Xbox What A Great Next Gen Experience! (not)

Discussion in 'TSW General Discussion' started by StrikeEagle78, Oct 6, 2022.

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  1. StrikeEagle78

    StrikeEagle78 Well-Known Member

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    You're right. While TSW2 had its own moments where FPS dropped to the 40s or 50s, they were mostly few. And even in those moments the background scenery didn't stutter so much so you got a mostly smooth gameplay. Being that TSW2 and TSW3 are mostly the same game, I was thinking that the lighting or the new clouds don't play well on console. But then again there are brief moments where the game runs at a solid 60FPS so who knows. All I know is that even DTG must be embarrassed at console performance hence why they never show it in promotions. A big red flag for potential customers right there.
     
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  2. Princess Entrapta

    Princess Entrapta Well-Known Member

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    My solution has mostly been to play in 1080p mode on Series X, but it's a bad look when most games have a 4k 30fps mode and a 1440p 60fps mode.
     
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  3. tsw2

    tsw2 Well-Known Member

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    1080p looks like garbage in TSW for some reason. More or less unplayable.

    Do you think the game runs better on PC?
    It's a mess on all platformes. Just bad engine and badly optimized.

    DTG must work hard to fix this.
     
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  4. Princess Entrapta

    Princess Entrapta Well-Known Member

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    Thing is, the flickery mess of the framerates on the Series X TSW3 in 4K mode is considerably less playable. I'd play a game in 480p if it was the only way to get 60fps. this is why I still play TSW2 primarily, to get the best of both worlds on framerate and resolution.
     
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  5. StrikeEagle78

    StrikeEagle78 Well-Known Member

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    TSW3 probably runs well on a high end PC. I guess you can use brute force to overcome the shortcomings with the game itself and beat it to submission to get the FPS out of it.
     
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  6. tsw2

    tsw2 Well-Known Member

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    DTG just needs to fix the performance...
     
  7. StrikeEagle78

    StrikeEagle78 Well-Known Member

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    One would think this would be a part of the development phase of a new game. But nahhh, send it out the door and maybe we can fix it later.
     
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  8. Princess Entrapta

    Princess Entrapta Well-Known Member

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    I am reminded of that TNG episode where Q is all
    Q: "You just change the gravitational constant of the universe"
    Geordi: "How am I supposed to do that?"
    Q: "You just do it!"
     
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  9. Dustysideboard

    Dustysideboard Member

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    TSW2 is very very good on Series X, however the draw distance is still there but not quite as bad. Load times are almost instantly.

    As I’ve said before I’m waiting for TSW3 as I have so many services to play and waiting for bugs and issues to be sorted.

    Personal opinion I’d upgrade, if you play other games like Forza, CoD etc you’ll notice a huge difference
     
  10. Princess Entrapta

    Princess Entrapta Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, TSW2 on XSX is a solid way to play it, and absolutely worth it if you own it.
    TSW3 not so much, it's a sloppy, messy, unfinished product that feels like it was rushed out of the door while still in alpha to meet an arbitrary deadline given to investors.
     
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  11. DTG JD

    DTG JD Director of Community Staff Member

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    Hello folks. We'll be discussing this later internally to work out a plan.

    If anyone is experiencing issues like pop-in (and performance), particularly on XSX/PS5, it'd be really handy to understand in what situation and where. A video like OP's is good, but it's likely we'll have additional questions.
    • Issue Summary:
    • Platform:
    • Game Mode:
    • Route Name:
    • Loco Name:
    • Service/Scenario Name + Start Time:
    • Step-by-Step Instructions:
    • +Screenshots
    • +Video Links
    StrikeEagle78, as OP, it'd be good to understand a little more of your experience too. Let me know if you'd be okay with one of the team reaching out via DM.

    We will investigate - obviously we want the experience to be an upgrade on what's come before in TSW2, so we'll work to improve.
     
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  12. t.reizner35

    t.reizner35 Active Member

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    JD I posted something here with one screenshot (maybe a bit hard to see).

    https://forums.dovetailgames.com/threads/last-update-quality-of-life-improvements.60628/#post-553306

    The other bugs are easy to see if you just drive one time from Würzburg to Kassel. These are route based bugs not hanging von the points you wrote above.
     
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  13. bdobronz1968

    bdobronz1968 Active Member

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    Why „particularly on XSX“? What about Series S? Sorry, but in my mind TSW3 should perform as minimum equal to TSW2 on Series S. in terms of shadowing and draw distance. My expectation is not that TWS3 looks better than TWS2 on Series S, but what we have now is far worse what other games show on Xbox S. And the pop up landscape is just terrible. Driving on a sunny day in autumn is spoiled by the leafs on the trees which change their Color right in front of you from green to red, orange, yellow… The performance and look of the legacy routes is worse than on TSW2.
    My hope is that DTG did run out of time when they released TSW3 and they need time to tune the game, especially for consoles
    DTG JD Since I‘m very experienced in testing software because of my profession, I can offer you to test TSW3 on Xbox S if your like. You just need to contact me if you’re interested.
     
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  14. StrikeEagle78

    StrikeEagle78 Well-Known Member

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    Yes I will be glad to help out. Whatever I can do to help improve this situation for the benefit of the community. Thank you for reaching out.
     
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  15. DTG JD

    DTG JD Director of Community Staff Member

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    Thank you. DMing now.
     
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  16. gobig#1834

    gobig#1834 Member

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    Thank you for acknowledging us. I think we are so passionate about the issues because it's a really great game. Just needs to be fixed on consoles. Especially the North American routes.
     
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  17. SGTDRE

    SGTDRE Well-Known Member

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    Something I just noticed with my game after several large and smaller updates a few days ago. [XB1] version of TSW3 in the description of the video I put a bit of info. Either way something is off? I don't think this how it should be. Also, what I noticed is that the controls are extremely sensitive when doing the intro via the training module and the player character is a passenger.

    Or should I have just started a new thread on this subject.?
     
    Last edited: Oct 15, 2022
  18. ildario77

    ildario77 Well-Known Member

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    That's unbelievable you're asking, because even a blind ape could notice in just 5 minutes what's wrong with this game on consoles. Did anybody really test it before release???
     
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  19. t.reizner35

    t.reizner35 Active Member

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    DTG JD Just a little note the issue with the invisible trains is not just based on Kassel-Würzburg, I am seeing this on every route I drive, everywhere trains with invisible locos and waggons. This should really be looked at.
     
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  20. Princess Entrapta

    Princess Entrapta Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, it's unmissable, it's on all the routes with all the player and AI trains.
     
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  21. DTG JD

    DTG JD Director of Community Staff Member

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    There's a constructive way and a non-constructive way to engage, and this falls into the latter. Understand the frustration, but please understand we're just trying to do our jobs.
     
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  22. nepclassof84

    nepclassof84 Well-Known Member

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    This entire thread isn't constructive. I also think whatever problems they are having are related to them and not the game. Ever since the toggle came out and especially since last week's update I've been playing the heck out of the game on a series x with good internet and in 4k mode. I see nothing wrong with the performance. It plays as tsw2 played. My only wish is the pop up distance was a little further but it is what it is I understand why and it doesn't make me enjoy the game any less.
     
  23. Princess Entrapta

    Princess Entrapta Well-Known Member

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    To try to be more constructive about it, this issue can, based on my experience so far, be observed at all times on all routes with all trains. Individual elements of a consist will be invisible, sometimes they will begin to pop-in as they approach the camera, like an engineless train approaching you and then the locomotive appears, even as you could see everything it was pulling. Sometimes there are massive gaps akin to that train level in Dead Space 2 where you open the door at the end of one carriage and the next one is missing and you have to jump in zero gravity to the one after it all while the train is still moving and the front and rear parts are still moving at the same speed as each other.

    I first noticed it on Cajon Pass when my own train went missing, I can't say if it happens more on Cajon Pass, but it's where I notice it the most. That may just be down to selection bias in that it is the route I mostly play TSW3 for, bt other users' comments suggest something there makes it appear more.
     
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  24. gobig#1834

    gobig#1834 Member

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    DTG JD Let's be honest. If you did your jobs like you state, this thread wouldn't exist. So please forgive us for being upset that a very unfinished product was released. DTG should be apologizing, not giving us criticism for being upset over this.
     
    Last edited: Oct 17, 2022
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  25. Princess Entrapta

    Princess Entrapta Well-Known Member

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    I think a lot of the more hostile posts are probably driven by incredulity that such a glaring and omnipresent issue somehow wasn't flagged up in QA.
    Now, I am aware of a multitude of factors which can cause issues like this to slip through, that sometimes issues like this can be a completely unintended side effect of a hotfix that's pushed out for something else, and so the build doesn't get the same level of oversight as one that was cleared, and nobody notices a bug that slipped in, so sure, whatever.
    I think the frustration more specifically stems from that baseline, and then being asked to provide a generic bug report with specific details, for what everyone playing can observe is a global problem, as it probably comes across as not having listened to the initial complaints and performing a box ticking exercise.
    I've worked in customer service and it's always a tightrope of having to get it out of the way, but still empathise with the customer and reassure them you know the questions are stupid but the sooner you get to the end of them, the sooner you can escalate their issue that obviously does not fit within the framework the script was designed for.
     
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  26. antwerpcentral

    antwerpcentral Well-Known Member

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    Wow! Just wow! First you say that the problem lies with those that spot issues with this game and then you state you also notice issues? Just wow! First of all what does a good internet connection have to do with all the issues mentioned? Nothing at all. We are not talking about problems with cloud gaming.

    It's okay that you enjoy the game as it is but that doesn't mean we have to lower our standards to yours. A game like TSW shouldn't have these performance issues. You are easily satisfied and that is fine but that does not mean criticism is not constructive. What is not constructive is claiming that there is nothing wrong with this game.
     
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  27. DTG JD

    DTG JD Director of Community Staff Member

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    Thanks for the responses Princess Entrapta. The reason why we ask for the detail is because this is what we get asked from the wider development and QA team - to gather as much info and as many instances as possible so we can target our testing and reproduction of issues. I promise it's not a box-ticking exercise, nor would we want players to submit things that waste their time and isn't helpful.
     
  28. Loco Dave

    Loco Dave Member

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    ps5, Cajon Pass, any long train with ES44, any route, invisible patches along the train length.
    Pop in if flown over and stays drawn.

    ps. playing SOS on PS5 TSW2 for stronger engine. I think you're looking into this already.
     
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2022
  29. jiroo#5329

    jiroo#5329 Member

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    Same problem here like in the opening post video. Locos and wagons seem invisible sometimes at almost every route until you get very very close to them (I think like 5 meters). I think one very easy way to reproduce this pop in problem is to start any SEHS service in timetable mode from St. Pancras. Once you depart take a look to the left after the station where the cement train is stationary (Class 66 with PCA wagons if you own GWE + TVL and Class 31?). The rendering issue is very obivious there for example.

    Xbox Series X.
     
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  30. whiteleym#4287

    whiteleym#4287 Active Member

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    Thought I'd give the Class 31 introduction another go, however the result was still the same sadly with tankers popping in right infront of my Loco!

    I even got some more "Garbage" evidence of the occurrence: https://www.xbox.com/play/media/H8NFNXPV

    Hope the issue can be identified and a fix found soon!
     
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  31. StrikeEagle78

    StrikeEagle78 Well-Known Member

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    [​IMG]

    :D :D :D
     
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  32. gobig#1834

    gobig#1834 Member

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    https://www.xbox.com/play/media/8LUXR6PK

    Above clip shows exactly what is happening. This is Sherman Hill Timetable run that starts at 3:15am. The engines are UP SD40-2. Sorry for the map view at beginning of clip. This is on an XBSX
     
    Last edited: Oct 21, 2022
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  33. DTG JD

    DTG JD Director of Community Staff Member

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    thank you, I'll relay this to the team.
     
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  34. gobig#1834

    gobig#1834 Member

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    Here is another clip. This time Cajon Pass and it's Journey mode. Also, notice the HUD. The accelerometer doesn't have a crossbar marking the neutral posisition like on the PC version of the game. Without this, the accelerometer is extremely hard to read.

    https://www.xbox.com/play/media/FXTPMA9M
     
    Last edited: Oct 24, 2022
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  35. gobig#1834

    gobig#1834 Member

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  36. StrikeEagle78

    StrikeEagle78 Well-Known Member

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    This last video seems to show stuttering as if the game is pausing to load in more scenery or whatnot. I need to take a video on SEHS to show another kind of stuttering. Doesn't seem load related where the game seems to pause, but more of a low frame rate jittery background. I mean it's nothing new from TSW2 to TSW3, however in TSW2 we saw it on very few occasions where the scenery was very dense vs. TSW3 where it takes place unfortunately for most of a route vs. short portions.

    Also, although I started this thread and it feels like I'm overly dumpy on DTG lately, I still support the efforts of the team and just last week took the plunge and bought SOS. Currently playing it on TSW2 and I really like it! It really creates a nice feel of an old time railway. I've read about the various bugs here and there with the route, but for the most part I feel it's a good experience so congrats to DTG for this one.
     
  37. gobig#1834

    gobig#1834 Member

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    Yes, I've been overly critical of DTG myself. They do have a good game here. Even with all the flaws, I still enjoy playing it almost everyday.
     
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  38. whiteleym#4287

    whiteleym#4287 Active Member

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    I love the game, I wouldn't be here posting about it if I didn't. I just want it to run properly on my Series X is all.
     
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  39. StrikeEagle78

    StrikeEagle78 Well-Known Member

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    Exactly right. If we didn't care for this game it would be easily tossed in the bin. We want to see it improved to an acceptable quality BECAUSE we enjoy it so much.
     
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  40. stevenwalker1985

    stevenwalker1985 Well-Known Member

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    Exactly. I play it ALOT. Even with its issues which are SO annoying. I have 2 favourite routes which i always go back to. Sehs and london to brighton. Cathcart could be better if it was more busy, with more trains to choose from. Then i would play it more often.
     
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  41. Redbus

    Redbus Well-Known Member

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    I switch often between the PS5 and Series X (and until very recently PC). I find the Xbox’s performance with TSW3 generally pretty smooth, more so than PC with maxed settings.

    What I can’t get over however is the dreadful quality of much of the Xbox audio. For example, the AWS ping in the SEHS class 66 crackles whereas on PS5 and PC it’s very clear. The occasional TSW audio pops and clicks which are present on all platforms, are much more prevalent on Xbox, and become quite distracting (immersion-killing) when wearing a headset. I’ve tried changing audio format (Uncompressed Stereo, Windows Sonic, Dolby Atmos) but it doesn’t seem to make any difference. As I don’t see many complaints about this, am I the only one experiencing it?
     
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  42. TerryBalldriver

    TerryBalldriver Member

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    Your not alone. I have TSW2 on pc and TSW3 on XBox Series X. PC audio and overall graphics are better, running mostly on high settings, but get more stutters big and small no matter what the settings. Xbox is a lot smoother (so far) but I also notice a lot of popping sounds. Going forward I'm sticking with the Xbox Series X as I find consoles more convenient than a PC. I replied to your last thread on this https://forums.dovetailgames.com/threads/audio-issues-still-plague-xbox.56871/
     
    Last edited: Oct 26, 2022
  43. stevenwalker1985

    stevenwalker1985 Well-Known Member

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    Yeah i have noticed this also.
     
  44. Redbus

    Redbus Well-Known Member

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    I just reinstalled TSW2 on my Series X to compare. The audio is way better, yes there are some pops and clicks, but the sounds at least do not sizzle and crackle. TSW3 on the other hand on the same console sounds awful and I do not understand why this is. It’s especially noticeable on high-pitched sounds like AWS chimes and alarms. I even tried reinstalling the game to no avail. So, TSW2 audio generally acceptable, TSW3 audio very bad quality; what happened? I need to submit a ticket as something ain’t right!

    Edit: here are two clips I recorded, the first from TSW2, the second from TSW3. Listen to the AWS alarm sound, notice how it crackles in TSW3. Other sounds such as the beeps when the doors open crackle to some degree.
    https://gamerdvr.com/gamer/redbus36/video/167009706
    https://gamerdvr.com/gamer/redbus36/video/167009727

    Your feedback would be most appreciated, please let me know if you can replicate the same. I have also tested other trains and routes with similar results.
     
    Last edited: Oct 27, 2022
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  45. tsw2

    tsw2 Well-Known Member

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    It's so sad how all these basic issues that you would expect in q alpha version of a game still continue with TSW after many years and TSW"3"
     
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  46. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    It frankly isn't surprising at this point. DTG in a nutshell. Maybe they will get it right when TSW 4 comes out in 2024
     
  47. Dath Vater 208

    Dath Vater 208 Active Member

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    This thread is loooong. This only shows the scale of the problem
     
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  48. gobig#1834

    gobig#1834 Member

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    Holy cow. That is a Hugh difference. I had known the sounds were better in TWS2, but I never dreamed there was that much difference.
     
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  49. antwerpcentral

    antwerpcentral Well-Known Member

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    What I've been saying since the launch of TSW3: there is something off with the audio on Xbox. I also get a lot of crackle in TSW3. It is very noticeable on Tharandter Rampe
     
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  50. Redbus

    Redbus Well-Known Member

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    I will be logging a ticket this morning. The only way DTG will sort this out, is if those who feel strongly that this needs fixing as a matter of priority log support tickets. One they can ignore, but a good number will be harder.

    Edit: logged as ticket #50761. You can refer to this as I have put links to the audio samples in the ticket.
     
    Last edited: Oct 28, 2022
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