Increase Passenger Density At Stations

Discussion in 'TSW General Discussion' started by geloxo, Mar 15, 2021.

  1. geloxo

    geloxo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2018
    Messages:
    956
    Likes Received:
    1,694
    I think this could be interesting for some of you if you are fans of game tweaking. There´s a custom game variable that you can add to engine.ini to increase the passenger amount at stations:

    ts2.passenger.DensityScale=XX

    It defines the density of passengers (default value is 1). By increasing it you can make stations come to life. This can be interesting in big stations which usually are quite desert until trains arrive or depart. Don´t go too high or you could turn into situations where small platforms are too crowded, which is not realistic and also crowdsblock the paths for the other passengers. It appears to have a very small impact on performance even on big stations like London.

    As an example this is Tees Airport at 9am with default value:

    TS2Prototype-Win64-Shipping 2021-03-15 01-05-40.png

    This is with 10 times the amount of passengers (ts2.passenger.DensityScale=10):

    TS2Prototype-Win64-Shipping 2021-03-15 01-09-51.png

    And this is with 100 times the amount of passengers (ts2.passenger.DensityScale=100), just used to demonstrate the problem of crowds blocking other passengers (they are still spawning so more will come):

    TS2Prototype-Win64-Shipping 2021-03-15 01-23-36.png

    The crowded problem also appears at London when there´s a departure or arrival with the case of ts2.passenger.DensityScale=10, while the other platforms are more or less empty as you would expect in such a situation.

    TS2Prototype-Win64-Shipping 2021-03-15 01-48-19.jpg

    Normally you won´t need that high values and I just used them for the explanations. Something like 2 or 3 is more than enough to bring some extra life to the platforms without creating problems. Remember that platforms and their walking paths are designed for the standard density which also includes the train arrivals and departures cases.

    You can test several values using the Unreal console to find the best for your needs and increase them in steps as going down will not remove the already created passengers. In that case use the expression without the "=". For instance for a double density just enter in the console:

    ts2.passenger.DensityScale 2

    Cheers
     
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2021
    • Like Like x 21
    • Helpful Helpful x 9
  2. hyperlord

    hyperlord Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    May 20, 2019
    Messages:
    1,245
    Likes Received:
    1,270
    We will find you, ShadowDrawDistance-Variable ... we will find you ...
     
    • Like Like x 10
  3. davidh0501

    davidh0501 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2020
    Messages:
    1,134
    Likes Received:
    1,638
    What a nice find.
    Well done that man!
     
  4. HeyYoPaulie!

    HeyYoPaulie! Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2021
    Messages:
    165
    Likes Received:
    381
    Thank you geloxo - great find! ;)

    Is it possible to add passengers to routes that don't have any - E.g. Oakville? It has some excellent Go! passenger scenarios created by the community, but all operate through desolate stations.
     
  5. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2020
    Messages:
    11,734
    Likes Received:
    17,944
    Yes, the extra passengers don't have shadows. Clearly they're vampires.
     
  6. geloxo

    geloxo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2018
    Messages:
    956
    Likes Received:
    1,694
    I had exactly the same question. But it seems those stations are currently not producing any passengers.

    Cheers
     
    • Like Like x 1
  7. mclitke

    mclitke Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2020
    Messages:
    1,227
    Likes Received:
    2,758
    So you just open the ini file with editor and add that line anywhere in between? Sorry, I never touched that ini file before.
     
  8. geloxo

    geloxo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2018
    Messages:
    956
    Likes Received:
    1,694
    Yes, file is here:

    \Documents\My Games\TrainSimWorld2\Saved\Config\WindowsNoEditor

    Add the following at the end of the file, not in the middle of anywhere:

    [SystemSettings]
    ts2.passenger.DensityScale=3

    If you didn´t touch it before you would not have a [SystemSettings] block, so add that header too. Below that block is where people adds their tweaks for viewdistance, foliage, shadows and things like that. Search for "engine.ini" in the forum an there everything is explained in several posts.

    Cheers
     
  9. Medellinexpat

    Medellinexpat Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 20, 2018
    Messages:
    541
    Likes Received:
    682
    Interesting although it only reinforces the limited number of passenger representations that DTG use. Quite an immersion breaker when you pull in to a platform and see one set of triplets, another, and another.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  10. Rudolf

    Rudolf Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 2016
    Messages:
    2,488
    Likes Received:
    3,270
    Nice where did you find those settings in the game files?
     
  11. geloxo

    geloxo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2018
    Messages:
    956
    Likes Received:
    1,694
    • Like Like x 1
  12. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2020
    Messages:
    6,567
    Likes Received:
    10,793
    Now if only dtg could just increase passenger numbers for next gen consoles and optimize passengers so last gen users can get increased passengers since it's just a simple number change.......
     
    • Like Like x 1
  13. Mr JMB

    Mr JMB Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 1, 2020
    Messages:
    1,323
    Likes Received:
    3,079
    The passenger spawn distance commands are also worth a fiddle with. Currently the default is set too short IMO and so passengers don't start to appear on the platforms until you are already in the station (it takes them time to get to the platform from where the spawn point is), often you see them pouring onto the platform as you are closing the doors!

    Also I noticed an ignore SPAD setting, so is possible so that spads do not trigger game over which is a common request.
     
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2021
    • Like Like x 1
  14. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2020
    Messages:
    6,567
    Likes Received:
    10,793
    DTG needs to get rid of the game over when you run a red signal because in reality the emergency breaks would apply in reality. If there is a setting that would already do that then why dtg can't implement it if it's a common request.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  15. geloxo

    geloxo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2018
    Messages:
    956
    Likes Received:
    1,694
    Yeap. You can also use the following to control the spawn rate (max and min time to create passengers):

    ts2.platform.MaxSpawnInterval
    ts2.platform.MinSpawnInterval

    When you enter any variable in the console without a value it gives to you the current value it has. So if you didn´t modify it yet that will be the default value which was set by game. You can use that info as starting point to experiment with other values and also to restore it to its default state. Press two times the console keyboard shortcut to make console screen bigger so that you can read the full events log.

    I also tried the SPAD one but appears to be a non valid console command. Maybe it just need to be added to ini files or it´s simply not available as it could affect gameplay.

    Cheers
     
    Last edited: Mar 15, 2021
  16. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2020
    Messages:
    11,734
    Likes Received:
    17,944
    Do you know what the default values are?
     
  17. geloxo

    geloxo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2018
    Messages:
    956
    Likes Received:
    1,694
    No but just enter the variables (without any value) in the Unreal console and it will show you which ones they are.

    Cheers
     
  18. Cloadmcally

    Cloadmcally Active Member

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2018
    Messages:
    81
    Likes Received:
    247
    Great Find!

    My main issue with passengers is not variety per-se, it would be perfect to get more models but I played Omsi for almost 8 years and didn't really mind the 4 character models. My main issue is the way they behave and as Mr JMB pointed out they spawn way to late, so you pull into the platform, very few passengers are actually there, then a heard of people come in and almost none of them actually get on the damn train. It seem so arbitrary why they disembark or board. And this is especially evident at terminus stations or depot runs. The best solution would be to link what is shown in the PIS system, to what the passengers do
     
    • Like Like x 3
  19. geloxo

    geloxo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2018
    Messages:
    956
    Likes Received:
    1,694
    You can tune when they should spawn. Indeed they spawn both outside the station (and walk to platforms) and at platforms directly. You should be able to define the distance from your position to platforms and station that should trigger the spawing with this:

    ts2.platform.MaxPlatformPassengerSpawnDistance
    ts2.platform.MaxStationPassengerSpawnDistance

    And the spawn intervals with this:

    ts2.platform.MaxSpawnInterval
    ts2.platform.MinSpawnInterval

    Cheers
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Helpful Helpful x 1
  20. Amtrak131

    Amtrak131 Active Member

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2017
    Messages:
    100
    Likes Received:
    136
    Can someone share their results? What works to give all stations passengers on a route before you even get there?
     
    Last edited: Mar 17, 2021
  21. Coastway trainspotter

    Coastway trainspotter Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2021
    Messages:
    2,852
    Likes Received:
    2,187
    Passengers are something that dtg want to improve across all platforms
     
  22. BR125

    BR125 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2020
    Messages:
    278
    Likes Received:
    727
    Theyve been saying that for 4 years - they wont.

    good find OP
     
    • Like Like x 2
  23. Coastway trainspotter

    Coastway trainspotter Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2021
    Messages:
    2,852
    Likes Received:
    2,187
    Everything in tsw will get improved eventually
     
  24. BR125

    BR125 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2020
    Messages:
    278
    Likes Received:
    727
    Oh will it, when? when will they be able to do these "nice to have things"? TSW will never be feature complete, it will never be at a point they can stop releasing content - they will never get round to these core things.

    Like I said, theyve been saying these things for 4 years - nothing has changed and it never will. TSW is a content farm, improving their core game isnt important to them.

    If anything their attention to detail went down at GWE - look at GWE with its custom assets and compare it to, say ECW or SEHS (which both extensively use TS assets imported over) The fact DTG had to be told to add HS1 fences? the area around St Pancras? its pretty evident their attention to detail and passion is gone, its just a place for a new dev to release something for their portfolio so they can leave DTG. TSW isnt for Train sim fans, its a portfolio creator content farm.
     
    Last edited: Mar 20, 2021
    • Like Like x 1
  25. Coastway trainspotter

    Coastway trainspotter Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jan 12, 2021
    Messages:
    2,852
    Likes Received:
    2,187
    Be aware that dtg may not be able to visit places in person due to COVID-19
     
  26. skyMutt

    skyMutt Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2019
    Messages:
    601
    Likes Received:
    1,702
    What about all the things that have been implemented in the last 4 years? What about head sway? Or cars on the road? Working grade crossings? Variable adhesion? Better looking sunsets instead of a weird gray distant fog? Wet platforms? Dynamic weather? PIS displays?
    I definitely remember people asking for those features. I've been asking for these features as well. You say nothing has changed, but what about those things? The game is still under active development and still has things being added to it. You call TSW a content farm and act as if that's a bad thing, as though they're being greedy and wanting to sell as many DLC as possible.
    But is there someone who's forcing you to buy all those DLCs? No, I don't suppose so. The idea is that you can buy only the things you really want to get, and skip on the DLC you don't want. It's like building your own collection. There is no trickery going on here. You and I and everyone else are free to vote with our wallets.

    Do I also believe they will eventually overhaul passengers? Sure I do. But I also acknowledge that this will take some time to do, it ain't like flicking a switch and poof! ,better passengers magically appear. There's a whole system behind passenger models, rigging, scripts, animations, etc.
    It's a big task just like adding steam engines to the game, or optimizing the performance.
    I'm just glad that in the meantime we get to mess around and change passenger densities thanks to the OP's tweaks. ;)
     
    Last edited: Mar 20, 2021
    • Like Like x 7
  27. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2020
    Messages:
    6,567
    Likes Received:
    10,793
    I mean you don't have to visit places to improve passengers. It has taken a very long time to improve passengers though
     
  28. kobberstad33

    kobberstad33 New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2020
    Messages:
    9
    Likes Received:
    1

    Is this the right way?:

    [SystemSettings]
    ts2.passenger.DensityScale=10
    ts2.platform.MaxPlatformPassengerSpawnDistance=
    ts2.platform.MaxStationPassengerSpawnDistance=
    ts2.platform.MaxSpawnInterval=
    ts2.platform.MinSpawnInterval=

    With these imputt no passengers will come at all. I had hope il get the default value when i start the game.
    But that doesent happen. I probably misunderstood:)

    Do you have any example value?
     
  29. kobberstad33

    kobberstad33 New Member

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2020
    Messages:
    9
    Likes Received:
    1
    I figured it out

    [SystemSettings]
    ts2.passenger.DensityScale=10
    ts2.platform.MaxPlatformPassengerSpawnDistance=2000
    ts2.platform.MaxStationPassengerSpawnDistanc=2000

    [​IMG]
     
  30. geloxo

    geloxo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2018
    Messages:
    956
    Likes Received:
    1,694
    Yes that´s the correct way but you need to add some values to the last four variables. If you put the " = " without any value that will give errors. The following are the default values defined by game upon launch:

    ts2.passenger.DensityScale=1
    ts2.platform.MaxPlatformPassengerSpawnDistance=50000
    ts2.platform.MaxStationPassengerSpawnDistance=100000
    ts2.platform.MaxSpawnInterval=4
    ts2.platform.MinSpawnInterval=0.5

    I guess the first two values are that high in order to allow stations to be populated when using free camera. They look too high to me, unless the scale is in centimeters or something like that. I didn´t use them yet as I just tweaked the density.

    Cheers
     
    • Helpful Helpful x 2
  31. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2020
    Messages:
    11,734
    Likes Received:
    17,944
    SpawnInterval: is that time in seconds?
     
  32. geloxo

    geloxo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2018
    Messages:
    956
    Likes Received:
    1,694
    Yes. Both spawn times are in seconds.

    Cheers
     
  33. zawal.belili

    zawal.belili Guest

    Here with my settings I have satisfactory results.

    In fact, I played more with the distance of appearance rather than the density, it allows to have people on the platforms even before the train arrives.

    So I also reduce the speed of appearance.
    It's a good mix, I have a lot of people when I arrive at the station, neither too much nor too much.

    ts2.passenger.DensityScale=2
    ts2.platform.MaxPlatformPassengerSpawnDistance=300000
    ts2.platform.MaxStationPassengerSpawnDistance=400000
    ts2.platform.MaxSpawnInterval=5
    ts2.platform.MinSpawnInterval=2
     
    • Like Like x 2
    • Helpful Helpful x 1
  34. paul.pavlinovich

    paul.pavlinovich Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2020
    Messages:
    1,684
    Likes Received:
    1,994
    If you turn this up too much and they all try to get into the train they explode out the other side and mill about on the tracks. I have mine cranked up to 5 and have seen this happen on Arosa on one of my streams, I've clipped that tiny bit out so you can see it in action and enjoy the fun. This isn't a bug in my view because I think I've just put in too many people for the train to handle.

     
    • Like Like x 5
  35. geloxo

    geloxo Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2018
    Messages:
    956
    Likes Received:
    1,694
    The wagons are too small and the whole town came to the station to take that train :D

    Cheers
     
    • Like Like x 1
  36. Stockton Rails

    Stockton Rails Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2020
    Messages:
    593
    Likes Received:
    847
    ...yeah, this is definitely a nice find- thanks for posting! Too bad console users don’t have access to some of these same under-the-hood settings... might not be so meaningful now on the base consoles of course (given their limitations), but it could be very useful on the latest Xbox and PS systems.

    I also find it interesting that DTG never mentioned anything about this on any of their livestreams I’ve watched. The topic of limited passengers at stations has been mentioned plenty on these forums... why didn’t they chime in on this useful info?
     
    • Like Like x 1
  37. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 20, 2020
    Messages:
    11,734
    Likes Received:
    17,944
    I think DTG has a policy of not endorsing or recommending Unreal engine tweaks.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  38. paul.pavlinovich

    paul.pavlinovich Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2020
    Messages:
    1,684
    Likes Received:
    1,994
    Stockton Rails they do occasionally mention you can search for forum for tweak ideas and mods and while they respect what the tweking and modding community members get up to they certainly don't support it. If you've got any custom settings you need to go back to default to get support.

    Definitely agree solicitr

    I think you're right geloxo only a few houses in that town, must be a big family :).

    Paul
     
    • Like Like x 3
  39. Stockton Rails

    Stockton Rails Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2020
    Messages:
    593
    Likes Received:
    847
    ...that’s true enough I guess, though I’ve personally never heard them mention that. More than anything, I hope consoles eventually have the same level of adjustability that PC’s do in terms of how the sim operates. I think it would be awesome to be able to tweak these settings and operate the sim the way that I want to... if I want some add’l visual detail at the expense of frame-rate, I can do that. Or not.
     
    Last edited: Apr 4, 2021
  40. paul.pavlinovich

    paul.pavlinovich Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2020
    Messages:
    1,684
    Likes Received:
    1,994
    From a UI and engine perspective it wouldn't be too hard to let you change some of those variables. Some can be changed on the fly, some have to be set at start-up Stockton Rails - maybe they'll build you a UI if enough people ask for it. I imagine those on next gen consoles (which are now current gen since they're out lol) are going to want to be able to tweak their settings since the base machine is capable of so much more.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  41. 7orenz

    7orenz Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Oct 5, 2018
    Messages:
    814
    Likes Received:
    1,062
    Hey, I have an idea, let's insert two lines of code, a very simple IF loop and create something we will call Rush Hours. We already have trains. What do you think about it? Rush Hours, it will work, believe me!

    Then we will release a tons of really new rolling stocks (Acela, Class 390(?), ICE-T) as separate add-ons.

    But we must hurry that in September we have to update the team roster and release Fifa 22.
     
    Last edited: May 4, 2021
  42. markhazeldine

    markhazeldine Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 10, 2020
    Messages:
    159
    Likes Received:
    369
    BR125, you've been awfully quiet on this thread since the Rush Hour announcement! lol.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  43. BR125

    BR125 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2020
    Messages:
    278
    Likes Received:
    727
    I work, but now youve got my attention - in the stream did they say exactly what they were doing? are they reworking the entire AI system from the ground up for rush hour? come back to me with the answer.

    I bet they just increase density and dont change anything about them beyond that, but like I said, I havent watched the stream.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  44. skyMutt

    skyMutt Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Jun 7, 2019
    Messages:
    601
    Likes Received:
    1,702
    Well how else are they going to do it? Of course there's going to be more trains and more passengers, with the density shifting according to rush hour. That's the whole idea around the pack anyways, there's not much else to it besides the incredibly vague "dispatcher needs more work" thing that props up from time to time. The pack may or may not bring improvements to the dispatcher, we just don't know. There was no mention of it, but things still seem to be in the planning/in-production phase.
    With that said however, according to Matt, the Brighton Mainline could include the busiest timetable so far in the game, putting it ahead of HMA's 400+ services.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  45. BR125

    BR125 Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 20, 2020
    Messages:
    278
    Likes Received:
    727
    We'll see, its obviously all marketing malarkey with very little actual information. Dont take what they say at face value :D
     
    • Like Like x 1
  46. Inkar

    Inkar Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2016
    Messages:
    1,417
    Likes Received:
    2,335
    The dispatcher was mentioned in the stream yesterday. They made a few improvements, but most of the "rush hour" effect we will see will come from how they set up the services and timetable, and not from a huge improvement in the dispatcher.
     
  47. paul.pavlinovich

    paul.pavlinovich Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2020
    Messages:
    1,684
    Likes Received:
    1,994
    They're doing more than increasing the density - to summarise from what I remember from the stream
    • increased density
    • adding more faces and improving hair
    • changing the passenger "fleet" so that clothing tops and bottoms will have a pallet of colours so they same person reused will have different clothes
    • adding animated tableau passengers on platforms that will have luggage, be reading the paper, dancing to music, etc - these will not get on/off trains - they're animated scenery
    I would encourage you to watch the stream and read the full announcement before criticising or theorising.

    Paul
     
    • Like Like x 1
  48. Varney

    Varney New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2016
    Messages:
    2
    Likes Received:
    1
    I would like to remove all passengers from the game, is there any easy way to do this?
     
  49. paul.pavlinovich

    paul.pavlinovich Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Aug 21, 2020
    Messages:
    1,684
    Likes Received:
    1,994
    I'm not aware of any way to do this. I tried setting ts2.passenger.DensityScale=0 in engine.ini but I still had passengers.

    Out of curiosity, why would you want to do this?

    Paul
     
  50. Varney

    Varney New Member

    Joined:
    Dec 11, 2016
    Messages:
    2
    Likes Received:
    1
    Yes, i've tried that too, didn't work.

    Just my personal preference really, It's an aspect of the game I don't need or want.
     
    • Like Like x 1

Share This Page