All Aboard Studios Route- Crewe To Birmingham New Street.

Interesting thing that's semi-off topic but rather relevant to this whole price thing I feel, so there's been a big Pokemon leak, mainly on multiple projects in the works. However, development budgets also leaked, and it actually shows how insane the gap between what they need and what they get actually is.

The next Pokemon title due out this month had a 2 billion yen development budget, which in a unit more of us are familiar with is only $13 million. For a massive AAA franchise that is tiny, if they only sold those games for $40 with a million units of sales, they'd still be almost triple in the black... And mind you this is for a series currently selling at $60 to $70, while also selling well over ten times the amount of units, even during a "bad" year.

Granted, I doubt that is counting marketing costs, which for something like this is probably insane to be fair. And Japan for various reasons can pay comparably less money than a place like the US can for equivalent development. But even still, I think it's fair to say that they could price their games for way less given the ten's of millions it sells.

Just to bring up another random example that's of a smaller company and perhaps a bit more relevant to the forum's interests. I don't think Bachmann needs to sell their two decade old HO model of Thomas for over $100 when it launched back in the day only for $30. And mind you even adjusted for inflation would only be about $60, and they would've actually need to do things like pay off the new tooling costs, which almost certainly isn't something they'd have to do now.

Heck, on the flip-side the new Motorized Thomas that Mattel's doing is in the $10 to $20ish range depending on what you're buying exactly. This actually kind of surprised my mother when I was informing her about it, as that was in the same ballpark as what the old Tomy ones cost. Or going off more recent stuff, if you look at the simple looking AEG models versus these new ones it's insane to see they're being done for the same pricing. Add to it how much Thomas has fallen in popularity the past 10 years, and how much 20 years of inflation have added in cost that's actually kind of crazy.

I've been loving them as a collector, but I wouldn't hesitate buying these for a kid. They have their faults, mainly the iffy printing and the lack of freewheeling the old Tomy ones did. But IMO they're a masterclass in showing what you can do if you actually give a damn about not raising prices for the masses. Wish more companies would actually take notes here!

I guess moral I'm trying to get at here with post is be very skeptical of price increase lot of this stuff is priced with a lot of leeway. They don't often "need" to price this stuff the way that they actually do. And frankly between better development tools, potential increase in player base over TSC due to consoles and the general increase in gaming popularity in the past ten years. And finally us not knowing how much margin DTG actually did have back in the day when they initially set their $40 standard, it's hard to say that it's "needed". And I'm far more inclined to distrust companies and assume they're being greedy, even smaller ones.

(Wow, this was so much longer than I expected, admittedly would've been a lot shorter if the Thomas stuff hadn't came to my head midway though)

 

Agree with you Mich . The other point about entertainment and software is that pricing does not automatically follow inflation. I can walk into HMV and pay the same price for a movie on Blu-ray (£15) or 4K (£25) as I paid over 10 years ago. They know if they started to put a 4K disc up over (say) £30, unless a special edition, steel book or similar, people simply won’t bother. They will wait for a sale or buy the cheaper Blu-ray or DVD instead and take the slight hit on picture quality.

As said previously, DTG are not short of a Bob or two. They can afford to retain a fairly sizeable marketing and PR department which is being paid for out of our purchases.

Anyhow as the £30 is probably set in stone and neither DTG or All Aboard want to lose face by relenting and lowering the price, at least consider sweetening with a 10% pre purchase discount to bring those of us on the fence down on your side.

 

You're on Playstation 5 if i remember correctly?

Worst case scenario is waiting a couple of months for a discount, or maybe the Steam or Playstation Christmas sale. Look on the bright side, at least you're not on XBOX or you'd be waiting a lifetime for DLC to go on sale.

In the meantime, there is always JT's Preston - Crewe to keep an eye on, gives you time to see how Birmingham - Crerwe goes with regards to any day 1 bugs and update patches.

 

PC so secure in the knowledge by Easter next year this route will be at least 40% in the Spring Steam sale.

My PS5 collection is only very minimal, mostly older stuff.i

And yes, keeping an eye on the JT route which, even if similarly priced, does tick my era box so more likely to relent and get that one (subject to streams and the core still, though).

 

Regarding the AAS deep dive on this. I might be getting the wrong end of the stick, but they mention lots of services stopping at Galton Bridge, but don't mention as many stopping at Sandwell & Dudley? Both now and historically, its about the same at both. Sand&Dud have always had the 390s stopping there and also have TfW services stop there too. This isn't reflected in the info provided? It says the TfW stop at Galton Bridge for example? Unless they did in 2019, that seems odd to me

 

I am sure some years ago TFW/ATW services called at Galton Bridge and not Sandwell and Dudley.

Certainly no Avanti or Cross Country services call at Galton Bridge.

 

Thank you for this. Must just be a gap in my timeline. Probably Covid times and not taking many trains. If it's accurate to 2019 then no grumbles here. Hopefully the 390 does call at Sand&Dud and it just wasn't mentioned

 

I would hope so too as I can recall them stopping there going back to Virgin days.

 

Ultimately it boils down to what economists call price elasticity of demand, i.e. The sensitivity of consumers to price changes. This is influenced by many factors but a particularly key one for many markets is the extent to which consumers perceive there is a viable substitute when one company increases it's price.

The children's toy market is very competitive with parents seeing a lot of options so an appropriate price point is needed especially when there is a strong income effect going on as well (parents only have a limited sum to spend on fun for their kids after their own living expenses). However, this can be overcome when there is very strong loyalty to a particular brand or you have a product where consumers are very particular about things like authenticity (both would apply for things like Pokémon or collecting model railways, or with something like Roblox). In that instance there is no substitute for the consumer. So the companies concerned can continue to raise prices because demand is 'inelastic', i.e. The proportionate fall in demand is less than the proportionate rise in price meaning that revenue and (assuming costs stay the same) profit increases.

I think for a lot of entertainment products, firms have realised that demand is way more inelastic than they previously realised if you have a brand that has a very loyal following. Not great for the consumer but hopefully the creators are getting a decent cut. But as I mentioned before TSW is still comparatively cheap compared to a growing number hobbies in a similar genre.

 

I am sorry why are we whining about the price? The price is actually less than the 32.99£/39.99€/$45.99 that I expected (like WCMLOS, Zwolle-Groningen and Mittenwaldbahn). I think its not a bad price at all. Altough yes Im speaking within TSW pricing. It's a good price for TSW standards.

 

WCMLoS gave us the Class 87 and Mark Three stock and over 90 miles of route.
Zwolle gave us a new country and two new trains.
Mittenwald gave us the Krokodil and Silberlinge coaches.

All three well worth the premium price, well maybe not so much the Dutch route which got boring after a few trips in each direction.

 

And this is their first route so what were people actually expecting?

 

I was hoping for GTAV with trains.



Are you saying that was unreasonable?

 

Multiple liveries as well for west coast main line + updates to existing stock which was nice.

Mittenwaldbahn gave us a backdate obb 111

 

ITS JESUS!!!

 

Are there trophies? If not, not buying.

 

No 196s ?

 

WOW WHAT AN ABSOLUTELY STUNNING ROUTE


The Scenery is Top Tier
The Timetable is Top Tier
The Variety and Layers Top Tier
The Amount of Custom Assets Top Tier
The Foliage? Guess what, TOP TIER

buying this DAY ONE.

AAS, the fact you made something like this in 9 months really shows how much talent you have, and how far you will go, a first route, which rivals some of JTs routes, is absolutely bonkers.

 

Funniest thing I've read today.

 

The scenery looks incredibly good with the clutter and foliage. But I do wonder how this will run on console especially as it's only gen 9? Possibly a recipe for texture issues?

 

pppffff good one

 

Seen Crewe Absolutely Spot on


Take my damn money already, I WANNA PLAY THIS!

 

there aren't going to be any trophies for any TSW6 or beyond DLC, only the base game

 

Rail Replacement Bus to Alderley Edge


IS THIS IS A JOKE ABOUT MAC NOT GOING TO CREWE, IF SO, THATS CREATIVE LOL

 

Just captured this bug from the DTG live stream.

One of the yard entry roads at Crewe station is completely missing track and catenary.





I hope this is going to be fixed before release next week.

Don't know enough about Crewe Station to identify the exact place, but it's definitely going to cause problems for yard access.

 

Lol.

 

The above image here is debunked, I believe it looks like this in real life.

 

Might be.... didn´t the guys from AAS have a public beef with ATS a while back?

 

Yeah, I know... Over optimistic as always.

Aaaah, in that case forget I said anything. The whole bloody place is falling apart in real-life too.

 

"Is TPWS simulated?"
"No"

"Are neutral sections simulated?"
"No"

Cool.

 

The TPWS bit was specifically about TPWS 4. TPWS is simulated

 

Where did they say this? They even told Matt to watch out for a TPWS grid at one point.

 

I am impressed with what I have seen. They have captured the New Street to Wolverhampton section very well. I like the combination of the fast section north of Stafford and the much slower section south of Wolverhampton.

I do think some of the announcements are a bit over the top. Also, and I might have missed it although I scrolled back and couldn't see it, but there is a banner repeater signal halfway along Galton Bridge platform going towards Wolverhampton as the signal is around the corner. It was a proper banner repeater signal, now it is a box saying on or off.

 

This looks really good so will be day one for me!

Although it will be nice to see it without fog!

 

I hear this occasionally mentioned from time to time, does anyone know exactly what happened, or can direct me to a thread so I can see what happened?

 

It's in the "Alan Thomson Route Discussion/Speculation thread" - Kezz from All Aboard Studios explains in some detail from Page 10 and then there are some follow up points - Alan Thomson responds from Page 12 and again makes a few points, it's very interesting reading.

 

Essentially like a lot of developers in this industry they were contracted on a profit share basis. I.e. They get paid a share of the profits once the route is released. But they felt ATS was not managing the project well which was causing significant delays and may have contributed to the route being scaled back. So they asked to be 'bought out' of their contract by accepting a payout.

 

Very interesting Route preview really enjoyed it and it does look good - not sure why it was all done in the fog though, Matt insisted it was nothing sinister, but I do recall the last time they did something like that on Train Sim Classic was on a very old West Coast Main Line Soiuth preview stream and it was to cover things up, but hopefully my fears on that are completely unfounded (did seem a bit odd though, can't ever recall them doing that on a TSW preview stream)

 

The route looks excellent, Wolverhampton is stunning which is not something i'd say in real life

 

All I can say is, it lived up to the hype and expectations... Stunning route! It'll be a day one purchase from me. Well done to all the AABS team, the hard work and dedication to this route really shines through.

I'm also very happy to see the larger positive reception from the community, and hopefully the AABS team see this too and it shows the enthusiasm and excitement for all the hard work that has been ploughed into this route over the last 8 months.

The Alderley Edge bus Easter egg was a good'n too, I genuinely laughed out loud at that!

 

Wow, this looks great. Extremely impressed given it’s their first TSW release. I love MAC, but it kinda makes me sad that wasn’t taken to Crewe (understand why), but having that entire stretch from Manchester to Birmingham (and beyond to Bromsgrove with the BCC) would’ve been so perfect!

 

196s weren't in service in 2019

 

I'm glad to see the reception seems positive from the preview stream. I didn't watch it myself because I was already sold on the route, and I never really watch previews for routes I know I'm going to get anyway.

I must say this is the most excited I've been for a route in some time.

 

I originally thought that Class 805 would be an add-on on this map, but I guess I got something wrong..... in the end it probably won't be.

 

Looked really good. Particularly impressed with Crewe - looks spot on, right down to the main stand at the Alexandra Stadium.

 

Forgive me if a reason was provided, but Basford Hall Signalbox appears to be missing. Quite ironic given someone said on the stream “we haven’t missed anything lineside” as the train passed the empty space where the box should be…if SSN North is standing, Basford Hall box should be too as they both were decommissioned and dismantled in the same week.

 

It’s an addon for west coast mainline south, it comes with the 805 and a 2025 working timetable. It’ll probably layer onto Birmingham Crewe but it rarely does anything significant on this stretch of the line

 

They weren't around in 2019 so I hope if it does layer it can be turned off.

I didn't particularly get the impression it would though.

 

I watched in bits and liked it but didn't see the Wolves football stadium. Did I miss it?

 

They've already said on various occasions it's for Euston to Milton Keynes