General Discussion Is Gone

Out of interest, what happened to the additional forum moderators that were selected from the community to support the forum day to day running .?

 

yeah, especially when being polite literally doesnt cost anything or require exceptional effort

 

You are making an entirely different point than mine.
I'm not saying it's "more likely to be fixed" in Discussion.

I'm saying Feedback forums won't provide feedback on things that DTG doesn't already know about. Players can't create threads in Feedback, so how would DTG know what they don't know? And they only create Feedback threads on DLC...not on anything specific to the core or game in general.

If I have a general game issue, DTG doesn't know about it, I can't TELL them about it since I can't create a thread.

If it gets brought up in GD, then it's at least a chance to tell someone because you CAN make a thread, and it's not tied to something else or told "well that doesn't belong here." The beauty of GD is that you can post anything, even if it doesn't "fit" into a box created by DTG.

If it has to be moved to that section (like suggestions or bug report) then that's easy enough to do. However, the thread exists...whereas you can't make a feedback thread so many things would never be known about at all.

That's what GD is for.

Not that it's "more effective" but that it catches things that wouldn't exist or be known.

That and it's where COMMUNITY exists. Where would the "awesome services" thread go otherwise? Where would general opinion polls go? Or any other general community interaction not tied to a specific DLC?

At best you can say "Off Topic" but.... it's not "off topic" since much of it is about the game still and then you just have General Discussion with a different name. Off Topic is in particular for non-TSW stuff. GD has a unique place and role.

 

It’s not just that, but there have been pretty significant changes to routes that so-happened to be heavily discussed in GD. Notably the TSW2 version of SEHS received lots of discussion & received seldom seen updates between preview & release.

WCMLS was another hot topic in GD, notably one of few routes that got consistent large updates.

The feedback threads of course serve their use as they are, but typically those have always been more technically oriented where players rightly put the genuinely critical issues, however the creative side of feedback more often than not comes from GD.

Also, unless they plan to change when they put discussion articles for specific content up, we’ve always had the community discussion posts surrounding known routes - often months before a DTG post we can comment on is posted.

Those points specifically are where my main issue is with this decision, I’d like to be able to discuss a route without having to converse around bug reports, I’d also like to leave my bug reports without the thread being filled with discussion. Removing GD is going to absolutely tank any excitement about inbound content as you’ll have to wait until DTG want to make that post, which as above happens much much later after it’s become known.

 

Who here would be willing to volunteer as moderators if asked? I'm pretty sure that'd be the next objection "we can't find anyone to help with the workload?" I'd do it if pushed, but I think there are far better people here with a better temperament for it =-)

 

And closing down the general forum section will help in what way? It's not like that people who cannot be bothered with using the forum search functionality will be bothered not placing their repretitive topic into another forum section, if the general section is not there....

Anyway, this whole post reads... weird to me... In way it's like a dev saying that he/she spends too much time fixing bugs, as an explanation for why the company he/she works for is reducing the ability of people to report bugs...

It's not like you, candacedtg, is clamping down on the forum, becasue it's too much work for you... This is not your personal forum, or something where you dedicate your free time into (if you do... you realy shouldn't ).. It is a company ran forum, and I imagine that all those points you're presenting here to us, were also presented to those people that hold the reigns...

And the decision, of DTG, was that the benefits of having an active community forum is not worth the investment it takes to have that forum moderated. You can try to sugar-coat it with buzzwords like 'strealime', 'effectivity'..etc, or try to play the empathy card. But it's a company business decision.

And yes, feedbacks section, creative section..etc will stay open, but you must be aware that, with this decision, the volume of people visiting this forums will decrease, thus the activity also in those sections will take a dive. Because lowering the active userbase is, I feel, the only way how to decrease the load on the moderators.

 

It's quite clear to see the reason DTG are doing this to stop general customer criticism

There is another way this can be achieved and we, not DTG, will be in control of

Stop being customers of DTG

We have to face facts DTG are an awful company with poor practices in place to try to cover up that fact.

I mean seriously, they said on the last roadmap stream that they have mitigated blurry textures with products going forward. That statement was proved to be a lie within 24hrs with the release of Trent Valley

Time to put the sword to this company by closing our wallets. It's the only way things will change

 

That's a great point. Like the community discussion of the Class 70 or the Crewe to Preston route. I THINK that's useful to DTG and Devs to point out any potential issues and expectations early before release. After can be too late. Can also judge interest as well.
I KNOW it's a great advantage to the community to discuss it. If everything is after the fact, that's often too late to be useful.

Even outside of the DLC, just people pointing to an interest in ECML routes (kind of tired of the WCML) or wanting a Class 66 alternative... those aren't things that are related to a specific DLC. More a "general" game thing.

 

Fair enough I was referring to someone taking about feedback for specific DLC, or I thought I was!

I don't want to see this forum closed any more than you do.

Whether it turns out to be a bad thing then only time will tell.

Personally I will miss a lot of the nice discussion but won't miss the unpleasantness. I am sure there will be somewhere else to congregate.

 

Yes GD is basically the only place for particular points of feedback too, quite a lot of discussion happens around core gameplay elements, from suspension to route art & from gen8 discussion to route era being skewed in one direction. A lot of points don’t fit into the box of singular DLC feedback posts.

The other problem is how often outstanding issues within 3P routes are immediately rebutted by them as a core problem & not relevant to their feedback. Given how much 3P content there is now & how little first party stuff gets released, where will that feedback actually go & have something done with?

 

An active fanbase is its own blessing and curse.
While the crowd can get wild, it's also their greatest marketing tool, not because of the official announcements, but because people engage with the "community" and get excited about the game, sharing their experiences.

I know I would not have gotten far into TSW without the diverse community here that were super helpful and encouraging. It it were just a list of DLC release articles, I wouldn't have gotten so deep into the game or bought nearly as much. That's for me what has set TSW apart from a lot of other games I've stopped playing.

Taking the activity away from the active fanbase sterilizes it and will cause traffic here to plummet. As a byproduct, there won't be many eyeballs to see those DLC press releases and thus buy more content. Again, I'm not making any threats.... just observing that it's happened to other games as a byproduct of alienating the fanbase. It's not so much a "boycott" as just drifting away to somewhere else that has an active community.

Right now the "marketing" and "tech support/playtesting" parts of this forum are piggybacking on the huge draw of the General Discussion community. It's what brings eyeballs to the forum. If people get bored and lose interest, they won't see stuff you want to sell either. It's basically free advertising to a willing audience that yes takes some work to manage, but also is a huge source of income.

When those "creators" (youtube,twitch, social media) refer to "discussion on the forums" about something and that gets out to their fans watching reviews of TSW....that's THIS forum in large part. That's more often than not the GD part.

 

I just popped over to the Discord "discussion" section to give it another go. It's the equivalent of walking into a room and everyone is in the middle of a conversation, or several conversations over the top of each other, no idea what's going on – so I walked back out and quietly shut the door behind me.

 

Thinking this over more, I guess I can sort-of understand the logic behind trying to keep discussions relevant and on-topic, and trying to control the proliferation of multiple threads about the same subject. I can even sort-of understand the ideas behind trying to limit/cull any fire-stokey echo-chamber moanfests where people just call each other names and descend into typical internet nastiness.

What I don't understand is the complete blanket ban of user-started threads, which is what GD is all about. I come here to stumble over things I didn't know about, news I missed, bugs and general railway crack. If that goes then this place is very much diminished - the good content here far outweighs the trolls and muppets.

Maybe I'm mistaken, but it seems the intention going forward is only to allow us to discuss defined topics - announcements, DLC feedback etc - there'll be plenty of "it's the end of TSW" and "fix the frappin blurries already"-type comments to police in those, let alone all the other spouts that immediately crop up (multiple times!) whenever anything new happens in TSW. But where do we discuss other stuff without it getting booted out as "off topic"???

My suggestion is to allow us to submit a new thread for discussion, but it has to be approved before it is made public...?

 

That describes my feeling of Discord as well, and it is exactly why I don't like it. Maybe Discord is fine for the young people who want everything right now and get restless if they can't get the answer they want within two minutes of asking. For me, it's a hopeless mess.

The old fashioned forums like this are far more easier to use, browse and find information from. I have gotten wealth of information from here, anything from gameplay tips to accounts from people who either have or still are working in real world railways and offering their insights. As far as I can see, there is no way for the Feedback and Troubleshooting forums alone to replace that, unless their scope is reviewed and broadened accordingly (which would in turn make them more like a general discussion forum anyway).

 

Easier to search old threads too for answers.
Plus they come up on google.

 

Discord is just IRC with a fresh paintcoat(yes, I'm that old ).
Great chatting tool, terrible tool for having persistent discussion that also builds a knowledge base of the community.

 

Yep, it's an absolute mess, I tried it a couple of times but I just can't keep up with it, the thing is absolute [EDIT - Language]. and I won't be going back for a third time.

 

as a young person, it’s the worst possible place to engage with tsw. everything about it is just not what i want, the forums suit me very well and it’s a massive shame that we’ll lose that in a few days time

 

Just want to note that a new DLC releases today and, as of this moment, neither the "Out now" article nor the feedback thread has a single comment.

Everyone is talking about DTG nuking the forums instead.

Is the GP60M any good? Should i buy it?

Who knows, but clearly this isn't the place to find out anymore.

But, hey, it makes it slightly easier for them to manage so we should just give it a chance, right?

 

I thought when we had the Leaks of WCMLs ahead of the TSW5 official release there was an announcement made pertaining to the addition of a small number of well respected community members who would be helping to moderate the forums, especially at times where the community team might not ordinarily be around?

Did I dream that?

 

You know this post is exactly why they would say uncontrolled general discussion forum is bad. Instead of using the forums for its purpose you focus on the drama instead. People in this thread will not buy the GP60 DLC anyways as they are enraged and threatening to boycott DLC sales.

 

Sounds like we need a general discussion around US content & why it seems so unpopular in TSW, we should discuss how to improve its potential & what the community would like to see from that side of things.

Oh wait…

 

It rings a bell in my mind, but maybe we shared that dream.

Either way, it's a good idea. Other forums operate this way.

 

I've always used the General Discussion to find out info on add-ons and enhancements not available through DTG like GodMode, Annotations, JetWash's lighting enhancements, etc. These have been essential components for the PC platform. I feel like the home for this kind of information is going away. We still need a moderated area for "miscellaneous" topics that are important to customers.

 

ey from a fellow dinosaur here ... I hated it tho, didnt use it much cos it would get very chaotic very quickly

 

Oh wow, this forum is disappearing? It's a shame. For me, I'll probably become even less invested in the game. Discord is nice, but conversations are fleeting. But of course, that's probably the point of it all.

Still, I can understand the decision. This is certainly the most toxic forum I've ever been part of. An unfortunate combination of a number of highly obstinate members and staff who never seem to have the full authority to tell the rest of us what we want to know.

 

I agree, even though I personally do not use mods or other customizations. Your point is valid, though. I'd like to know what section would be the appropriate one in the future if I wish to ask other users how a particular new DLC runs with someone who has a similar system specs, for example. That kind of information can be crucial when deciding whether to spend the money on the add-on or not. It doesn't really fit into the current feedback or troubleshoot forums, does it?
Anyway, I do recognize that DTG has the need to do something, considering the abuse/flaming/trolling that's been happening. I just wish that they won't throw out the baby with the bathwater.

 

I've seen a couple of people claim that users will no longer be able to start threads, but never saw mention of that from DTG staff. It's not in the announcement either. What's the source for this?

 

Maybe it's because you can't start topics in the news and feedback subforums.

 

It’s not blanket, you’ll probably still be able to start them in suggestions etc, but anywhere the discussion will matter (feedback, article etc) will need to wait for DTG to create a post for you to reply on.

It basically curtails any discussion about a route or feature until DTG say otherwise & even then it will have to be relevant. Of course suggestions might fit but at that point you’re basically repurposing it to GD anyway (though suggestions IMO has been in need of reshaping for a while, it’s ironic that’s escaped the chopping block as it’s easily the most detracted from its purpose).

 

I've left a whole pile of addons in my wishlist for ages after issue upon issue with them. Killing this forum off might be the final straw for me to just admit I should play what I have and enjoy that and simply ignore any future versions.It's how I've learnt loads about how to set up graphics improvements, improve frame rates, find some 3rd party addons/mods. And as a PC player I'm increasingly fed up with the constant issues with console versions that then seem to drag the PC offering down too. Thanks t's been a ride and I've enjoyed sinking money into Train Simulator and TSW but I think we reached the buffers. (off to delete all those addons from my wishlist now so temptation doesn't get the better of me!).

 

Oh, closing up general thread? Really, DTG? C'm on! I can probably understand wanting to clean up "useless" or "unnecessary" posts/forum sections... But removing its heart? Two scenarios here: the closure of the entire forums (deeply concerned about this) migrating entirely to Discord; the desire to keep under strict control what can be expressed here (another valid concern). I think this would be a crazy and senseless choice, as this is the very core of the entire community and the place where every user can express themselves directly on many current hot topics!
Personally, as an Italy-based user, I've been a member of a local Discord community for some time now, with over 1K Italian-speaking guys. That Discord is excellent, and we're forming a truly connected and constructive community! As for me, still think DTG has made its worst move in a long time; hope they'll reconsider their actions! Don't know what to say, really...

 

Let me correct you again!

we are losing a key platform for communication and engagement with the community that has helped TSW since the beginning.

 

I think it has more to do with self satisfaction/validation that they can start the threads and others agree with their points.

Its more about status and likes than actual feedback.

Or socializing for some reason.

All I know is that all the GD section has done is made me frustrated even more at the game over bugs I don't even notice.

When ever I asked a question I would get 5 sarcastic replies and 1 legitimate one.

Oh and how dare you say you actually enjoy something only to be called a DTG fanboy.

Good riddance in my opinion it mostly just spread hate.

 

Your reply just sums up why they need to go.

Nice little dig "Let me correct you, again comment."

This is the reason we can't have nice things.

 

Read the comments and likes again.

Oh and another little dig at a different opinion towards another user.

Exactly why they are closing the GD l.

Thanks for proving my points

 

oh the absolute irony, it’s okay if you say something sarcastic, but god forbid everyone else does!

You are just as bad as the people you criticise.

I have every right to make my reply, just as much as you have a right to express your views.

I don’t think you realise how serious this is, the CORE COMMUNICATION is being SHUT OFF. We CANT speak about issues in the game anymore, it’s deeply concerning.

It is not because of people like me the forums are being shut down. It’s DTGs censorship.

if DTG really wanted to do something about it, they would get more moderation here.

if DTG has any shred of a backbone, they would revert this change.

 

Comments like this are the problem, there's no need for you to send this, it achieves nothing other than to annoy people and try to start some argument. If you hate the general forums so much, why are you always here?

 

I'm not always here.

I spend most time while on the forums in the news, feedback and suggestions section.

Anyways this thread has seemed to turn into if you agree with DTG your wrong and we will push you out of this thread.

Just one of the exact reasons they want to shut it down. If you don't agree with the consensous get out. And we will gang up to push you.

Look in the mirror folks.

 

Some people on this thread need to wind there necks in and respect how others feel.

 

of the whole thread? can do, it’ll only reiterate the overwhelming consensus. there’s a danger of this thread being locked if this continues, so i’ll leave it at that but you need to understand that you’re in the minority here

 

Also I never said anyone was wrong in any of my comments I just stated my opionion.

Yet you are saying I'm wrong, not I disagree with you.

 

It's like come in to steam topics and say "that's because of your criticism we don't have steam in this game anymore".
If you not interesting, then why are you wasting your time? Just because someone have a "wrong" opinion?

 

So thats fine because Im in a minority, and don't agree with you I don't have right to share my opinion.

But if you agree go ahead.

I thought this was a General Discussion forums?