What’s Going On With The Class 90?

The answer is yes, the question we all are asking is when, and the answer to that is somewhere between now and the heat death of the known universe.

 

Would be nice to get class 90 patch soon. It’s gathering dust on my collection so far haha

 

Is that before or after the promised patch for the BR188 sounds that DTG promised us they had taken in house to fix?

 

we have an anouncment coming, about the plans for a patch as well as news for on whats next for the class 90 (even money bet ATS announces the passenger 90 DLC)

 

They wouldn’t dare, oh wait this is TSW in 2026 ofcourse they’d dare and then promise to back port the update and fixes to the original shortly after release(which will never materialise) just for everyone to find on purchase that the new improved version fixes nothing and introduces 20 new bugs. It is the way.

 

DTG and Rivet did a similar thing with the Scotrail class 170 and the WMT/XC 170 and ECW 171 - i always have a small hope that each new time will be different from the last but a pattern is a pattern is a pattern

 

I’ve said this before but I’ll say it again my faith with DTG is less than with the UK politicians. I don’t believe a word any of them say, not because I’m cynical by nature but because none of them could tell the truth if theirs and their most loved one lives depended on it, least alone some punter who they are relying on for their next pay check

 

Jane, as in MML-Jane???
O-M-G
Being screwed and no lessons learned. We're doomed.
"Me Tarzan ....... you Jane." Or was it "You Tarzan ....... Me Jane? Never mind ...

 

Actually we don’t think so now. It was a typo and referred to “Jan”. Back to your lives citizens, as they say.

 

This dlc and failed attempt to build a cl.90 is a total joke.

This thread should be full of excitement about finally having a stock what some tsw players waited since 2017!, instead i read 5 pages full of annoyance. Well done ATS.

A locomotive like the legendary cl.90 for tsw, deservese a competent dev willing to go the extra mile. I hope this dlc gets deleted from the store and JT takes over with their quality standard.

 

Thank the Omnissiah, this is excellent news!

 

good to see that the issues are finally being addressed and they’ve actually laid out a longer term plan too. better late than never, but this cannot happen again, regardless of the route, loco, or developer

 

Glad fixes are coming but the fact that so much of it had to be basically reworked from the ground up…

 

Good news… so far as it goes. But it would have been a more sincere solution to add, “Nevertheless we appreciate the utter disappointment many customers have experienced and understand if you don’t want to wait for the fixes. Accordingly, we have agreed with all sales platforms it will be possible to obtain a full refund over and above any normal policy.”

 

Basically.

Upon testing ATS found issues, that they tried to fix very late into the release slot.
ATS attempted to push a fix out, which DTG never tested.
DTG released the DLC in usual "get it out there" style.
The fix resulted in ATS realising there was a bigger issue.
Alan releases a statement on YouTube acknowledging bigger issues now exist.
DTG say nothing, bury their heads in the sand.

 

I agree with the others about this being good news, but the fact remains about why has it taken this long for you to even inform us, let alone give outlines of what you're doing to fix this, most of this b_ll_x could have been easily avoided with better coms from both yourselves and ATS, we are not asking for much (most of us) just a simple affirmation of yes there are problems, yes we are fixing them, once we know what they are, we will let you know once we have a roadmap, as opposed to this where we have had months of silence, and you just skipped to the last part.

 

Finally some good news on the class 90

 

It's good news and I look forward to the fixes.

But I hope the lesson has been learned that it's not ok to put a DLC out with known issues that are this significant. There should have at least been an extended refund window when it was clear how bad the issues are.

 

I’ll believe this once and only once the patch is in my hands. We’ve been promised so much by DTG that has never been delivered, so DTG statements and words no longer have meaning.

 

I recommend you guys don’t screw this up, I mean support for DTG and few third parties has went massively downhill and new sims are now appearing

 

I’m still not buying it until it’s added to other timetables. I’m not interested in driving it up and down an half empty WCMLS.

 

I'm waiting to see what happens with the timetables too. For me it was a bigger issue than the bugs.

 

Alan has said there are plans to add the Class 90 to the MAC route.

 

that’s not good enough, it’ll be 20 minute runs on a blurry route. a solution needs to be found to get it onto the other wcml routes

 

I've been reading both threads about this, but if you all don't mind me asking: why has the reaction to ATS's Class 90 been so intense that it has resulted in a joint statement? Normally, broken DLC releases seem to be met with the usual complaints about bugs and lack of communication, but they rarely reach this level of response. For example, issues with the MAC, WCL, and Athena's ECML Railtour Pack didn't result in joint statements and, in some cases, still haven't been fully fixed. What is it about the Class 90 situation that has generated such a strong reaction compared to other problematic DLC releases?

 

Probably the straw that broke the camel's back i would imagine, it's been simmering for a while.

 

The only thing that ever makes a difference: money.

DTG must have suffered actual financial consequences for their mismanagement this time around and were forced into "action" as a result.

I put action in scare quotes because they haven't actually done anything so far besides a PR statement. This is the games development version of a political "blue-ribbon commission".

Count me very skeptical that this release will ever be brought up to standard.

 

Unless you never play with safety systems on it literally does not work at all on consoles. I do not class trying to move the curser to the AWS acknowledge button as an acceptable workaround. Trainsimulatordriver could not even get the Xbox version to start to move with safety systems on.

 

Its the console users i feel sorry for, at least as PC players we have a ton of amazing moders to help us alleviate or even fix a lot of issues.

 

This sounds very concerning to me:

• Overhauled Speed Set System: We have completely overhauled the Speed Set system. The original implementation has been removed and rebuilt from the ground up to utilise DTG’s core Simugraph framework with minimal code intervention, ensuring it now functions reliably in line with expected behaviour.
• Tandem Operations & Brake Logic: We have re-coded the direction and power logic for tandem driving following DTG’s specific technical recommendations.
  • Fixed the DSD issue that caused an unrecoverable brake dump.
  • Fixed the parking brake logic so they can no longer be engaged or released while the train is moving.

And also this:
"Whilst this development has been challenging for both ourselves and DTG - learning the finer details of Simugraph and Unreal Engine have been steps on this journey, and DTG have been reviewing the available documentation support and processes they can offer new developers - we believe the lessons we've learnt will make our future projects together stronger. We look forward both future improvements and Add-ons with all the above in mind."

So actually, they where just doing something, not following guidelines or using the right tools, not knowing how or when to use Simugraph and the right documentation wasn't there. Besides this, it also made clear the knowledge about UE wasn't the best and DTG didn't notice anything in testing process and just released it the way it was. This statement makes pretty clear, the kind of mess it is behind the scenes, at least in relation to 3rd party developers.

 

It’s nice the PC community have a work around with a temporary mod, doesn’t help the console players though.
The amount of “from the ground up” work that has changed is troubling, why was this sold in such a diabolical state to begin with.

I feel like the Q and A team had their concerns, but DTG told them to bury them under the rug. I mean the proof is there, look at how much they’re changing with the current build. It’s that whole “we’ll fix it later” mentality again.

It’s very disappointing to read that the loco is still restricted to the WCMLS, so with that info that’s a huge pass from me. I’ll happily stick to my shed for the time being, until the Class 90 can spread her wings some more (other routes).

 

this is the most un-ready dlc that’s ever come out in tsw. normally most of us can tolerate a few bugs because it’s inevitable that there’ll always be something, but the silence and excuses have made the whole situation even worse. the 90 never should’ve shipped to platform stores, and should’ve been withdrawn shortly after to allow for it to be improved to an acceptable standard

 

And yet even now, with this admission and statement, the item is still on sale at full price in the various e-stores.

 

Too be fair it’s planned after MAC’s update

 

and when that’s coming, who knows. by all accounts the mac update should’ve dropped months before the 90 yet here we are with no updates and both items in an unacceptable state

 

Either that or ATS assured DTG that improvements were made and DTG trusted them too much. "There were clear missteps in both our communication and development processes during the final stages before release, and both teams take full ownership of our respective parts in that" could mean anything. A more detailed post-morten of where the breakdowns were would be nice to see.

 

reading through the statement yet again, it’s become clear that ats would’ve known weeks ago that major reworks were required. WHY were the paying customers not told in april that we’d be waiting months for it to be fixed. the situation would still be shambolic and unacceptable, but it still wouldn’t be as bad as this

 

The way the statement is written they knew it was broken before one copy was sold.

 

Ideally this would be perfect on the Daventry services and liners north of MKC. fingers crossed this gets expanded, it's clear from this thread a lot of people are eager to see this addon utilised to it's full potential.

 

I believe ATS went a different way around using Simugraph. In a clip I saw Alan explain that Simugraph relies on manufacturer data (i.e. power, weight, ect) but they went a different route and utilised a real Class 90 driver to help test the 90 and get it as accurate as possible, so were testing different combinations instead of using the official data for the Class 90.

I am probably forgetting a lot as I watched this clip only once quite a while back but it was along those lines. I'd assume with the amount of (supposed) iterations they had to do to get it accurate as according to a real driver a reasonable amount of testing should have been undertaken, but clearly something has gone wrong.

 

Yes I agree. Let’s face it the TT’s are the main part of the game.

 

According to the preview 90 stream it was meant to drop basically right at the start of tsw 6 as in it was submitted to DTG a month or two into tsw 6 so I don’t know any more

 

As they now did rebuild it completely, it looks like the used method did not turn out that great. Details are missing why they rebuild it, but the fact it was released this way at first and needed a complete rebuild after release is telling something about testing.