What Do You Think Is Next For Ats

It'll be back to TSC converting the tsw710 to the Aventra classes for TSC....

For TSW would like them to revisit MAC, and as others have said, please add in that 17mile missing piece to Crewe...if they do go back to MAC would like them to also fix up the TT and get in some unbranded Northern and TPE trains for the TT since GWE-R showed that it can be done and majority of the player base didn't care/mind if they were branded or not..

 

Crewe station would probably have to be be rebuilt by ATS as I can’t see them being allowed to reuse AAS model(and in fairness why would a company allow a competitor to just use their IP) which probably makes the the whole project cost prohibitive especially as a free upgrade.

I love to see more ATS content and the east of England is virgin territory for TSW (hint hint). I know certain quarters moaned about the length of MAC but personally my only gripe is some of the signalling and I’ve enjoy many a run on the route and wouldn’t hesitate in opening my wallet for another ATS route.

 

I too love and enjoy MAC, the detail is superb, however l would like them to add the football stadium at Edgeley and extend the route to Crewe, which l would gladly pay for.

If ATS were to issue another route, it could be Chat Moss or a route in North Wales.

 

I wouldn't expect that update to be free and would pay for the upgrade/increased route to Crewe and would suspect there would not be many who wouldn't..

Its just a shame with the AABS WCML going from Euston to Crewe only for that missing 17miles with ATS preventing a full end to end run!

 

ATS have a thing for Manchester & the North West. I doubt they’re much happier than us that Crewe got missed.

If they make more routes it’s going to be that area or Anglia. I’d also consider that at some of that missing section on MAC, likely exists in some form.

 

its not just edgeley park that i would like to see. stockport was the only place that i was disappointed with as most of the iconic buildings like the hat museum, the plaza, red rock and the bus depot are all just default buildings. even BnQ and decathlon could be made to be a bit more recognisable.

ive also found at slade lane nothing uses the up slow junction. all the EMR stuff goes to the fast lines at longsight which is incorrect as dose some the freight ive done so far. without the TPE hope vally layer i cannot see anything else that should use it.

 

One route I'd like would be a nice Manchester / Derbyshire Network route. Manchester to Buxton with a 156, plus if they can use the already built in the Glossop line section to Hyde North, add in the rest of that line down to Rose Hill Marple and New Mills. Could then do a 150/1 DLC too. It'd then also be prime ground for JT to do a Northern Pacer. You've also got the Aggregates freight around Buxton as well.

 

In My Hope I Think They Will Do The Class 91 Because They Can Use The Class 90 For The Class 91 And Player And Basically Everyone Would Be Happy

 

I had understood paid upgrades to be extensions to routes ratther than scenery improvements. For the latter to work you'd probably need to wait for five years after initial release and charge a fiver, can't imagine it would be very financially viable. An extension of MAC to Crewe, or to Oxford road and beyond (Chester please) I would definitely pay for.

 

Or the massive Etihad Stadium!!

 

No they weren't, they were added along with the 220

 

Yeah, you'd end up with basically what JT did for TSC but in TSW. Pacers on the Hazel Grove to Manchester run would give me PTSD though (I suffered the misfortune of being stranded in one for about an hour one morning opposite McVities when the brakes went funny).

I agree with others though that the run down to Crewe from Alderley Edge on the MAC route feels like a bit of a miss. Would've been a fun one to stretch the legs a bit on and to join up with the Birmingham-Crewe route that followed it. Perhaps no one fancied being the one to do the 3D model of the Jodrell Bank telescope!

 

They may just stick to traction DLCs after the shenanigans of MAC and the less than stellar response of ending the route at a small station instead of carrying on to Crewe, the logical endpoint.

I think a lot will be riding on the class 90 DLC and how that goes, they may have something else planned after, but I won't be surprised If they go the way of Athena Trains and vanish into the ether.

 

Hopefully one day they will do the extension to Crewe but if it's a deffo no no, maybe they could extend to Stoke (a terminus for the 323's) or possibly a little further to Stafford so we can route hop.

 

ATS won't "vanish in to the ether", if anything they'll go into super fidelity and high-quality products released when they are ready, without any announcements until it's ready for market.

That's the problem DTG created with the road map. It's great to know what's coming, but it then built a level of entitlement from the player base when products slipped in release. So much whining and moaning that you then get DTG putting pressure on developers to release the product in the specified release window given in the roadmaps.

A product should only be released when it's actually ready. DTG could really learn that when they release the yearly paid for update, stop charging for it (I know they give the starter pack away for free). Personally think there are enough 3rd party developers now producing content that they could take over route development and releases, with DTG optimising and developing new core features, without the worry of spreading themselves too thin for everything.

 

Ats wont vanish far from it I reckon they will be one of the big runners the same as they still are for TSC

 

I saw on Facebook earlier that ATS are doing a "Network SW" NSE era route for TSC it would seem. I'm assuming it'll be based in the 423/442/455 era. So ATS are certainly still busy with TSC projects as they've also got some more East Anglia content on the way.

 

That's a group unaffiliated with ATS. IIRC the person who did the PDL upgrade with Alton route is working with a few other people. You can join their discord to see more progress too.

 

Excellent news because the original Alton route is superb. I was aware of them wanting to do more including the mainline down to Southampton. I wrongly assumed from the FB post that ATS were going to publish it through their website.

 

I dont think its an NSE era route that person who created PDL upgrade is working on with others, its an expansion of his current SWML, upgrading the line to Basingstoke from the images Ive seen on discord...(below)

 

The issue with some football grounds is that the design could be subject to image rights. We saw this with the Emirates Stadium near Finsbury Park, London N5 in TSC being a rather generic modern bowl structure rather than having design details that are unique to it - think Tottenham's ground but with a larger trophy cabinet.
The Football Manager franchise has had a similar problem, the stadiums that come with the game are generic ones that aren't quite the same as the real ones.

Plus, the Etihad is such a plastic, soul-less stadium that it may suck the life out of the route.

flukey#4378 Looks like I was making an assumption with the NSE-era branding. I really must pay more attention sometimes!

 

ATS are probably the worst 3PD to hope a remaster from.
Looking at their posts on social media their main focus is TSC, this is what is most profitable for them.
I would love an extension to Crewe, but the likelihood of it happening is slim to none. The MAC route now is just abandonware.

 

Bold claims about it being abandonware. They've fixed loads, but DTG hasn't released the patch yet.

 

What’s the next logical step then for this route? New trains and that extension we all crave. No chance, not in a million years. If ATS was interested it would’ve been announced months ago. It’s not profitable for them to waste time on the extension, not when they can pump out the TSC content a lot quicker and for bigger pay outs.

 

This is true of nearly every route in TSW. Everyone wants this branch added or that new piece of rolling stock for the existing route. The MAC DLC is probably towards the top of the league for extension requests, but remember that this was their first foray into TSW at a time when many of their developers had broken away to start their own game development team.

ATS are still deeply entrenched in TSC content, but to suggest they'll get bigger "pay outs" is very likely not the main issue given TSC has a smaller (and shrinking) customer base. Smart companies diversify, because putting all your eggs in one basket, with one product line, is a seriously bad move. TSC content is also quicker to release, they've been making TSC content for long enough to be experts. TSC work is paying the bills at the moment while they get used to making TSW content. But it won't pay the bills for much longer, they'll need to gradually increase TSW releases and decrease TSC releases. Getting that balance right is crucial to keeping the lights on and food on the table.

So I appreciate your comments were a valiant attempt to justify your position that MAC is "abandonware" but that is factually incorrect while there's an update from ATS that's still not been released. I doubt there's anyone who is happy that the route was cut short but are we happy that many older routes haven't had rudimentary updates since release? "Abandonware" is software that is no longer being supported by the maker, this is blatantly not the case on any DLC even if some of it has remained a little unloved since release (see Cornwall Coastal for the best example). MAC is not a great example for you to prove your point on that front. New update is pending.

 

Alan gave very good reasons why they didn't extend to Crewe. Development pressures and the fact it was their first route they wanted to make sure the product was achievable before going bigger.

New trains could come to the route in the future, especially if there's a demand, but who knows.

 

How often over the years have we read that DTG have been sent a patch but they seem to take a very long time to release it, surely the devs must be annoyed?

 

Yes, as I have raised before, DTG are the principal roadblock with feature upgrades and patches being released for routes.

 

It's a VERY convenient excuse for all parties involved imo.

DTG gets to say "we're doing console testing/waiting for a release slot", while the 3P gets to say "it's with DTG for QA"!

and we all get to laugh and laugh

 

Since ATS seem to like to do routes for TSC around Manchester, which got me thinking. Their MAC route can be utilised for a few extensions. Not only, as previously mentioned, extend to Crewe, but after Stockport extend to Buxton or the Hope Valley Line to Sheffield. Also at Cheadle Hulme to Macclesfield or even further to Stoke on Trent.

Food for thought ATS!!!

 

An update to fix broken functionality of the route isn’t what I’d call supporting the route still, it’s just fixing errors that broke the route due to recent patches. i.e spawning on foot at a random destinations when choosing the Voyager. When I say “supporting” I mean it in terms of what comes after, a month, a year from now. The extension to Crewe that we all so passionately want. Tweaks, fixes I don’t consider support for the route that’s just keeping the player base happy and avoiding harsh criticism. i.e the dreaded suicidal passengers walking on to the track. If ever that issue was to ever a rise again, a fix would be sent out immediately.

I really hope one day in some random roadmap ATS announce a Crewe extension, but I just don’t see it ever happening. I know TSC has a lesser player base, but it still has a big following and people still pay big bucks for content and paid mods so I wouldn’t completely right it off yet. ATS know this and there’s money to be made otherwise they’d be focusing solely on TSW.

 

Erm.... You claimed in your earlier post it's abandonware. Yet you say a patch to fix issues isn't supporting the route post release, so you'd rather they left it broken? What reality are you currently living in may I ask?

Any bugs introduced by the Voyager, I believe, have also been fixed in the patch with pathing etc, this might not be down to ATS as the Voyager isn't their product, it's been shoe horned into the route after release. So randomly spawning in isn't a ATS issue, thats to do with the Voyager developer not testing it properly on the route.

ATS have explained their reasons for not wanting to do the extension, if you can't accept that, then sorry but that's something you've got to accept and move on with.

 

It’s highly unlikely there will be an extension to Crewe. The only ways extensions work in TSW is either as a free update or by releasing a new version of the route with the extension included. If ATS were to release an extended version of the route as a DLC it would have to be at a normal route price point as it would include everything and I’m not sure people who bought the original would enjoy buying it again. If they were to just extend it for free that would be at a big cost to them for no income and I really can’t see them doing that. It’s best to just accept it will never happen.

 

Take a look at the Fife circle Leven branch timetable. Skyhook posted on its socials they sent the timetable over to dtg months before it got released.

 

that has been proven not to be the case and another one of dtgs poor excuses.
Remember dtg said the 700 couldn’t be added to the BML. Well guess what the community done. Released a timetable with the 700

DTG claimed routes couldn’t be extended. Well look. What the community done took 2 routes merged them together. End result a route extension.

if you believe dtgs excuse then great for you.

 

So bugs that need to fixed by DTG and not ATS isn’t abandonware by ATS?

I have accepted the expansion isn’t going to happen, it’s you and others who seem to think it’s a possibility.

 

People who keep arguing about an extension to MAC, why don't you message Alan direct and ask him yourself?

Then if you don't like his reply argue with him.

I'm sure you can find contact info via email or DM.

 

l am sure Alan will be tuned into this thread.

 

The recent mod that someone has made that merges existing routes? That’s far from a saleable product that would work on both console and PC. DTG would require a much better system for merges or extensions than that hacked together PC only mod. It clones the routes for a start and that’s not the way to go. It’s obviously possible to knit two routes together but it’s quite another thing for it to work as a proper merged or extended TSW route and be possible on consoles. The modder has not proved anything. The only way it can work currently for proper releases is what I described.

 

What about Mildmay line. Although we have yet to recieve it he is extending the route to Richmond.

And we do know extentions are possible.

SEHS it was. But I believe it was said by DTG its not viable as a stand alone new route with the amount of work its pretty much like making new route financially.

So it would only make sense if it was included in an annual release package for them.

So its not counted out but it would mean one less new route to the annual edition just like this year and when we got the SEHS extension.

 

Don’t be silly that’s to easy to do and they will expect others to do the work for them

 

Mildmay is made by one dev and he has decided to do that extra work to extend the route. It was basically a hobby project anyway and he’s not paying staff like ATS would be if they were to extend, the only cost to him is his time. That’ll just be a free update when it’s done. It won’t be totally without recompense for him as some people who did not buy the half route will buy the full extended route. That could happen with the ATS route of course but proportionally not enough to cover the cost of development, which would be a monetary cost to ATS paying staff to develop the extension.

As you say, DTG have kind of got around the issue of players buying routes again for their extensions by including the routes they extended in the core bundles, and it’s believed that was the initial plan for the LIRR extension as well but there were issues that delayed the release so it became a mid-game DLC, although how true that is I don’t know. That’s only ever likely to happen with DTG’s own routes and I can’t see them including a third party route in a core bundle to facilitate an extension that way. If they were to do that with MAC (which they likely won’t) it would need to be a more substantial extension than just the missing section to Crewe to justify it, so would need to include a new train at the very least. The core bundle routes are the biggest selling routes so DTG would likely only want their own routes in the bundles anyway so if they do include an extended route in a future TSW it will be one of their own again.

 

Who's to say AABS wont look at a Crewe -Manchester once they've done TVL.. Better yet combine it with Stafford - Manchester via Stoke-on-trent!

 

That would be a major insult to ATS lol. It’s like look at what you can do, but we can do better. I think realistically it would be MAC to Stoke on Trent only.
MAC to Liverpool Lime Street could work too as it’s only 31 miles in length.

 

I've never once said I wanted an expansion. I've said that the reason it hasn't happened was explained by the studio lead.

Think you've got me confused with someone else.

And also you seem to have selective reading abilities. ATS are still fixing the route, DTG are holding the updates for a release schedule only DTG know about.

 

Well if you buy that story that’s your choice, I don’t!

Fixing a route isn’t supporting a route for future updates, fixing a route is expected of them if something breaks. Even the WCL another abandonware route would still receive patches. Our definition of “supporting a route” differs greatly.

We both never said we wanted an expansion, marvellous. I’m glad we cleared that up and can agree on that.

 

Ok then. Suggest you look up the definition of support and supporting then.

 

first person ever to claim that TSC makes more money than TSW.

 

Definitely not the first. No one truly knows how much revenue both games bring in.

Clearly you didn’t read my comment properly, so I’ll brake it down for you. Supporting is mandatory

 

come on all of you we are all adults here there is no need for the bickering to and fro between each other.