Enough Is Enough!!! The Ongoing Saga!!! It's Almost The 3 Year Anniversary

Here you go, DR ET 165 "Stadtbahner"!

 

Well, is he really going to say: 'No, it doesn't work at all on consoles and you shouldn't buy it'? The value of that statement is probably next to nothing. After all, he's the publisher and wants to make money from it as well. I don't take such statements seriously at all, even if they might be true. I certainly wouldn't base a purchase decision or a guarantee on them. With answers like that, I think you always have to ask yourself: what's the real message behind it?

I should say:
Trust, but verify.....

 

They should do console previews for everything if they're releasing it on console. I'm not going to buy something on XBox based on what it looks like on a high end PC using features that are, let's be honest, highly unlikely to be included on the console versions. If some layers are disabled on acual routes to aid console performance there's no way something as demanding as those lighting effects are making it across. Heck they've been "looking into" passenger behaviour for close to ten years and can't even implement a darker menu screen when their own staff are saying it's unplayable to them as it is.

 

This point was raised in the last roadmap stream and the official response was "watch the ambassador streams", which came across as being a little dismissive because they tend to forget that for various reasons ambassadors can't show console content until after it's released...and in the case of Tadami it was a very consumer unfriendly 24 hours before Series X content was made available!
Also, if none of the ambassadors have a Series S then how on earth are owners of that console supposed to find out the quality of their potential purchases?

During the last roadmap stream Alex openly admitted that PC and console versions of TSW are now heading in two entirely different directions so it's only fair they now treat each platform with equal levels of consideration when streaming content at their end.

 

Personally, I'm fine with watching the Ambassador streams. It just requires a little patience. I generally wait at least a week before buying a console DLC to get the general feedback. It's just not worth buying console versions on Day 1, it's risky enough on PC.

Even if DTG did do a console stream, I'm not sure it would be a realistic representation. They could pick a timetable or scenario with little AI traffic to minimise the risk of Blurring.

A couple of the Ambassadors are getting as frustrated as everyone else with this situation and are not hiding it.

 

But you're still getting scenarios where ambassadors occasionally come across as (for want of a better description) being a little too rose-tinted when it comes to evaluating content. Take Tadami for example: Despite all those well documented issues as well as Dovetail Games subsequently invoking 'emergency surgery' protocol, I watched some ambassador created X|S footage of the route and the overriding message I got wasn't how bad it was but how we should all give a little "leeway" to Union Workshop because it's their first venture into TSW and they've had to contend with developing the route thru various versions of the game. Not only that but it was further mentioned that those framerate drops were [to paraphrase] "ok, but not ideal" and we should just be thankful that it doesn't have blurries.
Sure, some of the dubious scenery and a few other things were brought up...but let's not escape the fact that their overall impression of Tadami differed wildly from the general opinion of the route.

Generally speaking though, (with the exception of one or two that are beyond saving) you are quite correct in saying that there's a growing level of frustration amongst ambassadors.

 

Those two different directions seem to be one gets lots of new features and support in case the customers want a refund in those first two hours or to play one of the other simulators available on their platform of choice, the other gets whatever slop they have prepared on launch day and - if they're lucky - maybe it'll get patched into a playable state a few weeks afterwards,

 

Yep, the most common cope you get from some of them ist basically "yeah it's not that good, but here are some reasons, why it's ok that it's not that good" xD

 

TinTin_57's content on the run up to a JT route launch is great, everything else ambassadors do can do one.

 

The easiest way to determine who's best interests an ambassador has at heart is to find a particularly poor addon and see what they have to say about it. I've no idea what TinTin said about Tadami (or even the class 70 if you trust the judgement of this community) because I don't watch his content, but it'd still be interesting to see if he sided with popular opinion and called it out for what it was or just avoided the situation completely (as some ambassadors tend to do) with the old "let me know what you guys think about it in the comments below" routine.

Like I said earlier though, I do know that some ambassadors are becoming frustrated enough to openly criticise TSW content (wasn't Dave Pearson the only ambassador to question the overall quality of the class 70 in his review?) and if TinTin is indeed one of those people then fair play to him.

 

Then why don't you just livestream on consoles and pre-record for PC?
A win win situation for all parties because console gamers get to see guaranteed unedited footage and the PC contingent get to see stuff that's always going be at a standard where doctoring won't ever be needed anyway!

 

From a marketing POV, it makes no sense to show anything that is not the best possible presentation of your product in the main marketing event.

 

I get that, it's understandable. But on the flip side of it, can yourself and the other team understand us Console Users frustrations with how the game is performing on console and we don't get any information with how it'll work on Consoles until it's released and sometimes with disastrous launches.

It felt like we were also being kicked when we're down with the class 70 article that mentioned how amazing it all looks with enhanced lighting and super duper effects that at the moment is only available on PC. Surely having streams, either live or pre-recorded on console can only be a good thing.

 

Idea, get the interns to drive the routes without the additional chats and do livestreams doing on the different platforms then you it frees up the main people’s time to do the proper showcase

 

With all due respect, I will not care that much about console showcases, when I can trust DTG, the products have some quality and are well tested. There are to many issues on console, which is making you can't do a blind purchase.

About the difference between PC and console, you can also release some trailers showing the console versions, so people can see how the product look on console. At the moment, screenshots and trailers are on PC, which give a totally wrong picture of the product you get on console.

 

As someone who plays on console, I want to see the content presented in the best possible presentation for the product Dovetail are selling for the platform I purchase on, not for a completely different platform which these days would likely cost a few thousand at least and mean I have to rebuy all of my DLC which isn't going to happen.

If that isn't possible or may be harmful to sales then maybe dovetail either need to finally sort the issues they've been promising to fix on console for the past few years or say "enough is enough" and just market to PC.

 

They'd be giving up so much revenue by doing that though. Between half and two thirds. Where do they make up that lost revenue? I doubt PC players would be willing to pay triple the money to make the loss up. It's a difficult situation, but it's one that could be avoided if they'd just use a little bit of their money and get some people in who are actually capable of getting stuff running on console or change their whole design philosophy so they get it working properly on console first, then embellish it all for the PC version.As far as "well playtested" goes: if the game was well playtested we wouldn't get blurry textures and out of memory crashes during preview streams.

 

And that's exactly why they should be doing console previews.

What was the route which released recently (might have been WCML) where on the preview we heard something along the lines of "we've only had 1 minor complaint from a series s user" only for everyone on console to say everything was crashing and blurry once they'd bought it?

 

Completely agree. That and those two crashes during the TSW7 preview stream.

 

Totally understandable. Still doesn't change the fact that TSW looks much better in a high end PC and, from a marketing POV, it is what they want to show in their MAIN marketing event.

I never said they should not show how it looks on consoles in a pre-recorded video or another livestream. In fact, I think they should. But you can't ask them to show that as their flagship marketing campaign. Makes no sense at all.

 

They don't have to livestream PC content to show the world how good it looks because pre-recorded content would look exactly the same! Besides, back in the days of TSW2 & 3 Dovetail Games used consoles for livestreaming on a very regular basis and I don't ever recall anyone suggesting it was a bad marketing strategy back then.

I'd confidently argue that excluding consoles from livestreams has got nothing whatsoever to do with ensuring content receives the highest levels of presentation - it's all about what happened when Matt showcased TSW7 on Series X. They'd sooner hide any potential issues from the consumer than face another potentially embarrassing moment like that.

 

Anyone who does a livestream without an off-line rehearsal or three beforehand is being lazy or rushed. You should know where the problems are and avoid them.

 

This. I find it incredulous when Matt is doing a stream, even on his high end PC and ends up coughing or spluttering when something unexpected or glitchy occurs. You wouldn’t go on stage at a concert or play without rehearsing so many times you could play the notes or recite the lines in your sleep!

 

Not good from a marketing point of view, but good to show what people can expect of the product. It actually shows quality control is not good enough, as those issues should be noticed with testing and should be resolved before the showcase and release.

 

It would be weird if DTG were really professional with their livestreams but the same old DTG everywhere else.

 

True, but I was in a band years ago who knew we weren't great and played up to it. We'd practice for a week before each gig, we did covers and tried to have a different setlist every time. Whatever could go wrong, usually did from snapping a string to the bass drum pedal breaking. We also got through an almost Spinal Tap-esque number of drummers until I ended up drumming, and I'm no drummer. People in our town loved us.

Why "rehearse" a stream though? It's time consuming. If you're worried tht bugs are going to be exposed on your livestream fix the bugs.

 

Well maybe not the whole stream, but it certainly shouldn’t be the first time they actually play the content in earnest - which is the impression that one gets sometimes.

 

Saying that they don't have time to do a console preview is bad in that 2-3 hours for a preview there is time to show off a console version. If they preview a console version then perhaps some bugs will be reported quicker that crop up on console but not on pc like the screen bug. Blurry textures can be reported and they now that x route has that problem.

The ambassadors aren't required to show off the console version.

Console has to have previews on new routes, remasters and extensions, At least loco and Gameplay isn't a priority on that but they could make Blurry textures, crashes and new bugs.