Scotrail Express: Scottish Perspective

I don't really know why I am making this however I feel it may be worthwhile for myself (and, the other Scottish members of the forums) to chip in here with our information, experience and reaction to the Edinburgh - Glasgow announcement. I'll run through some of the notable screenshots and give my thoughts on them, from both articles, as well as the new features.

Firstly, we have Glasgow Queen Street. Being Glasgow's second largest is quite an honour, considering the massive scale and size of Glasgow Central. The station's concourse and façade were practically rebuild in the Edinburgh - Glasgow Improvement Works, coinciding with the Electrification of the Line.

From this little snippet of the station I am already looking forward to it. The Bridge and the Scenery look good and it does seem like it will reflect Central Glasgow well.


Across to Edinburgh, and it's Waverley.

Waverley is the largest Scottish station outwith Glasgow Central, and has the most platforms of the lot. The historic station is an iconic one, for sure, and as alluded to in the article, you should be able to have a good look around.

Looking at the 385 itself now. The interior looks good here. The seats are perfectly recreated and the detail of the carriage seems good. Also good to see that the poster boards at the ends seem to be filled, unlike the 314's.

The /0 opposite does a good job at highlighting how well rivet have modelled the 385. One negative though in this shot: The Signage.

The Platform 15 sign is blatantly wrong. Not only should it be Network Rail (I understand the license may not be there, however an imitation would suffice), if ScotRail is used for it, that font is just... Wrong.


Back to Glasgow and it's Bishopbriggs. The station itself looks good, nothing much to say about it.
It appears that what we have here is a /0 and /1 unit, which would be 7 cars (3+4). The most you'd really ever see in use is 8 (4+4), however the variety on offer is good. Calling back to the last bit - the signage. It's spot on here. The '1' sign on the left uses the right font. A strange inconsistency.


This waiting room at (idk where) is lovely. More places to go around and explore is exactly what TSW needs in my opinion - we're slowly getting to the point where it's just platforms, footbridges and underpasses. This isn't much but it's a nice addition, especially if you have a train to catch.


Finally, this shot of Edinburgh.
Now I would be lying if I said this angle didn't confuse me at first - I don't recognise Edinburgh from it so it took me a while to pinpoint where it was from. Until then, I was quite worried about the amount of trees. It seemed like Penzance again. But, nope. It's quite accurate actually. This Central, cross-railway part of Edinburgh does have quite a bit of greenery around it, with Princes Street Gardens and the slopes below Edinburgh Castle. Scenery looks solid, and quite pleasing to see an authentic attempt at the various landmarks, being the Scott Monument, Edinburgh Castle (in a different Screenshot), National Gallery of Scotland and so forth.
Waverley looks magnificent from this angle too.

Features
TMS Announcements were a shock to me. I really didn't expect it. Hopefully, it's authentic, ScotRail announcements rather than just TTS. Although, a welcome edition either way. Glad it's optional.
Dynamic Blinds in First Class will be nice to have. Might ruin a few Screenshots Though
AI Trams is the big one. They follow this line from Waverley (at Street Level), past Haymarket and down to Edinburgh Park Station, where they turn towards the airport. I doubt they'll be usable (as a passenger) but they will at least make the tram tracks seen like they aren't abandoned. (Ahem, DCZ.) Hopefully not some generic model though.

Rolling Stock, Layers, Timetable.
The choice to make the 385 the only piece of Rolling Stock is perfectly acceptable. The people arguing against it are really talking to a brick wall.
The furthest any non-385 train runs on the route is the section from Queen Street to Croy. Most don't even stop at Croy or inbetween. In other words, AI-only.
I suspect we'll see an RHTT Layer as well as a bit of freight. The (non-included) Grangemouth Oil Refinery draws freight traffic to the area, although I doubt much would be here. The 314 should not be anywhere in service here. The train was scrapped in 2019, and the route is set today. The only reasonable inclusion of it would be stationed at the Bo'ness and Kinneil Railway × Edinburgh - Glasgow line Junction, however even at that, it would still be wrong, as that would be a 614. And it would be at Bo'ness.

As for the timetable, the following service patterns are likely to appear (if it's a good timetable):
Edinburgh <-> Glasgow QS
Fast and Slow - 102 Services (combined - only one I counted)

Edinburgh <-> Haymarket
Turns off route here, for the Carstairs Line (~1tp2h)

Edinburgh <-> Haymarket
Turns off route here, for the Shotts Line (1tph)

Edinburgh <-> Polmont
Turns off Route here, for the Cumbernauld Line (2tph)
Note: 1

Edinburgh <-> Polmont
Turns off Route here, for the Edinburgh - Dunblane Line (?tph)

Edinburgh <-> Edinburgh Park
Turns off route here, for the North Clyde Line to Helensburgh (2tph)

At the Glasgow End:
Glasgow QS <-> Croy
Turns off the route here, for the Croy Line to Dunblane or Alloa (alternates - 1tph each, 2tph in total)

There would be a host of more AI-only runs too.

Cathcart?
No. Tell me, was the 385 a thing in 2014 when GCC is set? (P.S. Scenario Planner is your friend.)

Conclusion: I'm very much looking forward to this route, and hope rivet do the 385 justice, especially in terms of Sounds and Physics.

 

I have SO MANY memories in Waverley. I've slept in that station while waiting for my train home from a late night gig by my favourite band Every time I visit it's because I am meeting a friend or lover to do something enjoyable.
I've not been since the pandemic started, please tell me the weeb shop with all the pokemon, garage kits, and suchlike is still there?

 

One of my plans with video capture in the near future is to record and splice together a single long piece where I travel around the country changing between different games at stations, airports, and the like, and alternating between stuff like Flight Sim, TSW2, Watch Dogs Legion, Forza Horizon 4, etc. This just added an extra leg to the tour!

 

That is actually a great idea tbf

My memories of Waverley are always special; as a west coaster it's quite often for a trip to the castle or whatnot, however occasionally it's for a day in Edinburgh with my dad and gran (who lives in the Scottish Borders), like a family trip, always starting in the station.

As for the shop, I'm unsure. Whereabouts is it in the station? I'll see if I can find some info online.

 

Google suggests it's still going strong

 

Lol anime republic. Got a whole store just for that

 

It's a good spot to meet friends at a short walk from the platforms but not blocking the stairs, and away from the food court

 

Does this route go via Falkirk? If not which line is it?

 

Yes Falkirk High

 

Thank you Steve.

 

It does indeed.
*Edit* Steve beat me to it.

 

Will there be a pre order discount or have those days gone?

 

Them days are gone I think

 

A very well summed up review, thank you.

I agree, the screenshots look very good. Nice and detailed and custom used assets have been provided for this route, which is excellent. It's nice to hear that the 385 will have functional announcements via its TMS screens.

Just a few nit-picks I've seen:

- I assume this is Glasgow Eastfield Depot? If so, its strange Rivet have placed the old 70s style OLE, which is seen on the WCML irl. The rest of the route they've managed to use the correct OLE asset (new Series 2 OLE variant)


- Secondly, I've noticed they've used the old style lighting asset, the same sort used on GCC. I assume all stations along this route have bright white LED station lighting now irl?


- Finally, can we expect some sort of ambient occlusion in the passenger interior of the Class 385? In this screenshot, it looks very flat and lifeless looking.


Other than that, I'm impressed with what I've seen so far. Keep up the good work, Rivet.

 

Will the elephant in the room once again be the night lighting ( or lack of it ). Perhaps Rivet could address that question with some screenshots in the next couple of weeks.

I don't want to buy another route like BCC where I can't drive at night. Surely Edinburgh and Glasgow won't suffer the city- wide power cuts that afflicted Birmingham

 

Excellent break down analysis and here's the thing what's the route recently electrified within the past 10 years if yes then it needs to have the current 2010-2022 OHLE Poles Headspans if the section had Express & local services. Express and local services are the American terminology for British fast and all stations.

 

For this route, 90% of it uses Series 2 Single Track Cantilevers. Twin Track Cantilevers and portals. Most of the screenshots show Rivet having done this correctly, except for the screenshot above at Glasgow Eastfield depot.

Series 2 OLE breakdown:
Single track cantilever:


Twin Track Cantilever:


Portal:


The portal variant, as show above, should be used in depots.

 

Hopefully they'll improve it. The landmarks are well (and authentically) lit, as is Edinburgh Waverley, so hopefully the rest of it looks good.

 

For the 385 interior - it should be a bit darker than it is. I don't think the image I have attached does it quite justice but it's definitely too bright and flat in TSW.

 

The reason it looks so flat is because there’s no ambient occlusion. Hopefully this is a WIP shot and they’ll add it in before release.

 

That's because EVERY interior is too bright and flat in TSW3. It's to do with how they upped the brightness of everything without adding stuff like ambient occlusion to compensate, so interiors act like they are being lit right through the walls themselves.

 

Very quick comparison of the Croy station interior… the attention to detail is stunning!

Honestly don’t know why they placed the counters about a meter or so too far to the left after probably spending ages getting them modeled perfectly right. But I’m not a perfectionist, so I don’t really mind at all. I’m just happy we’re getting more accessible and accurate interiors!

 

So what's this tram service that going to be seen on this route?


Note:In the 3:19 Rivet train tour in the video stating at about 2:48 where almost to the 2nd drivers cab on the left a short white wall with a grab bar that pops in just seconds from reaching that area.Hopefully this kind of thing get fixed before release.

 

Hey Jasper_Rivet any chance you can make a last minute change with these OLE portals?

For some reason, you guys placed old 1970s style portals on a newly electrified depot, which looks pretty odd. You managed to get the twin track cantilevers right, as seen in the screenshot.

The portals should be as the same design shown in the real life screenshot. (This asset already exists in TSW btw)

Thanks.

 

I have been saying the same thing about BCC at night but I get told that’s the way it is in real life. But it seems all the street lighting is off so it makes it look dark.

 

There is no AO in any TSW train interior. Likely out of concern over framerate.

 

Watch at 2:46 in this video, hope that gets fixed!!

 

Welcome to part 2 folks.

Firstly, I feel like thanking Rivet for including authentic adverts and maps in-train (and I imagine around the route too). A massive boost for immersion and especially helpful to me as I see these literally every time I'm on the network;


Seats look accurately modelled, good to see the Priority and First Class Seats represented accurately. It might seem flat, but comparing to experience it's not bad. TSW does seem to struggle to show it right, and actually this isn't too bad. The interior and cab aren't weathered much but considering these trains are only a few years old (part of that during COVID) they are still very fresh.

Only major worry is the seat that spawned in as the player approaches it, however I'm hopefully it'll be fixed.

Moving on to the exterior. We've seen pretty much all of it now and I can give it a 10/10 with the only thing jumping out to me is the slightly wrongly-sized lights. Not a big deal though.

Sounds: We didn't hear much and frankly I haven't got any reference or experience of hearing a 'dead' 385 standing. However, at the start we can hear a 385 either arriving at or leaving the depot and I can say, from the little I've heard it's very true-to-life.

Could it be Rivet's redemption DLC? We'll find out in the next few weeks I suppose.

Spoiler: My Everyday-Experience with the 385

On a sidenote, I want to just share how much I hear and see 385s every day. My line, the Inverclyde Line, sees 385s on it, amongst other stops. My walk to School takes me close to the line and my school is in good proximity to the line. Trains aren't exactly quiet so I do hear them going by. I use trains fairly often to go to the football and, thanks to the specific service I take, it's usually a 385. On my morning walk, the train passing is a 385. Hell, I can't escape them! I say this, because don't want to come across as "I'm right, your wrong" at all in my replies, in this thread or others, I just feel like experience often beats YouTube clips, and felt like showing how much 385s are around me.

P.S. - I'm going to do this everytime we get a substantial drop of something (eg Article or Video) - if it's just an image on twitter or whatever I'll post it and give a quick reaction.

 

I couldn't even tell what station it was but it looks great!

 

Good analysis and speak of the Scotrail announcer voices are they also used outside of Scotland too or not?

 

The ScotRail on train announcer (Fletcher Mathers) is ScotRail-exclusive

 

Class 350 and 450 liveries coming with immediate effect once I get this

 

All of the blinds in first class were completely down in the video. I don’t think I’ve ever seen that in any train, no matter how bright the weather! Hope they make it more random, and make the “normal” fully uncovered window by far the most frequent choice. Perhaps 2-3 blinds at most in the whole section should be partially or fully down on a hot day.

 

I'm going to guess not. It's a Scottish guy afaik.

 

The article mentioned the blinds adapting to sunlight and brightness, although I'm unsure if that took effect during the video.
The 385 in the video is essentially a cold unit, out of service and off. So, it could be the case that the blinds are just down and that they would become dynamic when the train is on.

Also, you do seem to be able to move them up and down so shouldn't be a massive issue.

 

The tram in Edinburgh runs from St Andrews Square to the Airport. They are currently extending down to Ocean Terminal.

In terms of what we should see in the game, the tram run alongside the railway from Haymarket to just passed Edinburgh Park.

Will be interesting to see if they’re in the livery or just plain white but glad they’re in the game as makes it more realistic for sure

 

I know it's a longshot but there might be the possibility this is like the river barge on dtg most recent german route which you can paint and livery up.

Plus this is also like when dtg added the wuppertaler suspended railway on another german route.
It's kind of a bummer that rivets games would add something like this the tram i'm refering to as AI only.This would make this route doubly special by introducing the 1st street tram to the game and might even boost this routes sales because the class 385 alone makes it another single new train route and theres already more then enough of those.

 

Edinburgh to Glasgow is a single train route... And the trams are a totally seperate thing, no more relevant to the line than the cars on the streets.

 

The trams will just be like a welcome piece of animated scenery, like the suspended monorail in RRO. If a drivable tram was brought into TSW it would require a whole route if its own. Otherwise it just isn’t worth the dev time to fully simulate it.

 

The class 385s modelling over all is actually really good too!

 

Apparently this airport tram service is more then just to much trouble to fully added as a drivable service.Trying to look up any info or details on the real thing get no meaning results,Because the glasgow airport served by trains like the class 380 or the 322 and the tram barely anywhere to be found,so is this a old discontinued service.Just being added for nostalgia or something.

 

I don’t know about them in real life but the route is set in present day so I imagine they are current. Someone from the area will be able to give a definite answer to that.

 

No the trams are in Edinburgh:

 

The Tram operates from Edinburgh Centre put to Edinburgh Airport.

Glasgow has no Airport link, neither tram nor Railway.
There was the proposed GARL (featured on Train Sim Classic) and various other ideas, including the in-consideration Glasgow Metro project, which would go via the Airport. The 380 was built for GARL before the project fell through.

 

I know it's never gonna happen but imagine being able to hop on the trams (in-game) from Edinburgh Park to Haymarket, or even along to Waverley.

A bit pointless considering the rail connections but it would give a new perspective to view the line and it's services from. Happy to have the trams as AI, though. Hopefully well modelled.

 

Well just like the IOW steam railway maybe this tram network can be a future project for rivet games.I would like to think some kind of street running train (tram perhaps) would be interesting to add to the game.Rivets has already tested the waters with there arosa/chur route running thru the streets of chur.

 

There is already a tram simulator if you want to drive trams. As I posted elsewhere it would be fun to ride inside these trams, however that would require a separate set of scenery for the places where the tramline and trainline deviate. Hopefully the much touted opportunties to wander away from the rail line includes some nice spots to watch the trains and trams go by.

I found it quite interesting though that you couldn't find any information about the Edinburgh trams, they are quite (in)famous... https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-edinburgh-east-fife-27159614

 

Do you think that we will see a Class 380, class 158, class 170 layer added along with the other trains on this line?