This will be extremely short. How many of you want a price reduction. What DTG should do is who ever has 100 or more of there DLC. Should have 50% off of all there UP COMING DLC for life. I guess this is extreme wishful thinking. Plus April fools which has not arrived yet. But Gz that would surly be nice wouldn’t it.
Yes that is wishful thinking. It seems the only way to get any sort of reward for loyalty with companies these days, is to become a new customer. Or wait for the sales.
Many know the cost of everything and the value of nothing. If I know I'm going to really enjoy and get plenty of use from a DLC I'll get it full price. If it's something I'll enjoy occasionally or there are too many issues then I'll wait for a sale. Expecting a price reduction is naive, very little comes down especially when the costs of running a business are rising.
More people wanting free stuff offering nothing in return. Hooray. You can already get a discount... it's called wait for it to go on sale. Congratulations. Problem solved.
I’m just saying. I mean is DTG actually a company I mean do they actually take pride into what they actually do. Is DTG a small gadget company. Is DTG full time or part job. Or is it something they do in there sphere time. When they need to get a little bunk or what not. I’m pretty sure they do things out of the ordinary like do things to TSW that we can’t do. Maybe or maybe not I don’t know.
Yes, what you're suggesting is very fanciful. But the general idea of more frequent loyalty discounts is valid. Even my dentist gives me a loyalty discount, as do most businesses here in the US. But take some advice from someone who's been there. Don't ever suggest that TSW is becoming too expensive, or that a particular dlc lacks value for the price. The White Knights will immediately shout you down.
everything is becoming more expensive fact of life so long as there are sales and an occasional give away I do not mind these prices there is only one thing i would like with TSW and that is less bugs and the resurrection of the preservation crew to improve all the older routes
And don't compliment them then the Black Knights will have a field day telling you how terrible they are =-)
Who is "they?" A lot of routes now aren't made by DTG. So any issues with those routes goes back to the route creators. As such, it's also up to them to do "updates" since they own the code. DTG should only be held accountable for its own in house content they created. I know it's easier to just "blame DTG" since they make a convenient puppy to kick, but in fairness you should be addressing issues to the people who created them and have the means to fix them. If there's a problem with All Aboard's route or Just Trains route...then you need to tell them to go fix it. They own the content and can use the team that created it to fix it. Complaining to a party that didn't make and can't fix something is pointless. It's just common sense. In any case, it's hard to use the conspiracy theory "they" when so many different groups are involved.
Well I’ve stated at length in the AAS route thread that £30 is getting expensive for a route with no new train but pretty much got shouted down by those who just want to hand their money over to DTG regardless. We all know there are costs involved and this is a niche hobby, but it must be quite lucrative for DTG to afford maintaining their rather large marketing and PR department. I do feel older content should be getting a permanent price reduction, certainly anything over two years or two versions old. Quite ridiculous that ancient stuff like Rapid Transit still sell for £25. As a PC/Steam user of course quite lucky there are probably at least half a dozen sales during a year when stuff can be picked up cheaper. And that, boys and girls, is pretty much what I do from now on, unless the DLC screams Day One at me. Both NY to Trenton and Ludwigsbahn I picked up dirt cheap and both North London and MAC never bothered buying and don’t feel I’ve missed out.
Well to be fair some folks have no self restraint when it comes to purchases, I'm guilty of it too. I knew the Cardiff route was going to be absolute dogshit but I really wanted the 153 so I bought it, I despise Pendolino's and the people who responsible for their introduction IRL, I still bought the damn thing on release day...
Well, as the publisher, DTG has the responsibility to make sure that 3P ( and its own ) creations are complete before putting them up for sale. There have been too many unfinished routes released too soon.
I have the opposite idea from you. I haven't bought any DLC for two years and have been waiting for the new US heavy cargo routes. Why are there no new ones after the Cajon route?
I am generally in agreement there Vern, though I believe the AAS route is coming with a completely new 350 and various subclasses. Of course it's not a new class of train so there is that argument but if it comes with a 350 that blows the WCMLS version out of the water then maybe it's worth it? In a way the same argument could be said for the upcoming WCML-Preston-Crewe route, while it comes with a 20, 47/3 and 86/4 they are technically not new classes but easily worth the money... You are bang on about the older stuff being sold at full price, it is ludicrous how much some TSW2 era stuff is being listed at.
This is getting off topic and we've discussed this repeatedly. People like the ease of just "blame DTG" but they aren't doing the fixing and the alternative is just "no new products" since they can't as a "publisher" do much else. If Just Trains gets a signal wrong on a route, what would you have DTG do? Not pay them? Nope. That'd be breach of contract. Fix it themselves? Nope. Again, breach of contract and impractical since they didn't make it. Pull all Just Trains content as punishment? Well that seems drastic. No, the responsibility should go on Just Trains and people can simply choose to not buy more of their content (like many do with Rivet) That's why you need to address issues in specific threads and to those creators involved. Now...back on topic... price is entirely subjective. What's "worth playing" to me is not the same as "worth playing" to you. There are DLC I'd pay $50 for and DLC I wouldn't want for free. Instead of just complaining about costs... quietly buy or don't buy. It won't change anything to vaguely LOVE in general about the cost of living. It's more likely the opposite in fact. Without being specific about a specific product, it leads to a general unfocused rush to "work cheaper" and "work faster" which leads to the very bugs and lack of playtesting that people also complain about. They do what they do trying to meet customer demands... but they're opposite demands. You don't usually get higher quality with lower cost. It's one or the other. Demanding both is silly. In practical terms, going by last generation game design, if it takes say 3-6 months more work to get these DLC more bug free (nothing is perfect), then that's more time you're paying those people to NOT have something to sell. You work out some more bugs, but you make less money because you release less. (and have customers yelling about having to wait longer) If you want to keep up the same release schedule.... AND CUT COSTS....how? Let's say for example (not real, just an example to illustrate) that it takes 12 people a year to make a DLC for $40. Say about $100,000 per employee (salary, building, utilities, etc) so that's $1,200,000 invested. They need to sell 30,000 copies to break even. Why does this matter? First complaint "too many bugs" Doing 3 months of more work to get the bugs out is another $300,000 in cost. Will that sell 7,500 more copies to cover the cost? The assumption is that all those people aren't buying the "unfinished" copy for a few bugs in it. However, the 90% rule says that if you can provide a 90% product, then 90% of people will still buy it. Most people don't even see the majority of "bugs", and those that do will often accept them for the rest of the product. By that logic, then you might get 10% more sales if it's "perfect" and get 100% of potential sales, versus 90%. That's 3,000 sales.... not 7,500 meaning the company loses money. To make sense, it would have to mean something like 10,000 more sales... a third boost to justify it. Now.... if they focus on just pumping out "90%" projects...they go to work on the next DLC instead and keep chugging along. Second common complaint "too expensive!" So if you're already scraping by selling DLC at $40.... how do you make it $30 or $20? Your team isn't eating less food and still have to pay rent. Do you fire half your team? Move up the release to every 9 months instead of every 12 months... and accept a "few more bugs?" Which seems to be what some are doing. Or you do what DTG is doing.... you keep pushing marketing to expand a very small core audience. Hence the Thomas DLC and such. The bigger games with better outreach like American Truck Simulator or No Mans Sky do well with the "mass market" approach. It works. However, that clashes with the TSW forum who like to gatekeep and try to keep the sim genre "pure" and without he "casuals." The problem is.... are either of these successful? Are they worth the risk to you in TSW? The assumption is that if you make DLC $20-30 you are selling more... but DO you? Do you really sell TWICE as many DLC at $20? Do you sell twice as much of the 80% quality product? Will you sell enough to the dedicated rail sim market without going outside of it? If you limit the market, then the only solution you have is to cut expenses...meaning less quality. TLR (Summary) What are you willing to give up for "cheaper?" Are you willing to lower your standards on bugs? Is 90% complete or 80% complete "good enough?" Lower your standards on content quality? Shorter routes and no "new loco" each time? Lower your standards on speed of new releases? (Although that doesn't mean lower costs if you keep paying the team) Lower your standards and accept "broad outreach" content like Thomas or fictional routes to bring in more casual customers? If you don't want a "cheap" quality product, then stop begging for "cheap" prices. Chasing "cheap" is what got us here, the digital equivalent of the "Dollar store" on every corner full of cheap plastic LOVE.
Jeeez. There is a sale approx every six weeks, often with up to 90% discounted. I dont usually get personal, but are people are they utterly unaware of how things work and have no concept of project management and how things get made? The new Crewe route took 9 months to make. Thats a huge amount of man hours. On top of that is cost of copyright and licensing for the brands used in the game Manchester Airport from ATS took almost a year, with staff walking out late in the project as they couldnt afford to pay bills. I really hope folks dont think its all 'hurr hurr push button and nu game appears?' Again Im probably being more personal than I usually am, but it sounds removed from reality other than it all being about you 'i want game and i want it cheap'. Admittedly, most of the prices are for those impulse buyers with more cash than the regular gamer (luckily thats me). Since December when i first tried out the FREE version of the game, I've bought every UK route. Ive paid full whack for most routes and even though I can afford them I've bought the others on sales because its incredible value - £3 for Flying Scotsman in the sale? hell yeah. Compared to my other previous games, TSW is dirt cheap for its DLC And yes, you do get a loyalty discount on products. I got a discount for the Manchester Airport route and also for the Deluxe version of TSW6 Compared to any Paradox franchise (Stellaris, Heart of Iron) the Sturmovik series (just HOW much for a single aircraft??) or even City Skylines. You got it good with this train sim. but i guess value is down to the individual player.
Imo I'd be greatful if the untouched DLC from TSW2020 and some from TSW2 would have a few quid knocked off (permanently). There's a fair few, especially from TSW2, which provide layers but the routes aren't good enough. There's others which I'd quite like but just aren't worth £25. Obviously, the Rush Hour routes (especially not DRA or Boston), Cathcart, GWE and WSR are not falling into this club but I think there's a large catelogue which probably will only sell anything on sale - may as well knock a few £ off based on their age + quality. They don't hold up to modern DLC, even factoring in that new DLC are £30 typically.
Particularly those which have been given away dirt cheap (Sherman Hill) or even free (LGV Med), in the past. And who in their right mind would pay full whack for Cane Creek nice as the scenery is. They should all be on a maximum of no more than £15, or £8 in the usual 40% off sale.
There should be a General price reduction. If you want to achieve something in this game, it’s way too expensive. I mean for 60€ i can buy like spider man 2 which has much better graphics and you can play much more. In TSW I get an expert IC (only loco) for 35€, a route like Kassel Würzburg for 35€, 70€. Oh and if I want to use the too expensive expert loco on Kassel Würzburg I need to buy another gameplay pack for 10€. All that for 80€. With 80€ I can buy spider man 2 (which is NOT from a studio that is that big like 2K or EA!! So they have their costs like DTG) and spider man 1 and Miles morales. That’s about 80€. And in this game 80€ is nothing. So yeah, it’s way too expensive!!
Agreed, the trains you can drive in Spiderman 2 are brilliant Oh wait Spiderman 2 was done by Sony, maybe you've heard of them
lol do ur research spider man trilogy was done by insomniac games. Not Sony. What I wanted to say is the price-performance ratio, which is a total terrible Desaster for train sim world.
Marvel's Spider-Man 2 is a 2023 action-adventure game developed by Insomniac Games and published by Sony Interactive Entertainment. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marvel's_Spider-Man_2 In August 2019, Sony announced it had agreed to acquire Insomniac as the 14th internal studio within SIE Worldwide Studios. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insomniac_Games Spiderman 2 made by that tiny company Sony and still has great trains Oh wait
I would vote no personally, it wouldn’t affect how many I purchased nowadays and their more of an incentive or their should be more of an incentive to produce high quality content if dlc costs half the price of a game what could have been in development for more than 5 years unless it was dramatic such as free stuff forever then no (no idea how they would financially support that just saying)
You said Sony made that Game. They are the Publisher damn the work is done by insomniac, they are the developers. Im Not discussion that with people who are annoying with no understanding or what so ever. You didn’t understand the point that’s about the price performance ratio if you even know that word. The discussion is about that. Stop talking shyt.
What about all those expensive DLC what were done by TSG that you was blaming on DTG? Was that you asking smart, whatever that means? That’s right. Two of the three examples you used were made by TSG and only published by DTG. lol do ur research (god, I hate typing in text speech) Mega cringe (and slang). lol
Erm ok, moving back to TSW and away from Spiderman.... There could be an argument that there should be some kind of discount on new releases, being that they are likely to be riddled with bugs (developer depending) which may take days/weeks/months/years/never be fixed (again developer depending). It wouldn't really work though as most users would buy on release regardless so there is no incentive for DTG/Devs to do that, which is understandable. So nope, case closed :/ I'd just repeat the point from days ago in which the really old TSW1-3 DLC should be heavily discounted, it helps new players build up their layers to get the most out of the new routes but also allows long standing players to gap-fill and maybe discover a new area that they'd like, if it's cheap they might "take a punt on it" and like it, but to pay full price for something they might not get much out of? nah.
