New Jt Route Cumbrian Coast: Carlisle - Whitehaven From Just Trains

The section around Flimby and the last section into Whitehaven is quite scenic to be fair. You can get good views of Dumfries & Galloway right out to the Mull of Galloway in the right conditions and on a really clear day there's good views of the Isle of Man.

Hopefully we'll see other sections in the future. One of the highlights for me is the big horseshoe curve around the bay at Foxfield, great views of the bay on one side, and sweeping vistas of the Lake District from the South on the other side!

I agree, there's not really anywhere further south to sensibly terminate trains unless you go all the way down to Barrow which would be significantly longer. Maybe at a stretch, the Nuclear facility at Sellafield at the expense of passenger workings. I think a longer route would also stretch JT's development capability too thin with Preston - Crewe in the works at the same time.

 

Absolutely FANTASTIC announcement! I for one couldn't be happier, it's like JT are making my entire hit list! Soooooo happy!!!!!

 

No 03s - closest you'd see them was Newcastle I'm afraid.

 

Are you likely going to be proceeding on clear signals everywhere or was this route congested at the time (if only cause of huge sections or something)? My fear is it's going to be relatively empty but maybe this unfounded - I don't know the line well.

 

Can it replace the 104? On the PFR/SOS for example?

 

Could be nice doing a coastal drive off the mainline. Having some rural freight would be a nice change too.

 

Its not exactly a hustle and bustle commuter line. But a fair bit of freight inbetween the passenger runs. We need some well done UK rural DLC and this will fit the bill well. The fact its JT developing and its in an interesting era gives it the edge.

 

Well there was only an passenger service approximately once per hour, some to Whitehaven others through to Barrow. Some parcels trains went along the route but there would only be a handful I imagine. Not sure about freight but I doubt much.

This isn't the kind of route that needs to be busy, if offers a different slower paced experience.

 

In green with the original interior. Doubt they would have been seen much on Crewe to Liverpool but Buxton may have had some in PFR.

I still hope the 104 isn't dead but just hibernating but I suspect the former.

 

The single line section at Parton might result in a wait. Also quite likely to be held coming into Carlisle.

I hope the other side of Whitehaven tunnel is included at Corkickle thinking about it. While it's quite empty now, back then there were still quite a few sidings and two signal boxes.

 

That's a shame, I quite liked using the manual gearbox on the TSC version. I suppose British Steel Workington would have had their own shunters which might be thrown in as a nice surprise? Maybe I'm reading too much into it, but shunting seemed to be emphasised in the features section.

 

We can only hope. So far it's been disappointing when they have said "shunting" and it's been just simple empty stock moves and single engines. But, we'll see. Between this and the Crewe-Preston... fingers crossed!

 

Interesting idea - there were a lot of Yorkshire Engine Co "02"-type shunters around the steelworks, yes - the actual BR 02 models and some 0-6-0s too. I'd be surprised if they were included, but what do I know .

In my day there were 2 or 3 BR 08s knocking around Workington, lots of shunt moves yes, both with those and the various 25s, 40s, 47s that were stabled around the station or in the old shed. In the era JT are modelling I think it would be down to one 08, and the shed was either closed completely or on its last legs. But I'd left by 1983 so I can't say for sure.

 

I hope if the class 40 subs in, it can be disabled without removing a complete layer.

 

It’s a slightly earlier era but certainly in 1973, if the SIAM Traffic Control simulation is to be believed, Class 40’s and double headed Class 25’s had the lions share of freight on the M&C in particular the frequent steel traffic to and from Workington. So I wouldn’t be averse to a bit of licence for some retro Whistler action on this route.

 

I agree in that I don't want people to be denied it appearing, they have the technology to turn it off now as they did with Blackpool. However it wouldn't worry me too much but one appears on Shap on every run I make!

Double headed class 25's I'm definitely on board with.

I have definitely seen photos of class 31's on the route too.

I hope at some point we get a TOD4 route set in an era where the 40's were still in service.

 

Don’t forget Maryport as well. For those unaware, unusually, although the line through Maryport is double track, there is only a platform on the Up side. Down trains have to cross over and use the platform on the Up line. This often caused signal delays if there was a train coming the other way using the platform. Surprisingly it wasn’t a case of the Down platform having been removed at some point. There just never was one.

From experience, the other place at which signal delays were common was at the last signal coming into Carlisle. This might be because the ‘Maryport bay’ (platform 2 - invariably used for trains going down the coast) was occupied, or because there was a train entering or leaving platform 1 (the through platform on the West side of the station), or possibly a shunt move from the London end into the roads on the West side of the station. There were quite a lot of possible conflicting moves on this side of the station - bad for the Signaller, but good for us in terms of creating operational interest!

 

Indeed, a product of the Maryport & Carlisle being unusual as an early railway that retained it's independence right up until grouping.

 

I mentioned the Corkickle Brake earlier - a quick check shows it was operational until October 1986 - some pictures here:

http://www.cumbria-railways.co.uk/corkickle_brake_old_pictures.html

 

25s and 40s were the mainstay of the local freight scene along with 47/0s from further afield. Double-headed 37s and 31s most days on the Redcar runs. Even the occasional (VERY occasional!) 46….

I always remember one of the shunters there, bloke called Brian, telling me we had had a Deltic through earlier in the day one time. Not as outrageous as it sounds, because by then you’d occasionally see one of the Gateshead Deltics at Carlisle in the Newcastle bay standing in for a failed DMU Never did see one in Workington myself though, but Brian was adamant…

 

I wouldn't have imagined that a Deltic would have been allowed down to Workington but you never know I guess. They certainly ran some Newcastle to Liverpool services towards the end of their lives

 

I personally didn’t see it, but then again I did see the occasional 46 out of Gateshead so I’d imagine it was just about possible. We’d occasionally get the odd 26 or 27 down from Scotland too, both of which you’d never expect to see that far South.

Most of the time though the only relief from the endless stream of 25s and 40s was a 47 namer or 40 106

 

To the experts on this unit, location and time out there, what livery will this Class 108 carry?

 

Should be blue and grey. It should also have one powered DMBS and an unpowered DTCL so a little slower to accelerate than a two carriage class 101.

 

Thanks. I must admit I was hoping for the all green cats whisker livery as we’ve already got the blue and grey.

 

Yep, blue & grey … they were repainted from all blue in the late 70s when they were refurbished.

 

There was at one time during the 80's one unit did carry BR green albeit with full yellow ends.


Edit: Here you go.
Photo: Keith Burnett

 

Also IIRC, the 108’s allocated to the Cumbrian Coast had bars fitted to the door droplight frames, to avoid passengers sticking their head out and getting it injured at some structures with very limited clearance.

 

There's a driver eye view video of this route on Ben Elias' youtube channel and it looks gorgeous.

 

Yes that is correct, I think you can just make them out in the photo of the green one. They were allocated to Carlisle Currock and transferred to Heaton in the late 80's when Currock lost its DMU allocation.

 

Yes vehicles 53964/54247 if I recall. There was this set and a Norwich allocated Cravens class 105 pained in green in the mid to late 1980's.

 

Blue Grey.

 

This gives a good flavour of what to expect, some 4 years after the route is set.
The scenes around Carlisle also show how well JT have captured the overall feel on Preston - Carlisle.

 

What a great video, haven't seen it before. That was filmed from a non-powered DTCL judging by the lack of engine sounds.

 

I think you will find that is the Railscene video which has been ripped and uploaded to YT. It's not the only one from the collection so assume done with the blessing of the publisher. The giveaway will be Jeremy English' constant gibber throughout the trip - I'm amazed none of the drivers or traction inspectors told him to shut up. Well not that made it in the final edition anyway.

And yes there will be a distinct lack of thrash driving from the DTCL, in some ways I find it strange driver/trailer sets were deemed adequate for the route rather than power twins which would have given a bit more power and engine backup on the remoter stretches.

 

I mean we got a scotrail intercity class 47 with west coast mainline so there’s a chance they would give us a bonus livery

 

You mean Kingmoor - Currock was a wagon repair yard that never had a DMU allocation.

 

You can see the bars clearly on the video from 11.00 and also the green with yellow ends plus your whiskers.

 

I’ve been digging, according to railcar the Kingmoor green set was indeed active in 1986: https://www.railcar.co.uk/images/class-108/vehicles/81

So it could happen, given JT’s brilliant selection of liveries so far…

The window bars are a must for that line. I grew up thinking all DMUs had them, and it was only when I started being able to scrape enough cash together to travel further afield that I realised that pretty much everywhere else DMU’s didn’t have them

 

Oops yes apologies, Kingmoor of course. Not sure where I got Currock from.

 

I'm sure the Railscene video was Barrow to Carlisle not from Carlisle. I'll dig it out over the weekend and connect my VCR up and relive my youth! Jeremy was certainly enthusiastic!

I also wonder why power trailer sets were so common, okay for a East Anglian branchline maybe, but not a route with gradients of any sort. Will make a more challenging drive though, assuming they are the type JT models.

 

Excellent video - good to see that in 1990 the centre roads and shed were still in place at Workington. Nice to see the TPO in the bay too (odd seeing a 31 there though, they were always hauled by 47/4s in my day!) - doubtless there were a few stabled locos on the back roads too, although we can’t see them in this video. There’s a good shot of the BSC shunters too.

 

I wonder how Whitehaven will appear on this route, will it have 4 platforms or will it be 2 platforms as it is today?

 

I'm pretty sure it was three platforms at that time, though I stand to be corrected! It was certainly three in the early 90s, by which time my memories are easier to recollect.

 

The bay (“Carlisle”) platform was still in use in 1987 and the sidings leading to the docks were still in place, but the old station building had been demolished a few years before and replaced with the current hut, sadly:

https://www.railscot.co.uk/img/19/911/

 

The bay platform is still in use today too after the (hopefully temporary) closure of the tunnel - I caught a train to Carlisle there back in August. But yes, the hideous bungalow station does pale compared to the old building, which was demolished before I have any recollection of it.

 

It was an imposing Dickensian old thing! As I remember it was mostly disused, very dank and creepy (for a kid of my age ) - what we’d call “atmospheric” now I guess They knocked it down late 70s I think. Same as the old Maryport station - that was a spooky old thing too!

 

I get why it was demolished - I'm sure 100 or so years ago, there was need for such a big station as there was a lot more traffic coming through and offices etc would be required. But it doesn't change that the replacement is a bit bleak, to say the least.

Though at least we got a new station building in Whitehaven, unlike Maryport!

 

Nice videos. Got me wishing this route was longer now.

 

Checking out some of the videos mentioned has got me even more excited for this one. I like that it's not a hustling and bustling busy mainline. Just a nice coastal run through some beautiful scenery! I like the focus on the freight side as well that's always good to see.

Curious if we might get some 37 or 31 improvements like JT did with the 47 maybe alongside the 108?

Although I do wonder why this had been announced now when Preston - Crewe hasn't had much in the way of updates etc? I feel like Preston - Crewe must be fairly close by in that case would be surprised if we didn't get more bits coming up soon in the new year