Tsw3 - The Cat Is Out Of The Bag & The Unofficial Tsw3 Speculation Thread

Discussion in 'TSW General Discussion' started by redrev1917, Jul 5, 2022.

  1. Commiee

    Commiee Well-Known Member

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    Well that's an issue with DtG's fixing work, not a general demonstration that "routes don't matter, only performance, lighting and audio does". I have no preference about which one is done first - both are needed - but to pretend routes in a rail sim don't matter is not serious. There would be no DLCs for TSW and no Suggestions forum packed with route proposals if that was the case.
     
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2022
  2. longo239

    longo239 Well-Known Member

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    Whatever the announcement, the odds are in favour that DTG will still manage to make a mess of it somehow!
     
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  3. Scorpion71

    Scorpion71 Well-Known Member

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    I'm not building my hopes up for anything special.

    Whatever will be, will be....(oooh long time since I chanted that at the footy, being an Evertonian)
     
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  4. pinxtonpaws

    pinxtonpaws Well-Known Member

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    I guess that's where the problem lies. Such is the level of modern day expectation, "just fine" seems to be the new standard of acceptability - and you can't really say it isn't because, well, here we all are, many purchases into a train simulator that continues to fall short of it's true potential...yet even though it's not (and may never be) a great game, we all play it - and largely enjoy it regardless of that fact.

    Any game that even slightly rises above this endless sea of mediocrity is always going to look like a great game but generally speaking it isn't...it's just a game that's better than what you've come to expect - and to further enhance this point take a look down the list of games in the Microsoft store and ask yourself how many of those multi 5 star rated games would you genuinely consider being worthy of such a high accolade.

    I'm not saying every single game release over the past 9 years is a tragedy because that would be unfair; all I'm saying is that despite all the hype and expectation, gen 8 gaming is a significant downgrade to what came came before it in every single aspect bar the visuals. Sadly though, looks aren't everything (that's why, as simulators go, TSW is arguably inferior to TSC) and any self-respecting gamer should know that by now. After all, if you had to make an either/or decision would you prefer TSW3 to have exceptional physics or exceptional visuals?

    RDR is an exceptional game...RDR2 is just fine.
    Eyes wide open, young man.....eyes wide open :cool:
     
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  5. CK95

    CK95 Well-Known Member

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    What a load of codswallop.
     
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  6. matinakbary

    matinakbary Well-Known Member

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    I don't think - even as hypothetical - it's not needed to decide between A or B. I think the exceptional advantage of TSW built on UE4 is that it can have both. Looking at the BR 101 or the G6, they are exceptional in both physics as well as visuals. If you mean by visuals a new lighting system, yes! An overhaul is needed, totally. But who know, maybe we'll have more information on that next week. I think the lighting problem is well known at DTG now. So let's see what the future brings.
     
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  7. eldomtom2

    eldomtom2 Well-Known Member

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    Well, frankly, I'm not sure there has ever been a train simulator that has risen above "just fine".
     
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  8. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    My eyes are wide open. Yours seems to be closed. There were excellent games on last gen and yet your acting like performance was terrible or doesn't live up to whatever your personal standard is.

    I don't know what fantasy you have been living under. Hardware doesn't make mediocre games. It's the devs themselves. That's where the real problem lies. With some blaming older hardware for not getting what they expected when in reality it's the devs themselves
     
    Last edited: Aug 6, 2022
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  9. gazz292

    gazz292 Well-Known Member

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    ever wondered why we're stuck with roughly 40 mile routes?

    can't be something to do with the limited memory on gen 8 hardware could it??

    people keep going on about how tsw is developed on the pc, then lots of things turned off to make it work on gen 8... that works with graphics, shaders, layers, timetables and so on... but it's not that easy to cut a ~100 mile route in half just for the gen 8 stuff is it,
     
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  10. Anthony Pecoraro

    Anthony Pecoraro Well-Known Member

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    Memory has nothing to do with shorter routes.
     
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  11. raptorengineer

    raptorengineer Active Member

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    i'll be surprised if there was new Canadian route. but till then (we'll see what happens)
     
  12. FD1003

    FD1003 Well-Known Member

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    Route length has no impact on performance, the game will unload everything unrelated to the current scene - at least that's what we've been told.

    Track 3 in SMH wasn't scrapped because of gen8, but as always they couldn't do it in time/not enough resources because they thought they could rely on auto gen more.

    Route length is determined by the amount of resource needed.
     
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  13. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    It's not a gen 8 limitation as dtg have said many times. I assume you would know that. If you did then your just being arrogant
     
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  14. gazz292

    gazz292 Well-Known Member

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    [removed by Protagonist - baiting and trolling aren't welcome here, pack it in]
     
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  15. FD1003

    FD1003 Well-Known Member

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    I'll gladly take every opportunity to talk about how bad SMH is
     
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  16. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    That's like adding extra bedrooms to a house built on a cracked, sagging foundation.
     
  17. Lamplight

    Lamplight Well-Known Member

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    To be fair, the SD70 and especially the train length + physics are excellent to my mind, but I see your point regarding SMH - especially the omission of track 3.
     
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  18. Commiee

    Commiee Well-Known Member

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    This would only have been a valid analogy if I had said "developers need to keep adding content but keep mechanics broken". Enough with these cringy attempts of responding to my posts with childish bad-faith garbage.
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2022
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  19. junior hornet

    junior hornet Well-Known Member

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    I don’t think the stream is at 5pm. That’s the announcement, probably incorporated in the roadmap. Although there isn’t a Railfan TV schedule this week (despite the title of the post), I suspect that it will be at 8pm BST as usual.
     
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  20. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    [removed by Protagonist - don't feed the troll]
     
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  21. Redbus

    Redbus Well-Known Member

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    Personally I would prefer the reveal on the stream itself, it would give it much more a sense of occasion. Putting it on the web site before will kind of spoil the surprise.
     
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  22. bakedpotatos.jm

    bakedpotatos.jm Well-Known Member

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    What they should do is release the article on Monday so we know what questions we want to ask prior to the stream.

    And then set up a question thread around said article.

    I'm hoping the train image on the 8th means that they are doing this.
     
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  23. FD1003

    FD1003 Well-Known Member

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    My comment wasn't 100% serious, but yeah... SMH is one of the most disappointing routes I own, the SD70 and physics are good, but the safety system doesn't work, the scenery leaves a lot to be desired (especially at night, last time I checked the terrain and vegetation were like glow in the dark), and the omission of track 3 of course...

    It's not awful per se, but it just seems the epitome of the "that'll do" mentality... it could have been so much better but it almost seems like they couldn't be bothered to neither fix it or improve it.
     
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2022
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  24. SonicScott91

    SonicScott91 Well-Known Member

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    It would be pretty neat if they went straight into a trailer, which then goes into a preview stream where DTG go into proper detail of what's new & improved. The articles then come out the following day after the stream.
     
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  25. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    Two wilder speculative thoughts…

    1. They are ditching UE and have spent the last 18 months working with a replacement graphics engine that is more suited to the needs of a train simulation.

    2. TSW3 will come with a utility to convert and port across all our TSC routes and content, effectively consolidating their train sim franchise into one up to date modern basket.

    But again, probably not.
     
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  26. stujoy

    stujoy Well-Known Member

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    I know you can’t post about TSW without mentioning TSC but this is going a bit far :D Although I did once suggest TSW2 would come with spaceships and unicorns as a joke and we did get a UFO and a Kraken, so mad things do happen.
     
  27. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    What they should do (my version) is have the release / announcement stream on TUESDAY, set up a question post synchronous with the stream then have a Q&A session either on the Thursday or the subsequent Tuesday
    Not much point having a Q&A session before we know what they've done already, essentially you're asking questions based on TSW2 as a comparrison
     
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  28. bakedpotatos.jm

    bakedpotatos.jm Well-Known Member

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    That sounds good as well.
    But aren't all the questions generally going to be whats different between this version and TSW2 anyways?

    Asking about any new features is pretty much just asking that very question.

    But I would think if an article was on Monday that the said article would tell us more details so that we could elaborate on those.

    Also gives them time for questions from the forums they can do the usual cherry pick from
     
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  29. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Not really. If they came on Tuesday with a dev version of TSW3 and could show a V2 of scenario planner with new features and so on (as in they can actually show a bit of it) then people would ask about those things as well as whether existing stuff transfers. Right now we don't know if there IS a v2 to ask about (hence asking blind)

    Then zero point having an announcement on Tuesday as Monday would be the announcement?
     
  30. Jpantera

    Jpantera Well-Known Member

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    Would be great. I suspect more UE, more bugs, more fixes that then create more bugs. Still no save and still no editor.
     
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  31. mattchester#9176

    mattchester#9176 Well-Known Member

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    I get the feeling the main reason for TSW3 is primarily to steady the ship and from a marketing perspective to try and distance the game from the issues we've seen with TSW2, particularly since Rush Hour was released.

    I think we'll see some improvements but I don't think it will be as revolutionary as some are hoping. For this reason I think the way it will be released will be much closer to TSW2020 than TSW2, e.g. free core update and a paid version with 3 new routes (with maybe SoS included as a delux edition). I also think a lot of the bug fixes they've been working on will be realised at the same time to help build the hype.

    I'm trying to temper my expectations but feel these are the likely included features:
    - Sparkes from electric power (almost certain)
    - Dynamic Weather (likley)
    - Thunder and lightning (possible)
    - Better management of layering and duplicate loco versions (hopeful).
    - Loco DLC no longer fixed to home route (possible)
    - Test track for locos (possible)
    - New UI (likey)
    - New scoring / rewards / trophy system (possible)

    Bug fixes / improvements released at the same time will likely be:
    - PS5 DLC Fix / Content Manager for consoles (very likey)
    - RH passengers for BML (likely)
    - New Bakerloo Timetable (liklely)
    - SH Track 3 (I can dream)
    - Save Game fix (Hopeful)

    It's very unlikely GEN 8 will be fully dropped. My guess is it either be partially supported, e.g. less core functionality such as no sparks etc (likey) or it will stay on TSW2 and new DLC will be released for this as well (less likely).

    Things that are very unlikely to be inluded

    - Multiplayer
    - Massive lighting fix for old DLC
    - VR
    - UE5
    - Huge routes
    - Route extensions / mergers

    I also think we'll get also get a commitment to future improvements (lightning, dispacher, route length, train features etc.) but the big question is how much faith will we be able to but it this given the long list of broken promises we've had it the past.

    Personally I'm giving them the benefit of the doubt (again!) and I'm feeling positive about the futitre of TSW. I think they've seen the competition on the horizon and know that now is the time to step up their game. The DLC limit had meant I've been playing the game less and I've not bought much of the recent DLC so I'm really looking forward to getting back in the cab.
     
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  32. Jpantera

    Jpantera Well-Known Member

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    Ultimately what is needed is something that has the flexibility of the TSC series in the editors etc and the better graphics and walking of TSW with a timetable mode. I am hoping they have plucked the best ideas from previous products and can then move forward armed with knowledge from the past.

    I have always said if you take the best parts of other sims including older ones you would end up with a great experience. TSW has spent too long deep in noise (rightly I must add) about fixes or features that have either never emerged or have in a watered down fashion.

    The slate needs to be clean even if that means leaving some DLC behind like with NEC route
     
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  33. tsw2

    tsw2 Well-Known Member

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    You forgot the "still terrible lighting and performance" part :D
     
  34. FD1003

    FD1003 Well-Known Member

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    Screenshot_20220807-180842_Twitter.jpg
    Good news! Seems like the DTG staff was able to travel to get reference material for their next DLC.

    Given the fact they talked about air travel, and their past experience with CalTrain, I'd assume it is a trip to the US, which should be their first opportunity to get reference material since Covid started.

    Let's see if this actually means a better DLC, hopefully they brought some microphones with them together with the cameras.
     
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2022
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  35. CK95

    CK95 Well-Known Member

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    I wonder if it’s something to do with Steam…
     
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  36. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    Or it could be Austria, maybe something around Innsbruck which by all accounts is quite a hellfire approach and landing.
     
  37. FD1003

    FD1003 Well-Known Member

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    The two next DLC are American and German aren't they? And didn't Matt say some time ago that neither of them are steam?
     
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  38. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    That is correct
     
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  39. stujoy

    stujoy Well-Known Member

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    If DTG are flying out to somewhere to launch TSW3 then you have to assume it’s either a new country represented and a new market for the sim, or a very special train that they are visiting for the launch. It’s all very exciting.
    This is not about DLC, this is for the launch of TSW3. The US and German routes that aren’t mentioned by name in the roadmap could be the base routes for it and there are usually three routes so there is something else. I’m thinking Japan myself but I could be way off. It’s just about the most requested new country for TSW.
     
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  40. FD1003

    FD1003 Well-Known Member

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    That's a good point. But I can see nothing wrong in going to the US to record some specific sounds like they did for Peninsula Corridor, for example they used Class 66 sounds on the SD70ACe because they use the same prime mover, this wouldn't work for other US Diesels though.

    Just like Rivet went to the IoW to record a few Class 484 sounds, I can't see why only a new country would require travelling to that location, they managed LGV ""fine"" (for their standards) without it.

    Maybe I'm not giving DTG enough credit but I keep my expectations low, new german and american (non steam) routes + something related to liverpool crewe is what I expect to come with TSW3.
     
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  41. CK95

    CK95 Well-Known Member

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    Given how the 2 routes on the RoadMap have been there a while, I doubt they have only just gone out to source for them now.

    I don’t think this is related to those 2 DLC’s.
     
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  42. FD1003

    FD1003 Well-Known Member

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    Considering they don't even tell us where in the US and Germany they are might mean they are not that close to being done. Remember how long the Class 313 was there? Sometimes projects might be on hold or delayed for some reason.

    9th of august is the announcement, not the release. As far as we know TSW3 might release in 2023. We still have a lot of preservation upgrades waiting to be released.
     
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  43. CK95

    CK95 Well-Known Member

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    Could be the case, guess we’re gonna have to wait a couple more days.

    Just going to throw in that if it is steam related, I’ll be pretty disappointed, we’ve just suffered through a year of DTG focusing on steam.
     
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  44. FD1003

    FD1003 Well-Known Member

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    2 days to go now... just a little bit of patience
     
  45. Commiee

    Commiee Well-Known Member

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    People in Twitter replies speculating the tweet could mean Japan making me sweat...
     
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  46. stujoy

    stujoy Well-Known Member

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    There are so many variables and we don’t know what DTG have up their sleeve. I think they think it’s something special and want to save as many surprises as they can for the launch. Not long now before we see what they are hiding.
    Well I think it could be Japan. There’s no third route on the roadmap and they are flying somewhere far away (a nightmare journey to breathtaking scenery) for the launch. If it turns out to be Blackpool then there will be disappointment.
     
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  47. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Nothing to say that the trip they're doing today has anything to do with DLC already posted
     
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  48. FD1003

    FD1003 Well-Known Member

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    It could be just me not giving DTG enough credit. Guess we'll see in 2 days.
     
  49. SonicScott91

    SonicScott91 Well-Known Member

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    I think either they've gone to America or Germany, where one of these two upcoming routes on the roadmap are based. Or maybe they've not gone abroad at all and have taken a domestic flight up to Scotland as the next UK route is based up there? Fife Circle Line maybe?

    DTG previously ruled out doing first party routes outside of the main three countries due to the amount of work required, plus having to put their existing markets for the big three on hold for a 4th country. They've said in streams the best hope a new region has is for a third party dev to get involved and make a route themselves. They've even said on stream that the reason they did LGV was because it was a high speed route more than the fact it was a French route. It'll be a surprise if they add a new region, though personally I'd still prefer a new UK route instead.

    Its anyone's guess at this point. Tuesday can't come soon enough!
     
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  50. Swisstrains

    Swisstrains Well-Known Member

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    A flight that was long? Wen’t to Dresden and the new German route is the line from Dresden-Neustadt to airport :D
     
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