertise re-releases is just a bluff. If the game is being ported to a new engine revision (and even then, not all developers re-release their games; excellent examples are Hunt: Showdown, Squad, Counter-Strike 2, and DotA 2, which remain the same games after major updates), then it may be justified. But DTG is releasing a new part where 80% of the features are only available on new routes, so it's not a “feature” of the game, but a “feature” of the routes themselves. Sorry, but that's just ridiculous. They're adding features, 80% of which only work on new routes. So why re-release TSW if these features are only available on these new routes? It's a feature of the routes, but certainly not of the core game. The novelty of a game is determined not by numbers, but by content and features. In the case of TSW 6, most of the new features are not contained in the “core,” but in the routes. And this is indeed a terrible problem for Epic players. In the case of licenses, the “old” version would remain available to those who purchased the route and locomotives, and no one would revoke it. And instead of the “old” DTG, they could sell a “gray” version without licensing, names, or logos. That would be the best solution. I don't want to sound toxic, but marketers like this would be better off selling yogurt and ice cream in “seasonal” packaging, but definitely not games. From my perspective as a player, it would be “cheaper” and smarter for DTG to listen to the community rather than this “team” of marketers.
DTG have previously claimed the merger with Focus has not changed their operating policies. Um, ahem, yeah… That said, Focus are not pushing a new version of Snowrunner each year, their emphasis is on adding new maps and other content via a Season Pass if you prefer (or individually if not). They also launched the spin off Expeditions and Roadcfart (that should read Roadcraft!) games.
Let's ask Snowrunner fans who are waiting for SR 2 and bought the 5-year pass? Focus doesn't have a single "conveyor" game; they release season passes, just like many other publishers.
