Airedale And Wharfdale Lines Disscusion

It still baffles me why they don't use a realistic set of UK speed signs like Firefly/ATS. Should be a simple thing really, makes a route more realistic looking. But looking forward to the route anyway.

 

So, at first glance, it actually looks good – can we please stop this? ‘Rivet this’, ‘Rivet that’. Yes, back in the TSW 2 days with Lucerne Sursee… It really is bad, especially as I cycle past there every day, but since the TSW 4 days I’d say Rivet has improved a lot. I thought ‘Riviera’ in particular was beautiful. Yes, perhaps not quite as good as TSG or JT, but still very lovely. I don’t know, do you work for the railways? If so, it’s just that when you know something very well, you tend to look at it more closely (Lucerne–Sursee) but in my case, I’d just wait and see for now.

 

Those playable service numbers don't particularly encourage me: 260 playable services and 36 AI services without the 333, and 360 playable and 84 AI services with it. Considerably more services on Aire and Wharfe are worked by 333s in real life, far more than 100 per day. There seems to be a lot of AI services considering this is supposed to be a complete network. Hopefully I'm wrong and the stream later clarifies the situation.

If they spew out a naff prototypical timetable with 331s over-represented just to accommodate the questionable decision to flog the 333 as a deluxe train, I won't be investing in this.

 

Bit disappointed with the announced layers at leeds. No voyager or 800s running through leeds. Hopefully the ai stock adds a bit if realism.

 

I mean 100 services seems fine, the 331’s today are running what, say a third of all services? Especially now 333’s are operating to Doncaster also.

I assume the 333 will substitute into the 331 timetable too.

There is only something in the order of 150-200 services over the working day, on the triangle services.

Most of the other traffic will be depot shunts & out beyond Skipton. Plenty of AI opportunities at Leeds too, so seems about right to me. Don’t get me wrong, there should absolutely be more 333’s than 331’s (on the triangle runs) so if it’s the other way around I’ll certainly add my complaints about that to the list.

I do share the concerns over the wording of the layering in one of the other articles, I do hope they aren’t leaving stuff out despite the available rolling stock being in TSW - there is already enough missing we won’t see due to not having correct trains & ToC’s.

 

I'll judge it based on the stream, not some carefully curated static screenshots and a 2 minute "showcase" video clip. I sincerely hope Rivet have nailed it and it's more Riviera level than Cardiff or West Cornwall. But when it comes to that developer I'm afraid we have been bitten too many times not to take a pragmatic and level headed look at it. Put it this way, tonight's stream is the last chance to convince me to buy at least the Standard version rather than take the free update.

 

Yeah... Can you tell me whats so special about the 333? Cause I'm between the free starter pack and the deluxe version, cause if I buy TSW 7 then I want the ICE 4 which comes in the deluxe version.

 

I personally am very careful around Rivet. Riviera was good and Tyler makes a very good timetable which proves they can do it when they put their minds to it. I found the 171 pack for ECW a little underwhelming (apart from the timetable which is fantastic).

Personally my experiences (like a few others) with rivet are very mixed and I just personally wish they'd put that little bit more time and care into their content. Hopefully we'll see a good improvement in this preview!

 

The 333 is a unique looking unit that’s spent most its life confined to a local, small commuter circuit, so it’s pretty rare to see in person, unless you specifically go to Leeds to get on one, or commute on its route. Recently though it is finding its way to more cities as Northern are expanding its diagrams.

It does share its looks with another UK train (332) but that’s now out of service.

You couldn’t have the Airedale & Wharfedale network set in the 21st Century, without the 333. Aside from it being the main rolling stock there (which is why it’s abit naff that DTG locked it into a separate pack), it’s just too unique among the UK’s stock fleet to avoid. You couldn’t realistically swap this out for another unit as it’s practically a mobile landmark of the area it serves.

 

Would be great to use the 333 on Great Western Express for Heathrow Express for AI

 

It would have been far better to have made the 333 the supplied EMU and the 331 the Deluxe additional item. I suppose if you buy Standard can always add the 333 when it drops to £7.50 in a sale next year.

 

Lack of XC layers is very poor, considering Leeds already too quiet with nothing to represent TPE services. I’m falling out of love with this release already.

 

Regarding the timetable, I've just done some research using RealTimeTrains fleet search (https://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/search/fleetsearch). I think you need a subscription for this.
Here's a count of today's services for the 331 and 333:
331:
Skipton to Leeds 39
Leeds to Skipton 38
Leeds to Bradford Forster Square 7
Bradford Forster Square to Leeds 7
Leeds to Ilkley 23
Ilkley to Leeds 24
Bradford Forster Square to Ilkley 9
Ilkley to Bradford Forster Square 8
Skipton to Bradford Forster Square 6
Bradford Forster Square to Skipton 6
Total: 167

333:
Skipton to Leeds 10
Leeds to Skipton 11
Leeds to Bradford Forster Square 19
Bradford Forster Square to Leeds 20
Leeds to Ilkley 21
Ilkley to Leeds 21
Bradford Forster Square to Ilkley 19
Ilkley to Bradford Forster Square 18
Skipton to Bradford Forster Square 21
Bradford Forster Square to Skipton 20
Total:180

There are also a few depot services and some Bradford to Shipley services missing from my list, but not many. There are only about 20 800/801 services I could find and I doubt there will be that many freight services.
In other words, while I suspect there are some 333 services missing, I also think we are probably getting more 331 services than in reality. We'll find out in 15 minutes anyway.

 

The Crosscountry Voyager isn't even layered in? I hope the timetable doesn't turn out to be another Rivet Special™ !!!

 

I think the article only lists driveable layers, so may not rule out having the Voyager as AI

 

Keighley And Worth Valley? Finished it mate.

Heh heh. I went and travelled the route last weekend. Its bloody lovely, especially the the Keighley and Worth Valley heritage station.


PS If the round block of flats is missing the live size cut out of Mr Bean (thats been there 20 years) then I'm asking for a refund! :P

 

Yup, been a theme with all 3 launch routes so far, pretty silly they haven’t been listing the routes in full detail - certainly wouldn’t be interested in them solely from those articles.

In any case the article for this route lists a few extra things in a paragraph, such as railtours, RHTT & AI etc, which wouldn’t be possible from the actual stock listed - clearly not a complete list.

 

Stream late yet again.
The respect shown to customers is awesome.
Ever heard that lateness is a discourtesy to others?

 

Maybe it is a technical issue or maybe they are deliberately trying to annoy you!

 

Why would they be DTG in every other way but have their punctuality under control?

 

That’s if the game doesn’t crash or bug out during the 4 1/2 session.

 

DTG obviously thinks 19:00 BST is 19:05.

 

Oh no. RIVET

 

Phew, tough crowd tonight.

This is the sort of UK electric network I've wanted for years. Without doubt the most exciting release since BML for me.
I know the area quite well but have usually had a car so the only station I've traveled to is Leeds. So I'm not going to be picking holes in anything other than really obvious mistakes.

 

Be sure to remind him he has WCL on his CV.

 

Not watching the stream live as we are currently watching Stranger Things, but the suspicion is confirmed then. Watch closely folks, need to know if this is Riviera or Cardiff standard. Look for missing (if any) mile posts, Roblox buildings and stations with no frontage.

 

About to have dinner so I'll come back and see what all you rivet counters have to say about the route in half an hour.

 

Some people are obsessed

 

I feel an opportunity was missed to include the KWVR. I would have bought the route just for that.

 

We are an hour in and there is still only one rivet person on the stream, for anyone keeping score.

 

No-one's spotted an electrical cabinet in the wrong place yet then.

 

Looks nice so far, having just gotten to Skipton. Certainly looking forward to it. The 333 is by far the dominant unit too, so as expected nothing to worry about there.

Some comments though.

• No SDO - pretty sure this works in TSW now but isn’t implemented here despite it being frequently used.
• Trains stopping halfway out of platforms with red signals - I know this has historically been an iffy mechanic, but on a route where most services are buffer to buffer, I’d expect this to be better implemented.
• Not convinced by the reality of the 331 audio, it’s not terrible but it sounds like it was ripped from the US M7’s & isn’t original audio.
• GSMR still disappearing halfway through your run - please DTG fix this, it’s small but irritating.
• Live Weather - apparently avoided due to poor weather, but Leeds has been sunny & slightly cloudy this afternoon into PM, so it’s not working correctly & I’m wondering if DTG knows this or not.
• AI PIS not working?(this may be a playback issue).

Overall I’m looking forward to the route, some really nice atmospheric areas where the line encloses in vegetation, as well as opens out towards Skipton - definitely great to get some decent length & speed Northern services in game (especially away from the 323), but definitely some polish to be had & I’m already concerned with live weather being a poor implementation like dynamic was.

 

The stream has allayed most of my fears; it's definitely impressed me far. The timetable appears to be accurate with the 331s and 333s on correct services and, as I speculated, the 4 car 331 deputises for those who do not own the 333.

SDO not working and the 331 audio being quite a way off are my only two (minor) gripes but the 333 sounds fairly realistic. Also - and this is extremely pedantic - the 331/0 numbers should only be 331001-012 as those are the ones allocated to Neville Hill; the rest are based at Allerton and don't get over to Leeds.

 

Haven’t see the stream so far. What’s Leeds looking like? Much in the way of AI traffic?

 

It was shown at around 8:30am in game, the Northern Electrics were well represented but due to absence of TPE & Northern Diesels it is on the quiet side of things, but certainly not deserted.

Voyagers are there though so concerns above should be alleviated.

Hopefully when the 158 arrives it will help, I think the issue really is that all your Northern electrics tend to be on either side of the station, with diesels usually in the middle.

 

Better microphones in a mobile phone made to smuggle into prisons.

 

No signal cable trunking/trackside troughing that I can tell. Or much trackside clutter etc.

It's a small thing which does make a difference.

 

Looks really nice and very well done. Definitely looking like a purchase.

I do think it’s a shame they are using the pylons from many years ago that look very little like pylons.
JTs routes and the Riveria line had better examples.

 

Quiet passenger wise but it’s been that way for the last few routes.