Francis Bougeois Is In The Game

I am confused.

Sir Peter Francis Lewis Bourgeois RA was an English landscape painter and history painter, and court painter to King George III

 

Not to change the subject to much, but wasn't Tim Dunn also the editor of Railways Illustrated many moons ago or am I thinking of someone else?

 

I think you may be referring to Pip Dunn.

 

Yes that's the one! Always get the two confused with each other!

 

In this case you Dunn wrong!

 

SonicScott91 don't worry mate, to be clear, I had no intention of targeting anyone here, and I wasn't aiming at anyone in particular.
My point was mainly to illustrate how things can happen, specifically abroad.

I'm sorry if anyone felt targeted, that was absolutely not my intention.

On the contrary, I was surprised by the generally very civil manner in which discussions are conducted here.

 

Because it’s 2026 and we have to be either overly mad or overly happy about everything. We aren’t allowed to see something and just keep moving on with our day and have no reaction to it.

 

It does make me chuckle to see people complain about him "damaging our image."

It may have escaped your notice, but we didn't have a "good image" anyway. He hasn't damaged it. He's turned his passion into a job and while he's not my cup of tea, I do respect him for that and wish him luck on Grand Tour.

 

I haven't seen much of Francis, but I have watched Geoff Marshall for years since the days he was on the Londonist on YouTube. His perspective on enthusiasm doesn't have to be limited to standing in the rain taking numbers off the front of trains, something I have never understood, but the inner workings of how the industry works and previews of its future. His 'Secrets of the Underground' series is something that is very interesting and extended into the Elizabeth Line and Overground. I do think rail enthusiasm is evolving into something new that may not be popular with some, but that will be of the benefit of everyone in the long run.

Just look at how Jerry Dyer (wishing him a speedy recovery) from Big Jet TV has impacted the aviation industry with his livestreams over the years. One stormy day changed his channel for the better when the country's media descended upon him as planes battled through high winds, resulting in his channel growing faster than an SR71 Blackbird. Since then, he has had people of all ages approaching him and talking about wanting to be part of the aviation industry.

If influencers can do this for rail and aviation, then shouldn't this boost be celebrated rather than dismissed because we may or may not like someone? These people are making niche hobbies more popular and the same goes with DTG with Train Sim World. I think its crazy to berate them for including Thomas the Tank Engine if the love of rail is growing on younger audiences. If anything, trying to keep it away from younger players on TSW IS damaging the image of rail enthusiasts as if older people were the gatekeepers.

 

I mean, literally what got me OUT of trains for a period of time was seeing all the spite and hatred toward Ed Dickens on places like TrainOrders. I remember being pretty excited the hear of the Big Boy getting restored, only to read constant messages over the course of the mid-2010's about they're ruining "Steve Lee's program".

A bit ironic to read now when you consider the Big Boy is probably the single biggest boon to US railfanning in recent years. And it's telling just how many people who've dealt with steam consistently praise the restoration effort, they clearly hired the right people to do it in retrospect. And it's pretty clear it's a well ran program with how much they've traveled it, and yet the machine has proven to be nothing less than a good, reliable runner.

Also, you mention Grand Tour, but it's funny seeing people talk about Francis as if he's doing a disservice, yet people talk up Top Gear as a effectively a untouchable classic. Yet I remember in the early 2010's watching some of their stuff and seeing serious car guys similarly dismiss it as "damaging to the image of cars", funny how times change as to what "proper" is.

 

Ah “influencer” the word that basically has no meaning. Would honestly love to know who and what these “influencers” have actually influenced.

 

I mean, yes, the terms a bit silly, what of it? Lord knows you can pick apart terms like "Triple A games" or "Blockbuster", Jim Sterling liked doing that with the former a lot. But what does complaining about the term really add to a conversation exactly? Like honestly as arbitrary as the term was I got pretty fed up with Jim Sterling putting on a silly voice and mocking it each time, the joke became old after a while. There's much better things to use your time on than complaining about it.

 

but yet here you are complaining about my comment. Ironic

 

All it means is how many likes and followers they have for their content. That’s how they get paid. How many are they actually “influencing” to get into whatever the hobby or topic is? Nobody can actually be sure since it’s hard to quantify that. But the metrics they are defined by are specifically those 2 things.

 

I'm not sure Steve Marsh or Scott from "Trains, Planes & Everything" would class themselves as influencers, but I know they have influenced me into making similar journeys they have done.

 

Yeah.. trainspotting wasn’t cool when I was a kid either.. I kept it to myself.. I drove trucks for a living and love a nice well turned out truck but you’d never have caught me Eddie spotting…

 

Rather than backlash, you’ve really hit the ultimate diversity and inclusion BS nail right on the head. Oh how these people like to look good. . Guy Martin never does anything for ‘likes’.. he does it because he’s interested and loves engineering. Read his books.
Gary Lineker is another guy who falls into the ‘doing stuff to look good’ category. Comes across all nice when he’s in front of the camera but out of shot he was an arse.. and that’s from the guy that gave us the stadium tour at White Hart Lane.Great goal scorer but a nasty human being!

 

There is absolutely nothing wrong with inclusion, equity and diversity. In fact, this is extremely important for a society to work

 

DEI is hiring based on tick box targets and it’s plain wrong and it’s discrimination with a fancy name. It’s not based on who’s best for the job. Would you rather the pilot of your plane be a DEI hire or the most qualified pilot? If you’d rather the DEI hire then I want to be on a different plane to you.

 

Bit harsh to judge someone on one experience no? We're all guilty of having bad days, and maybe our communication with others in whatever form wasn't the greatest. He used to take his daughter to a school near my secondary one, and would see him regularly and asked him to sign my school planner once. As you can imagine MANY from my school did the same. He was great when I met him, where he had every reason to not be happy as he was just going about his day when I stopped him, and from everything I heard it was the same with the other kids in the school at the time. This would've been around 2009/10.

 

I mean if you presume that someone who is in anyway different to you, or what you perceive to be ‘correct’, to be a ‘DEI hire’ - then your issue is not with diversity in the workplace.

 

You know exactly what a DEI hire is. It’s someone chosen over another because they fit the required or chosen demographic at the expense of someone who doesn’t. Not someone chosen purely on ability. That is discrimination. My friends grand daughter is a model. Or was. DEI means she gets almost no work now. So that’s fair is it? That’s not discrimination against her?

In case it’s not 100% clear…I want the BEST pilot. I’m not quite 6ft.. if the best pilot is 6’ 6” or 4’ 11”, I don’t care.

Which pilot would you have? The best one or the one other one?

Or let’s put it another way…. If you ran your own business, would you want the best, the most productive, the most qualified to produce the most profit and provide your customers with the best product or service, whoever they were or would fill your business with employees selected purely on filling a quota who would ultimately damage your business as they’ve not been selected purely on ability?

 

Maybe your friends Granddaughter doesn't get work anymore because other models are deemed more suitable.

DEI isn't a bad thing. It means other people getting a decent chance at work. Something that would be denied them because of who they are.

 

Folks, we don't need politics in here. There are LOTS of places on the internet to get political; I "drive" and talk about trains to escape from politics.

 

I have a bone to pick when you say you want the best pilot. I think you picked the worst example lol.

I've attained my PPL and am planning to continue towards my CPL in the future, and the thing that you probably do not know is that so many people start learning to fly to only drop out of flight school when they realise how much hard work you need to put in. It sounds glamorous and the first few hours are pretty fun, but once the lessons get more serious as the instructors are aware you are in it for the long haul it's tough. The amount of self-studying you have to do is immense - a lot of the stuff I learnt is university level, for example the aerodynamics side is all second year level content (verified with a friend who studies Aerospace Engineering). You have to do that level of content across 9 'modules' and achieve 75% to pass, and that is only the first step of many.

Let's say even if a commercial pilot was hired for specific reason (I am keeping it vague as I am focussing on the pilot comment, nothing else!!!), I would fully trust them to fly me as I understand that the level of training they had to undertake is immense, to get as far as they did shows that they have the level of self-discipline required and to even secure a job with an airline must mean their employer sees good value in them.

 

I think, on the contrary, it was a good example. He could have cited a surgeon as well.
You say the plane pilots are all good.
However, some are better than others, and those are the ones you should choose.
It is precisely for the most important things that we must not allow ourselves to select based on fanciful criteria.

 

I'd say a surgeon is a pretty bad example as well. In both cases you need very high levels of training. Since you will be responsible for a number of peoples lives, the minimum standards are very high and non-negotiable. Any 'fanciful criteria' won't actually have that much of an effect on the quality of the hires.

 

For a seocnd I thought I was in the DTG TRAIN SIM WORLD forum clearly I am not.

 

Well you heard it here first folks, giving opportunities to minorities who may not typically get said opportunities is somehow discrimination...

 

Can we stop talking about your opinions on DEI before this thread gets closed?

Unless we feel this thread has served its case, in which case please go ahead so the mods can close it because we don’t need to hear more uninformed opinions on DEI.

 

Completely agree and the fact Jan has even commented as such and people still carry on perhaps he needs to give people a little break and time to read the rules.