Hello all, today I bring a suggestion for two (very) similar locos for the Birmingham Cross-City route: The BR Class 170 and BR Class 172 - as well as the Class 196 'Civity'. I don't imagine these would all come together, it's probably a trade-off between the 196 and 170 to join the 172, if lucky. These two Turbostars, and Civity are operated by West Midlands Railway (with the 170 also on CrossCountry along this line, however that won't be in this suggestion) - now, let's get into it, shall we? The Twins, and the estranged sibling... The BR Class 170 and 172 are both part of the Turbostar family, all variants of the 170, as well as the 172/0 and 172/1 carry the same, non-gangway look. The only major, noticable differences on the outside are the shape of the windows (the 170 has boxy windows akin to the 377/4 in-game, whilst the 172's are more similar to the 387/2), and the shape of the lights at either end of the train. However, the black sheep of the family, the 172/2 and 172/3 carry a look far more similar to the Electrostar family, with a gangway at either end to allow passengers and staff to go between units when coupled up together. Now, let's take a look at them: BR Class 170 170/5 - WMR Orange & White The BR Class 170/5 was built between 1999 and 2000, and five exist in West Midlands Railway's fleet. These two-car units are found on this line, as well as the Shrewsbury, Snow Hill, and Walsall Lines. These were formerly 170/6s, however the middle coaches were removed to extend some of Cross Country's fleet. BR Class 172 172/0 & 172/1 - WMR Orange & Purple The BR Class 172/0 and BR Class 172/1 are the two variants of the 172 fleet not built for West Midlands Railway (or, as it was, London Midland). The 172/0 was originally built for London Overground, whilst the 172/1 was originally with Chiltern Railways. The /0 was built in 2010, and the /1 - along with the /2 and /3, were built in 2011. There are 8× 172/0 units, and 4× /1 units, all are 2-cars. 172/2 and 172/3 - WMR Additionally, The BR Class 172/2 BR Class 172/3 operate services along this route for West Midlands Railway. These two bare a look more similar to the Class 387 electrostar than their Turbostar siblings. The 172/2 has 2 carriages, with 12 units, whilst the 172/3 has 3 carriages, and 15 units of such. BR Class 196 196/0 & 196/1 - WMR Orange & Purple The BR Class 196 'Civity' DMU was built for WMR between 2019 & 2022 by CAF. A total of 26 units have been built; 12 two-car units (196/0) and 14 four-car units. (196/1) These entered service in late 2022, and currently operate the Birmingham - Hereford and Birmingham - Shrewsbury lines. Timetable Services are the main appeal of these trains for the Cross City line. They offer a fair amount of gameplay opportunities, particularly on the southern end of the route, and they populate Birmingham New Street a hell of a lot more than they do at present. CROSS CITY LINE This DLC would add One train per hour between Birmingham New Street and Bromsgrove (where the service would continue off-route to Worcester or Hereford) - at peak hours, additional services may run. These services would call at University and, occasionally, Barnt Green. BIRMINGHAM NEW STREET The main selling point here is the prospect of a lively Birmingham New Street. This could also provide some extra Class 323 AI, if an expanded timetable were to be added: Services added are as follows: Birmingham NS - Shrewsbury | 1tph Class 170, 172, 196 Wolverhampton - Walsall | 2tph each way Class 170, 172, 196 Birmingham Int - Rugeley TV | 2tph each way Class 323 (+350 if ever added) With that, I conclude this short yet (hopefully) good suggestion, to provide a bit more life to what is, otherwise, a superb route. I would happily take just the 172 if needed, or the 196 - but any of these on their own (bar the 170) would be great for the route. It would be nice for some fast/semi-fast trains on the Birmingham - Bromsgrove section of the line. With that said, I'd like to thank everyone for reading this suggestion! Take care.
Oh yes please, I'd take any of them as either provides a different driving experience compared to the 323 included, but the downside is you are only running the service for 20 minutes, so maybe an extension down towards Worcester would do, would stretch the units' legs out as well and a more exceptable service length too
I prefer to keep my suggestions to stuff that actually do happen, so I won't be throwing a suggestion for an extension in
The Class 170 would be better featuring in another route where we can get more use out of it (such as the Harrogate Loop or the Fife Circle), then sold afterwards as a low price expansion in WMR livery for Birmingham Cross-City - similar to the New Journeys packs. 1 train per hour with a ~20 minute service duration doesn't justify its creation if it has no intention of being used elsewhere IMO. Also to note, the Class 172 has a different drive system, it's diesel-mechanical with an automatic gearbox as opposed to the 170's diesel-hydraulic with a Voith transmission (you can distinctively hear the revs increase and decrease when changing up gears in a 172). I would imagine that would require some (significant?) rework of the Simugraph to modify it from a 170. The 172's also tend to stay on the Snow Hill lines and would less commonly be seen operating out of Birmingham NS anyway.
Would absolutely love to see these three units especially as the 170 would be an easy one to go everywhere, and the 197 would be able to be the basis for the rest of its family if ever they were to appear. I do think as has already been suggested this would go perfectly with at least an extension to Worcester to give the units a nice long run.
A 170 would be great, not just for BCC but MML. Maybe a combined DLC which adds these both liveries and layers for each of the routes. Maybe a 171 too for BML and SEH Ashford. There's be so much use for this. Class 172 use would be very limited, unless we got part of the Snow Hill lines built (which I'd love BTW)
Absolutely Vern, but i guess its a question of where do you stop? Do you go Snow Hill to Kiddy, then folks would want Worcester or Malvern, even Hereford. Or do you go down to Warwickshire? Just to Dorridge and Whitlock's End, or Stratford and Leamington? You could argue make the whole lot - but that is a lot longer than X City with loads of custom station assets required. It's not the TSW way unfortunately.
Which of course brings us back to the fact TSW should have been conceived as a modular system. I have happy memories of the fictional West Midlands route in OpenBVE which was very much inspired by the Snow Hill Lines (with a great deal more tagged on).
Ah Miller St - Wellingham Ludgate Hill. Yes I originally intended to build that BVE route as the real thing, which would have taken years. Tony suggested that I link it with 'Norton' on the existing NWM and make it semi fictional. Fond memories. Sorry, OT thread hijack but that bit of the BVE route is as near as we've got to having the former OWW 'Dark Side' in a train sim even now.
Bring it on and for the WMR Class 170 it can serve as the base model for a Future Scotrail Class 170 route
Whack the 730 in, when they go into service and call this DLC "West Midlands Train Pack". That way, you can capture a future Cross City line, as well as a 2023 cross city line
An extension on BCC would actually be one of the few places where it would work perfectly, as it adds in an extension for the DLC train without affecting the 323 services. All of the electric services do legitimately end at Bromsgrove so the timetable would only need the 170s added, no adjustment to the 323 timings.
That's more of an issue for mergers. It's the technically side of actually editing a 'baked' route and adding more to it that is, supposedly, a really hard task. We just have a bunch of people out of nowhere, who seemingly (like those others above) think that every Loco DLC should come with an extension.
Absolutely spot on and what will happen is this you will have services that have 730 behind a 323 or diesel 172 196.
a class 172 would be excellent on BCC and I have suggested it myself, not sure if it's a step too far for the devs though as it has a more conventional automatic transmission.
That would have something like a Voith or ZF Gearbox from a Bus which would make it play like a class 150 or 158
Just had a quick play of NWM route, a 170 down the loop to Salford Bridge. Still has a great feel to it, the route (and train), the physics, signalling systems and sounds are all top notch. Had a quick search to see if there were any updates and I don't think it's available any more, which is a shame (for anyone that never downloaded it a few years back). I wonder if it's still being worked on, I guess Bescot you were one of the authors, if so, great work!
172s are one of the few that use a ZF most use a Voith but there were a few EMT 158s that were converted to a ZF but were then reverted back to Voith
Find it helpful and I'm wondering which one of them accelerates better Voith Class 158 or ZF Class 158? Because simgraph must simulate them
