Update For West Cornwall Local?

Discussion in 'TSW General Discussion' started by AirbourneAlex, Apr 19, 2022.

  1. AirbourneAlex

    AirbourneAlex Well-Known Member

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    Are there any planned updates for West Cornwall Local? The reason I ask is because I saw an updated thumbnail on one of the DTG streams recently, so could this be an update in testing or simply a different build version from release?

    Also, would any update include more significant improvements to the route or just something like the integration of a working PIS from TVL and some small bug fixes?
     
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  2. nwp1

    nwp1 Well-Known Member

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    Rivet have to improve the scenery in my opinion. Rivet’s eye to detail with Locomotives and Stations is superb, but would they issue locomotives without a boiler or a station without a platform. I don’t think they would so why has the scenery on this route been unfinished and made to look like a model railway. It is six months since this route has been issued and Rivet should be issuing an update to correct all the glaring errors and omissions in this route.

    Major sites like St Ives Harbour Wall and Lighthouse. The Pedn Olva hotel on the rocks by the beach, Godrevy lighthouse, Carn Brea Castle and Truro Cathedral have all been missed out of this route, which shows that Rivet have not shown attention to detail in their replication of important scenery and this route still needs urgent attention to make it right. So far it is a lazy effort that they have produced. Amateur designers on TS have included the major items that Rivet have missed, which isn’t very professional in my opinion.

    If Rivet are unable to complete the scenery then DTG should step in to do it as the Harlem Line is first class.
     
    Last edited: Apr 19, 2022
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  3. meridian#2659

    meridian#2659 Well-Known Member

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    Also the 150 deserves an update:

    Working guard panels like the 313/314
    Working battery switch from outside
    Working local start / stop procedure from outside (like the cl.101)

    Shame rivet just decided to cut it back to a generic vehicle out of the iconic cl150.
    Probably the physics fix is too much expected, since they wont build all from new.
     
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  4. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    Best update I’ve seen for this was the extra foliage
     
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  5. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    The scenery on the southern end of harlem line south of botanical garden is far from being first class in my opinion
     
  6. AirbourneAlex

    AirbourneAlex Well-Known Member

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    I don't want to start another anti-WCL/Rivet thread, I'm simply asking if anyone may know more than I do at this point (I would like to play this route more but would rather hold out for an update if there is one, and we usually don't find out these things until the last minute).
     
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  7. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    I will buy it if they improve the class 150's physics, prune back Cornwalls forest and remove the ridiculous unrealistic layers.
     
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  8. AirbourneAlex

    AirbourneAlex Well-Known Member

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    Rivet should really do an expansion pack for the route which adds the Class 47 in intercity livery with some Mk2 aircon coaches, to replace the NTP layers. Maybe throw in a RES livery Mk1 BG for the mail trains and 08644 in IC livery for Penzance shunting. That way we get more content and Rivet can coincide it with a route update to cover the development costs, like what they did with the Arosa update and Anniversary pack.
     
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  9. Clumsy Pacer

    Clumsy Pacer Well-Known Member

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    Trouble is, they'd have to delete the layers or create a new timetable - neither of which is a desirable option (particularly given the first option effectively holds players to ransom - want the content you had previously? Well now you have to pay for it)
     
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  10. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    I personally would be happy to pay to have the correct stock, ie an intercity class 47 and mark 2's etc and a new timetable and those who don't want to pay for it could have the original timetable with the current layers.

    However, it seems to be that realism isn't important if the route hasn't been set in the last ten years or so.

    Personally it would be advantageous if a way of selecting layers was found, I read somewhere on here that DTG were looking into it but haven't seen much mention of it since.
     
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  11. AirbourneAlex

    AirbourneAlex Well-Known Member

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    I suppose that would be a problem, which is annoying as it shouldn't limit the route's potential. Dare I say it, but if route extensions were ever a thing (Rivet might have a different opinion than DTG) then adding in the Falmouth branch would be another alternative (if the route doesn't require cloning and separating from the original).
     
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  12. redrev1917

    redrev1917 Well-Known Member

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    They could upgrade it and it be the greatest route ever produced but whilst there is a mix of eras it will never find a home in my collection.
     
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  13. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    I imagine any major updates to this will be in the “if it’s not on the roadmap” bin
     
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  14. TimTri

    TimTri Well-Known Member

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    I recently got WCL at a heavy discount, and I‘ve been having quite a lot of fun with it. I do definitely recognize all the issues you‘ve mentioned, though.
    • The scenery in large areas of the route is really disappointing. 70% of the time, it’s literally a drive through the woods. The few times you see forests and fields in the distance, they’re horrible 2D models. Rivet can do better, so I have no idea why the scenery on WCL is so bad. The dense town/city areas and stations are perfectly fine, though.
    • The 150 is a very detailed loco with lots of attention to detail. I can’t comment on the behavior of the engine since I‘ve never ridden one of these trains (although the acceleration does seem unrealistically quick), but I‘m really puzzled by the lack of a working guard panel. You use these doors all the time as a player if you want to exit the train, so I have absolutely no idea why they went with low quality, non-working models for these important guard panels instead of giving them the same amount of attention as the rest of the train.
    • The route is long, but it’s quite boring. There are maybe 4-5 proper stations on the mainline, mostly separated by 5-15km of low-quality, generic scenery. The Falmouth branch would have really elevated this route.
    • I really hope they add the PIS from TVL as this is something they’ve been explicitly talking about during the release streams.
     
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  15. ghawk2005

    ghawk2005 Well-Known Member

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    I’ve given up. The list of basic errors on the 150/2 is out of this world. The whole unit needs a complete overhaul by Armstrong Powerhouse to get me to use it in the game.
    I’ve gone back to TS2022 if I want to drive a 2nd Gen DMU. AP packs for the 150, 156 and 158 are sensational so I use them over there now. All I end up doing every time I try the rivet shambles is get frustrated. A thousand times more pleasing experience ( for those who know what they should sound and drive like )

    Generally speaking - TSW has amazing graphics with appalling sounds and physics, TS2022 has amazing sounds and physics (AP packs anyway) but awful graphics. Shame we can’t combine the two
     
  16. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    How is it different? I know rivets is questionable but where is AP superior?
     
  17. DTG Jamie

    DTG Jamie Staff Member

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    No news currently on a West Cornwall Local update, if there is any news it will be on the roadmap.
     
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  18. CK95

    CK95 Well-Known Member

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    Bin? More like fly-tipping it at this point.
     
  19. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    DTG JD please consider this post a 1 week temporary community users ban on this slogan :D
     
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  20. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    The only issue I’ve found with Sprinters in TSC, even the AP 170 on Wherry Lines, is they nearly all suffer from the speed control effect in Notches 1 to 6. It is not a cruise control setting, simply reduced power. So it is perfectly possible to reach and hold top speed in Notch 5 or 6, just takes a bit longer and going from Notch 7 to Notch 4 running downhill should not act as a speed brake and bring the train down to what has been erroneously input as the Vmax for that throttle position.
     
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  21. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    AP does no work using Unreal Engine. They are strictly TS1-only, and its physics system is chalk and cheese relative to TSW. One might as well ask for a "complete overhaul" by Rockstar.
     
  22. AirbourneAlex

    AirbourneAlex Well-Known Member

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    Thank you Jamie.
     
  23. ghawk2005

    ghawk2005 Well-Known Member

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    Yes I realise this but the quality of work they do is outstanding compared to Rivet’s shambolic disaster. It really is a disgrace to the whole company ( and an insult to the gaming community ) to release it in the condition that it is. I have been driving their Class 156 pack this evening and you only have to drive it for 30 seconds to realise how it ‘should be done’ An incredible immersion experience.

    There’s no excuse not to even ‘attempt’ to fix the submitted issues. Most are small tweaks but play a huge part of the driving experience ! Enabling a throttle position in brake step 1 is literally no different to the original action of locking it out in the first place. ZERO fixes or most importantly zero attempts to show willing to fix their appalling mistakes.
     
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  24. davidh0501

    davidh0501 Well-Known Member

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    It’s the bloody beavers leaving tree stumps all over the route …
     
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  25. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    I fear this is another long abandoned fix. Likely release another route and then sweep up
     
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  26. meridian#2659

    meridian#2659 Well-Known Member

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    With a little effort rivet could make a big step forward.
    They could plug the fallmouth branch to west cornwall as a dlc and use the time for bringing wcl the finish, which it deserves.
     
  27. nwp1

    nwp1 Well-Known Member

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    With a little effort Rivet could also improve the shambles of their West Cornwall route as well first before adding a Falmouth branch line.

    The scenery on this route is absolutely disgraceful and an insult not only to St. Ives, but also to the fine collection of other previous offerings from DTG over the years.

    Rivet following the IOW and Arosa Linie routes which many commented on their poorness, came up with another gem of a rubbish design with West Cornwall Local.

    There is plenty of missing scenery to name a few, St Ives Harbour wall and Lighthouse, Pedn Olva Beach Hotel, Godrevy Lighthouse. West Cornwall Golf Course, Penzance town, Carn Brea Castle and Truro Cathedral. It is an insult to my countrymen to produce a Cornish route that’s doesn’t look Cornish.

    These important landmarks have all been missed out of this route, which shows that Rivet have not shown attention to detail in their replication of important scenery and this route still needs urgent attention to make look right.

    I wouldn’t criticise Rivet’s eye to detail with Locomotives and Stations which is superb, but would they issue locomotives without a boiler or a station without a platform. I don’t think they would so why has the scenery on this route been unfinished and made to look like a model railway. It is now over six months since this route has been issued and Rivet should be issuing an update to correct all the glaring errors and omissions in this route. But I don’t think they ever will.

    I never play it now, as the scenery is so devoid of the original and so unlike the place itself in so many places. The only bits RIVET got almost right were the Stations, 37/5 150/2 and the sky and sea. I just wish I could get a refund and will never buy another Rivet route, unless it has an over 60% discount.
     
    Last edited: May 4, 2022
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  28. ghawk2005

    ghawk2005 Well-Known Member

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    Well said, however I can assure you they definitely did not get the 150/2 right at all. It looks stunning but the sounds and physics are way off.
    Even with a 60% discount I wouldn’t bother….. what’s the point of having 60% off a product that isn’t worth playing? I’d rather pay 100% for a decent product than pay 40% for rubbish.
     
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  29. dave from Cornwall

    dave from Cornwall Well-Known Member

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    The whole St Austell extension, was a great idea, except because they didn't go to Par...or do the branch line to St Dennis you didn't get the clay movements that make that whole area.

    I totally got the original plan. It was going to be a little plaything for the 150/2 PZ-Truro and the St Ives branch. Which would have been small self contained and probably a little bit of fun in the way that IoW is?

    I am not going into the fact that they have made the drawline so close to the track that they have ignored many of routes visual landmarks. They really should have put the Scillonian on the quay at Penzance, St Michaels Mount as a proper thing- visible in the whole of MOUNTS BAY, Godrevy lighthouse, Carn Brea castle and monument. The list goes on. I don't think they actually googled Truro Cathedral, they did an artistic interpretation of an generic cathedral.

    I digress. You can tell that there was a W1A type meeting and someone suggested and it was agreed to change tack (points?) and extended it all the way to St Austell. The problem is bar the viaduct over Truro that line is incredibly boring. It is in real life. I am guessing someone saw that it was single line at the time and it would make it "exciting". Well it would but in the 1990's the railway was on a downwards trajectory and the were not many train movements- that is why it was single line...they could get away with it. There is a very limited chance of a red light because of a movement going the other way...as there isn't one.

    Granted the Falmouth line doesn't have many exciting things- maybe the curved viaduct at Penryn? But it would have actually kept it West Cornwall Local.

    You would have had three different route options. St Ives Branch there and back in half an hour, Mainline up or down in 45 and then Falmouth there and back in hour. Three different styles of driving? Granted the Truro to St Austell does have some fun gradients to play with?

    They also got the St Ives timetable completely wrong. For some strange reason the last train of the day the train is stabled in St Ives??? Whereas in reality it actually lives in Long Rock. This means that we are missing out the first and last train of the day coming up from Penzance.

    Also if you look on 1990's timetables every other hours route actually goes back to Penzance for a crew change. For some reason they are scared of loading up the St Erth to Penzance route with the 150 as well as the mainline services?

    I love driving it, but its strange, other than the stations which are brilliantly done- they are true to the feel of the place- and I spend a great deal of time at the stations...the in between bits are diabolical. There are also no whistle boards?

    As others have said there is veritable forest along the track, where none exist. Hiding the actual view.

    I do recommend people buy it and drive the route, as its fun. But I feel more is missing than included?

    D
     
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  30. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    Not sure there is such a thing as a generic cathedral and Truro is certainly unique, Loughborough-Pearson will be spinning in his grave judging by the screenshots I have seen. Unless, they thought users wouldn't look that close. However go back to Rail Simulator 2008 and you got a nice replica of Durham Cathedral and the Castle.

    I was so excited about WCL, I was certain I would purchase it and in the end I haven't due to various reasons, mostly the class 150/2 and the layers. The Falmouth branch would have completed it as a nice little network.
     
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  31. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    Just consider that rivet will probably be denying all knowledge that they worked on this route by now In regards to fixes,
     
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  32. nwp1

    nwp1 Well-Known Member

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    The Organist, you were right not to purchase it, it is so shambolic that it is not only an insult to DTG but the way they portrayed the beautiful St Ives and the wonderful countryside of Cornwall is shamefully disgraceful.

    chieflongshin, I too cannot see Rivet updating it, but everyone one who knows Cornwall and the route will know that their design is extremely poor.

    Because of this, I won’t buy another Rivet route until there is a 60% discount and only for their locomotives for which they are good at.

    Rivet should stick to releasing locomotives and leave route designing to those that are good at it.
     
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  33. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    This thread can be summed up in five words:
    STAY AWAY FROM RIVET GAMES
     
    Last edited: May 11, 2022
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  34. nwp1

    nwp1 Well-Known Member

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    Well said. Rivet are cheating people out of their hard earned cash by producing sub standard routes. What they do do well is good production of locomotives but their route building is utter rubbish. DONT BUY ROUTES FROM RIVET.

    If I produced sub standard work in my job. I wouldn’t last long. Rivet should look at all the derogatory comments in all the forums and put these matters right. But we all know they won’t bother!!!
     
    Last edited: May 11, 2022
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  35. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    I don't get why DTG who allowed this route to be published in the first place won't tell rivet that they won't allow them to release new dlc and have them go back and fix the problems on this route before they can work on new dlc. It would be common sense to be honest.
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2022
  36. meridian#2659

    meridian#2659 Well-Known Member

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    If you ever have the chance to visit switzerland, you might see rivet got their newest route the right way. Its accurate, especially the train stations.

    Just shame they screwed up a route in their own backyard. (Wcl)
     
  37. CowBoyWolf

    CowBoyWolf Well-Known Member

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    Have you seen their newest route?
     
  38. redrev1917

    redrev1917 Well-Known Member

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    Flying from Scotland to Luzern is probably quicker than driving or taking the train down to Penzance TBH
     
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  39. dave from Cornwall

    dave from Cornwall Well-Known Member

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    We should not be so harsh on Rivet. They have given us a route that works, there are no AI glitching red lights, yes we have to hunt for misplaced points on one of the routes, but ultimately the game is playable, and all journeys are completable. Even if you have to manually shut all the doors on the 150/2... but hey ho. Its doable.

    Lets just see if DTG put any pressure on Rivet to give WCL a titivation or not...

    D
     
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  40. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    11 hours on a Voyager…
     
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  41. AirbourneAlex

    AirbourneAlex Well-Known Member

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    Perhaps Rivet were being a little over-ambitious making this route. It still has lots of potential, I just hope Rivet or DTG can arrange time to revisit the route and improve certain aspects, even if that involves making some sort of expansion to cover development costs. And to be fair on Rivet, they did do a good job with the scenery on Cathcart Circle, which maybe due to collaboration with DTG became a great route.
     
  42. CK95

    CK95 Well-Known Member

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    I think one of the mistakes made were adding the extension between Truro & St Austell, I think the time spent should of gone into more work on the scenery & 150, or one of those things at least.
     
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  43. AirbourneAlex

    AirbourneAlex Well-Known Member

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    I agree. This is the only time where I wish a route was actually reduced in size. The drive between Truro and St Austell is quite dull, they could have gone to Falmouth for a similar mileage (more stations to model but those are relatively simple in design) or like you say spend longer perfecting the existing sections or simply moved onto the next project sooner. Oh well.
     
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  44. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    Not to mention St Austell being a pointless place to terminate. Operationally, only the Motorail trains, which ceased running well before the route time period, would have finished there. Should have gone to Par or better stuck at Truro but put in the Falmouth branch.
     
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  45. nwp1

    nwp1 Well-Known Member

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    I have not purchased Luzern-Sursee because as you say “They screwed up a route in their own back yard”. I agree though that Rivet are pretty good on Station and Loco design and should stick with that. Their routes are appalling with so many things missed out.

    With the West Cornwall route, a lot of important landmarks have been missed out of this route which includes:

    St. Ives Harbour Walls MISSING

    St Ives Lighthouse MISSING

    St Ives chapel seen from Station MISSING

    Pedn 0lva Hotel seen from Station MISSING

    Beach Cafe seen from Station MISSING

    First bridge out of St. Ives WRONG SHAPE

    Carbis Bay hotel seen from Station MISSING

    Carbis Bay platform entrance INCORRECT

    Godrevy Lighthouse seen in bay MISSING

    West Cornwall Golf Links MISSING

    Town around Penzance MISSING

    Quay in Penzance MISSING

    St Michael’s Mount POORLY DESIGNED

    Carn Brea Castle and Monument MISSING

    Truro Cathedral as seen from line MISSING

    There are so many other things missed out or incorrect. I could go on and on, but Rivet wouldn’t listen as they are really satisfied with their Mickey Mouse design.

    My last word to anyone who hasn’t purchased West Cornwall Local is DON’T BUY IT.
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2022
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  46. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    upload_2022-5-12_12-41-45.gif

    This should be all that is needed in this flogging of Rivet. The horse that is “improvements to this route” left at release date
     
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  47. stujoy

    stujoy Well-Known Member

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    Notwithstanding the errors and omissions of the route, the dodgy 150 physics and sound, the numerous badly looped (on PS5 at least) sounds on the Class 37 and the added layers that make little sense, it is an enjoyable route to drive with the layered-in trains from NTP. You just need to think of it as a train set loosely based on a real life location and imagine it’s supposed to be this odd place with an odd mix of trains. I know this is hardly a glowing review but I haven’t regretted getting it in a sale because I enjoy driving the BR Blue trains anywhere.

    Outside of a complete rethink and big rebuild I’m not sure how any update could go far enough to get the route close to reality and please those for whom this level of make believe is not acceptable. For me, the hastily added DTG layers saved the route by adding extra playability but didn’t solve what was wrong with it. The 150 would need a whole physics update to make it authentic and I’m not sure Rivet would do that as it would only make sense if all the other things were sorted too. I hardly ever drive it because the Class 101 is just much better and without that subbing in and the other layers I wouldn’t have bought the route.
     
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  48. Clumsy Pacer

    Clumsy Pacer Well-Known Member

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    I think we'll only get an overhaul of the 150 if it gets included in a future route.
     
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  49. lcyrrjp

    lcyrrjp Well-Known Member

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    I totally agree, the layers made the route. It’s an interesting and challenging drive with hauled stock or with the 101 - plenty of gradients, stations and speed restrictions and even the odd restrictive signal aspect. I’m not massively hung up on whether it’s a strictly accurate representation of the particular location. As a driver you don’t spend much time gazing at the scenery anyway. It’s the railway features of the route which are important, and they’re mostly well represented.

    I just wish they’d fix the daft bugs like the incorrect line speed on the St Ives branch, and the incorrect stopping positions at some stations with hauled stock. Surely things like that can’t be massively difficult to correct. They acknowledged them months ago. How long can it really take to fix something so simple?
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2022
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  50. nwp1

    nwp1 Well-Known Member

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    What has really disappointed me about Rivet, they have never explained why they missed out these important landmarks!!!
     
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