East Coast Way Remaster Discussion Thread.

Tuned in for a bit of the stream and the remaster looks good to my eye. I like the timetable and how much traffic is in Brighton. I love the rail tour options and getting the 33 in. It seems like Tyler has done a great job with the timetable as well it's nice to see the diversions etc. The announcements sound decent to me although maybe a little bit too fast? I'm sure they're slower IRL.

My one disappointment from what I saw was the other side of the ticket gates at Brighton. Would've been nice to have that be a bit more representative of real life and actually have the main entrance there alongside a coffee stand which we've seen on other routes. Maybe throw in the piano as an Easter egg?

I'll probably be picking the pack up based on this preview as long as initial feedback shows nothing glaring

 

Did They mentioned when it is released

 

I will be picking up the pack, seems good value to me at £12.99.

The remaster looks really good as does the timetable and I love the fact that the 313 now has suspension, it is one of my favourite trains in the sim.

 

Sometime in February.

 

Yeah overall I was impressed. I didn’t stick around for much of it, as usual the CM or whatever is the loudest part of the stream & waffling on about nonsense the entire time. It’s like trying to watch with my 8 year old nephew running around the room.

I was a little disappointed with the section between London Road & Lewes, some of the grass embankments had really poor, flat green textures. Also the tunnels seemed to have a weird effect on the 171 cab, turning the instrument panels black almost.

Brighton itself & beyond Lewes looked really good though, can’t wait to do some 171 runs. The announcements for the 171’s sounded really good, but I did find the station announcements to be far too quiet at Brighton.

 

On that initial run that was something I was trying to see and I don't know if it was the slightly blurry stream quality or the low level morning light because some of it did look a bit flat and out of place. But the still shots I saw Matt do a flypast it seemed to look decent. So will be awaiting a decent preview from an ambassador.

But for a free remaster I think it's definitely a good face lift.

 

Glad a few things were clarified in the stream, and Tylers timetable and Liams overhaul of the route looks fantastic.

For those who didn't watch, it was clarified that the 377/3 and the ECW variant of the Class 377/4 do not have the updated sounds, because they are only licensed for the BML variant. Which I can live with for now and I appreciate the honesty. It was also mentioned the BML 377 can be played as a substitute if players want that particular sound set (The 377/2 also operates as a playable layer too, which is nice to give it a stretch of its legs on a proper service).

One thing I didn't believe was clarified is if the ECW 377 PIS had been updated to the correct font and display system, which I'm hoping can be answered on here? I did see a single screenshot of a 377 with the correct PIS display system and font, but the majority appear to use the unrealistic and overly large PIS. It's one thing that does niggle me a little bit.

The other thing I didn't really get to hear was the Class 171 cab running sounds as the windows were left open the entire time when the service was being played, which is the only part of the stream I did find disappointing given that the updated cab running sounds were one of the most asked about and important features to demonstrate.

Overall though, Rivet and Liam have done a brilliant job on both of their respective parts on this route. The 377/3 had a really decent interior which didn't go unnoticed by me and the seating looked far better then other variants of the 377 I had seen. And the route itself looks completely transformed.

 

A small nitpick but one that should be obvious the class 313 has guard mode yet when doing a passenger service as the driver you don't get a buzzer once the doors closed come on Rivet how can you miss that out ? the turbo star has a guard's buzzer when the doors were closed so there so be no excuse especially how that service isn't driver only operated

 

Well that’s disappointing, especially considering, from my point of view, the /3 variant looks like a quick job; take a car away, redo the seating layout, add the new headlight clusters, and there you have it. I was expecting at a minimum they would update the TMS screen to at least add the correct visuals, although I would have liked to see it much more functional than just changing the dest. board, with different menu options, as well as updating the sounds (Though it’s clear why this wasn’t the case). Happy for all of those who are keen on buying the route and Loco pack, but this isn’t for me.

 

Well, there's only a week of February left (presuming it won't release on a Friday or Saturday. That suggests next Tuesday or Thursday.

 

I do think this is a fair point & not dissimilar from what I was saying about the Turbostar packs in general. New TT’s, variants & liveries are great, for £12.99 these packs are making pretty substantial changes to routes even without remasters. That being said when you look at the packs overall you’d expect to see incremental changes in the units that bring them up to solid, in depth trains & that’s not really happening.

This electrostar will be what, the 7th? version we’ve had & it’s really not progressed since TSW2. What’s more is the one coming with MVL sounds like its going to be a cut above the rest, so to have one out of (by then) around 10 different versions being substantially improved is going to leave a sour taste in my mouth.

 

Everyone is welcome to their own opinion on it. Personally I'm happy with most of the 377/3 features... My question would be, given that Firefly has even newer and better sounds for its upcoming 375/3 & 375/6 would it be possible for developers to work together and update the 377/3 sounds after the release of Medway Valley Line so that the sound set for Electrostars could be universal across the board rather than having 3 different sets of sounds? And could doing so avoid restrictions with licensing, like is happening in this case with the AP Electrostar sounds?

I think (and quite rightly) Firefly probably want to demonstrate and debut their own 'new' Electrostar sound set for their own route. But as some constructive feedback to Rivet on this, maybe they could contact them and ask once their MVL route is released, could Rivet use the same sound set for their 377/3. Unless that has licencing aswell, I don't know?

Overall though as I say, I'll give credit where credit is due, for me personally I like the look of the 377/3 and 171 and they'll breath life into East Coastway. And I think Rivet have done alright and the overall package is really good. Although, I still would like to hear a demonstration of the updated cab running sounds with the windows shut!

 

Well, at least they gave a reason for the 377 retaining it's worse sounds. The BML version subbing in does soften the blow a little and I know which version I'd rather drive. Though that begs the question as to why the WCMLS 377 and SE 375 are able to have the updated sounds but not the ECW one, if the sounds are supposedly only licenced for the BML version?

I was really impressed with the announcements on the class 171. I get that they can't use the real voices but I'm really impressed with how they made an effort to make it sound as close as possible to the real Southern voice. However the 377 and 313 used the same GWR-esque voice as on the 150 and 802. Why can't we have some consistency??

 

So in one of the BML remaster threads the other day, I mentioned a number of layer options if a remaster if it was to occur on that route and having had a brief look at the stream and the article, it seems some have been implemented here such as the Class 395 Railtour (which did a charity Railtour around 10 years ago on a number of routes around Sussex), a Steam Railtour (one of the charter companies usually runs one or two steam charters a year from London Victoria to Eastbourne via Lewes, before heading up towards Hastings and onto Tonbridge back to London) and the GWR Class 150 layering in for the GWR services on the WCW line at Brighton, which is a really nice touch and makes me look forward to this new pack and remaster even more.

 

Now we're dealing with licensing on sounds?

From a player perspective it's fairly preposterous imo. Guess it shows DTG penny-pinching by subcontracting sounds eventually has a downside lol.

 

Yes I suspect one of those two. Hopefully Thursday as I could do with a distraction as have an audition the next day.

 

Did anyone watching the stream notice if the "New" 377/3 or the revamped 313 still suffer from the longstanding inaccuracy whereby 3rd rail EMUs lose traction power when one shoe, rather than all shoes, loses contact?

 

I'm not that knowledgeable about the Electrostar and the myriad variants, the 377/2 is selectable as a player service. Do or did they operate on this line or could any Southern Electrostar appear almost anywhere? As it's the most up to date model we have (apart from the new /3) it might be the best one to drive. Although the original ECW always sounds sufficiently like and Electrostar to me.

 

Yeah Southern (and GTR in general) are really not that picky over where the various main & subclasses (or even operator brandings) run. The only thing they generally stay consistent on is of course ensuring the correct power supply & general consist length.

If anything it’s ironically the /3 out of place in this timetable.

 

Yeah I had to give up watching for that same reason. I found it irritating and a little unprofessional, I’m sorry to say.

 

Also agree too. Most of the time I could barely hear the actual gameplay - I don't mind a bit of discussion as long as it's pertinent to the actual route, train or game itself.

 

Once again Liam has done it again. Another fine remaster from him, and I even give some small praise to Rivet since they collaborated.

£12.99 seems a fair price for pack, if not for that than to support the work that’s been put in. I was shocked to learn that this only took a Liam a month to remaster, so depending on the scale of the route some routes could be remastered quicker than others?
A BML remaster is looking more likely now

 

Great thanks.

 

Just finished watching the stream, some of my thoughts (which may echo other points mentioned already by others):

- Overall, very pleased to see the much loved East Coastway finally get a proper update - has always been a favourite of mine. A big thank you to Tyler especially for his enthusiasm and Rivet, plus Liam's assistance too. I want to see more remasters of classic older TSW content.
- Very impressed with the 171 announcements as they sound quite similar to reality; so much better than the standard TSW announcements which, to be honest, are stating to grate on me a little now. The station announcements at Brighton also sounded different and thankfully much more realistic.
- Regarding the 377/4 sounds I'm all rather confused by the licensing. So, the sounds from the BML version can't be copied over to ECW, but why then was there not such an issue with the 377/2 for WCML South?
- While the timetable is 2018, 387s have been quite common operating normal passengers services on the East Coastway to Eastbourne and Ore in more recent years so would have been nice to see some extra variety regardless. So, my question, why can't you substitute the 387 for some of the 377 services too?
- With the introduction of the 377/3, while probably too much, but I'd really liked to have seen the class 377/1 to complement the classic Southern fleet finally.
- Final thing, the presentation of the stream needs to be a little more professional at times. Too much waffling about irrelevant things when it would be nice to actually hear more of the gameplay!

Yes, they operate everywhere regardless to complement the rest of the fleet. It's quite cool to see a 12-car formation consisting of say a /1, /2 and /4.

Here is 377/208 at Hastings back in 2021 departing to Ore from London Victoria. It was initially an 8-car formation until Eastbourne with a /1 before dividing, with the former terminating there while the /2 4-car section continued onward to Ore.

Photo taken by me

 

Yeah, I noticed that back when I used to play it with Victoria station being the major culprit. Shocking 20fps when departing and it slowly improved as you headed toward Battersea power station.

I’m glad you had more support this time round, because I was in shock honestly when Matt said it only took you roughly a month to do the ECW(R).
Still, I’m glad it was a smooth transition and players will have the remaster sooner than expected.

Yeah BML remaster is definitely not going to be an easy task for anyone to do, but if there’s anyone who can do it. It’s you.
I’m always singing your praise’s haha, but you deliver and I can’t say a bad word about you. I know the community would agree with me on that too.

 

Watched a bit of the stream and immediately a smile appeared on my face when the cab started to bounce over junctions. The only thing that bugged me so far was how the timetables are named. Even after getting the explanation what the different timetables are I still don't understand what the difference is.

 

Looks great but im so confused now we have 4 timetables. Can someone explain to me idiot style .

 

You have the existing timetables: the original one and the one that comes with the 313.

With the gameplay pack you get two new timetables. These are almost identical, except the Lewes and Seaford services are run with either the 313 or the 377 (depending on which TT you choose).

 

Thanks for that.

 

Especially with Matt's comment, it seems a BML remaster is definitely on the cards.

 

But unsure how to do it?

 

As I’ve said previously, Rivet now having Tyler onboard is such a fantastic asset for Rivet and TSW in general, the Riviera Line timetable is the closest 1:1 timetable we’ve seen in the game compared to reality, so once again as soon as I heard Tyler’s involvement again having created the original mod for East Coastway I knew we were in for a treat.

The remastered East Coastway looked brilliant too, it really is one of the early TSW routes that has stood the test of time compared to Tees Valley and Northern Transpennine etc, I can’t remember the last time I ran them but East Coastway has always been a firm favourite, that I run very frequently.

Like Matt commented on the stream, I still remember the hype when the original screenshot was posted as a teaser of near Southerham Junction, because it was the first time we were getting more than just an “end to end” route when it was revealed.

 

A weird situation with the sounds certainly. While this is never a deal breaker for me I can see it being for some.

My supposition is that when contracting/licensing sounds the contract is between the two entities involved, and wherever the new sounds were used, it was in a DTG product, where DTG was the producer not only the publisher. An with this DLC being a Rivet Games product, they do not own the license for the sounds that DTG has. At the same time this could have resulted in the DTG 377 from ECW having the BML sounds, while the 3 Car would have had the other ones, which would have been even more striking.

This is something to take note of for third party content, that licensing might not apply the same way for everyone. It is quite possible the new team working on MVL sourced a third independent set of sounds, that is gonna be limited to their content only.1

 

Yes I would have thought there would be 2018 313 and 2018 377 or similar, it confused me too at first.

 

I managed to watch about 20 minutes before the incessant and irrelevant chit chat from the CM drove me to stop watching.
I find it amusing that the CM’s dont really have much to say on these forums but as soon as they have a ‘live’ audience they can’t stop….

 

Another point that drives me nuts is the nonsense over release dates.
We ‘can’t’ say when it’s going to be released blah blah…we know it probably going to be next Tuesday or Thursday - doesn’t take Mastermind to work it out really if it’s coming in February.
Also, get the facts correct too. The pricing initially mentioned an incorrect figure which I appreciate Matt corrected pretty quickly but come on these things should of been checked beforehand.

 

I would rather have it this way in stead of promising a date now and having to postpone later (like they did a few times during the TSW 5 era).

 

I don’t blame them considering the toxicity of these forums sometimes, as evidenced above. I wouldn’t particularly want to engage either.

For example I know the “lazy” comment that so often gets banded around particularly offended Matt one time, so I don’t blame him for not engaging as much on here.

 

I didn't watch the stream but I don't have to check the replay on the YT channel to wonder who you are on about and I totally agree with you. I tend to swerve streams when that certain CM is on

 

Unfortunately some will continue to behave in the same manner and continue to wonder why DTG have gone quiet on the forums.

It becomes a self fulfilling prophecy.

If people behaved on the internet as they would in real life, places like this would be more pleasant and you'd find developers would be more likely to listen and engage.

 

So the explanation for the different timetables was that some people may own ECW and not the 313 when they buy the pack so the new 377 has to be on the Seaford services instead of the 313 in theory. But then JT were able to sub the 86 in on 87 run services in their timetable so idk why they went this way.

The timetables are exactly the same except one has the new 377 on the Seaford services and one has the 313 on the Seaford services so the 2018 313 is the one with the 313 and the 2018 is the other. But then DTG had already done a 313 timetable when that released.

I don't like having timetables all over the place but I've done the journeys for the previous add ons so I guess it's not too bad.

 

I'm not worried about having four timetables. I'll just use the latest 313 one, it will be the first on the left of the list once I've started using it.

It would be nice if you could hide timetables though.

 

Route looks incredible to be honest (and always thought East coastway was the best looking pre TOD 4 route anyway). Will definitely be picking up the 171/377 pack on whichever mystery date it releases on.

 

Everyone is entitled to an opinion whether or not you agree or disagree.
I respect your position but the post that you are referring to is valid in my opinion. ‘Toxic’ - do me a favour!

 

They need a master file so upgraded content is applied universally.
If these are obtained by third parties, they should be compensated via monies/contract.

 

But have not mention which February

 

Very simple next week.... Not so many days left

 

I think I understand but I will have to wait until the release to make sure I really did

Imagine being new to TSW and having to learn all those numbers.

 

Yes, I also think it was an unfortunate choice. I’m sure she’s very nice, but the topic keeps drifting off constantly, and honestly about 90% of the stream is just small talk. Fun, sure, but we want to get a proper impression of the addon, and that includes asking questions related to the product or addressing questions that were raised on the forum. I honestly wonder whether she’s the right fit for this kind of livestream. This isn’t the first time either. The focus should be on the addon, not on a competition about who’s the most entertaining. Same with the silly jokes. Sometimes you just have to consider someone’s strengths, and maybe livestreams aren’t the best match for this person.

No hate, I have nothing against anyone it’s purely a quality issue.