A revamped south wales mainline is now available on ats. Looks fantastic. Requirements are Route Requirements For the route to function as intended, all the items required below must be installed: 4AS/Cynx: – Signs Alan Thomson Sim (And their dependencies): – Cambridge to Peterborough – Chat Moss – WCML Missing Link – OHLE pack – Rigid OHLE pack (Freeware) – BHBP V3 (Freeware – Asset folder TwoCats required only) Armstrong Powerhouse: – Signal EP James Class 37: – GWR Station Signs JustTrains: – Southwestern Expressways to Reading – Western Mainlines Major Wales Design: – IET markers Steam: – Birmingham Cross City Line – Brighton Mainline – Chatham Mainline – ECML South – GEML – Liverpool to Manchester via Warrington – Southampton to Bournemouth – South London Network – South Wales Mainline – WCML South – WCML Trent Valley – Welsh Marches: Newport – Shrewsbury link to the route. https://alanthomsonsim.com/downloads/south-wales-mainline-modern/
Looks good but a bit pointless being a freeware product when you need a subscription for the assets required anyway. Shame
funny thing is I did wonder how long it would be until someone moaned about the requirements. Surprise surprise it’s the 1st comment
Not moaning just commenting that its a shame its a freeware route but with payware requirements, it is what it is which is why I said shame. As usual you like to make a big deal of peoples comments, surprise surprise. Are we not allowed to comment now? I just wondered why it wasnt subscription based to start with as only those with a subscription can use it realistically.
No i get that and it no big deal its just a shame as I said originally, thats all. Freeware scenarios requiring a payware route to run on I get but a freeware route requiring a payware subscription seems a bit odd to me. Im not against the subscription idea i just wondered why it wasn't subscription based to start with as you cant effectively use it unless you have one. I guess you could have had a subscription in the past and have the assets for it still? Anyway il say no more because I dont want to derail the thread,looks like a good route.
expect more of the same I imagine in the future iE the sun based and long list of requirements. Tbh I find the value of an ATS sub worth it for what you get. Definitely something to consider in the future. Mine paid for itself instantly when I got the ATS payware routes and 185 etc with the discount
Well i dont want to get into a discussion about the value of the subscription, thats for the individual to decide I just wondered why it was released as freeware when you cant effectively use it without a sub. The routes on there do look good but for me I spend too much time doing the job for real and don't get enough time outside of work to invest that much into it lol.
I have to say that when I see a list of over 20 dependencies (without counting sub-dependencies) it immediately makes me loose interest in a route. It would be helpful to know which of the dependencies are critical, which are important and which are minor.
I agree with you. Yes this looks like a very good route. But I do wonder why some route builders include little bits of a lot of other routes - why can they not keep it simple. I would need to purchased 4 ATS packs – Cambridge to Peterborough - £23.99 – Chat Moss - £26.99 – WCML Missing Link - £32.99? – OHLE pack - £12.99 Just short of £100 for the 4 items - Yes a subscription would cover part of those costs And two JT routes - that I have no interest in. – Southwestern Expressways to Reading - £30.99 – Western Mainlines - £27.99 So that's another £59 The stupid part is you have to buy Both the DTG South Wales Mainline and the Just Trains Western Mainlines even though the upgrade is just for one of them. Yes I'm going on about the cost of such add-ons but I'm retired since 2016. Does not matter how nice it looks if you cannot afford it.
Not getting into the age old discussion of price verses quality and all that, I'm just thankful I already had every requirement apart from the one which was the solid OHLE which is freeware anyway. If you can, enjoy it.... If you can't, then go enjoy what you already have, I'm sure you've already spent the money on the things you most wanted already anyway.. Go on, go, have fun, life is short.
My understanding is that this would be a superset route for those you listed. Using the best parts from each to create something truly pretty or even realistic. I find that in this hobby you're supposed to pick an approach and then stick with it. After that it's like a religious war, so I'm stopping just at the mention. Your feedback is valid information to the author (downvote / ignored due to prerequisite bloat) regardless. I am just afraid it won't get much sympathy due to various biases - particularly those who agree but convinced themselves they need to suffer this for quality.
funny enough that is the only pack I was missing as well and don’t know how lol. Perhaps because I had the payware OHLE installed.
Grrr.... missing one of the required JT routes. Will need to sort that out, as this route is a must have... it looks fab!
Anyone got a link to "James Class 37:– GWR Station Signs" ? Can't seem to find it anywhere on his website.
Yeah here it is mate https://jamesclass37.weebly.com/multipack-route-asset-downloads.html then find GWML Electrification Project Station Signage Pack
Isn’t, WCML missing link, a free download? https://alanthomsonsim.com/?download=west-coast-mainline-midlands-and-northwest-aka-missing-link
I think that its OK for someone to build a route that uses lots of payware and freeware if its a route they want to use. Its then quite a community spirited thing to make that route available to the community so that those who are interested can have a go on it. I can't see why the fact that it needs lots of payware is an issue at all. After all no-one is being forced to download the route, and if the amount of payware is an issue then one option is to have a crack at duplicating the payware issues yourself by a bit of modelling. Its what used to happen. If no-one released anything but routes where they hed either sourced all freeware or built everything the number of routes woudl be smaller or at risk of freeware no longer being available. It seems pretty odd to me that the fact that a route needs any amount of payware is even worth an adverse comment.
I'll hold my hand up to being one of the naysayers re. sub based content, but after giving in I've found that it's the best 30 0dd quid I've spent. I've now got to buy the Camb-Pet route to use this great looking freebee and I may as well buy the KX to Kings Lynn full route whilst I am it, at 50% off it's a good deal. I made my money back with Chat Moss and the class 185 in a sale. Now I just wished I'd taken the 50% subscription offer earlier in the year, never mind.
Like you I took a sub and it paid itself off in one go plus I got the fantastic missing link as well which in my opinion is as good as buying a 24,99 route anyway. I own all the pay-ware on ATs and find it to be really high quality. The subware is a nice bonus. Will I renew come November 100 percent.
I had a sub a year ago I hope they have not been updated so I can use this it looks fantastic. I do not mind when they use lots of routes as I bet a lot of people already own them anyway. I will try and have a go on this tonight.
I haven’t tried it myself yet as I don’t have time, but I saw the preview and it looks stunning. Having built up a collection over a number of years. I’m fortunate that I have all of the required payware. So I should be set. I really don’t mind the fact that it uses payware though. Acquiring the payware I need for certain ‘free’ routes had become part of the fun for me, waiting for sales and then picking the DLC’s that fill most gaps. (I even made spreadsheets). It’s also introduced me to payware routes that I wouldn’t have bought otherwise (e.g. Woodhead) and I’ve really enjoyed some of them. As for the ATS sub, I avoided it for a long time as I really didn’t understand what I was paying for, but I joined up recently (wanted Chat Moss) and it’s more than paid for itself in discounts. Anyway - really looking forward to playing this one when I get a chance and seeing what scenarios people come up with.
That's exactly what I thought. It wouldn't be a proper ATS freeware item without requiring subscription items. I also notice the signal EP is required. Would try this, but I wouldn't be able to run it. And before I get a reply about how the sub pays for itself: I am fully aware. If you want to pay over $100 I can't afford for me, go ahead. I didn't know until it was too late.
a cracking route you will enjoy it I certainly did last night and ultra smooth fps they have done a fantastic job.
Thanks. I was actually looking for it word for word on the site. Didn't think to look inside that pack
As a local to this route and having wanted a current up to date version of the South Wales Main Line ever since I first ventured into the world of TS, I must just say... WOW!! These guys knocked it out of the park, I was blown away by this last night, I would love to post more about it but right now I'm on my phone andI hate typing on phones, but wow, this is stunning work! Very happy Reef right now.
I'm not saying this is a bad route as it looks very good from the pictures posted I understand that being Freeware it will need some Payware to make it work - that is a sort of given with most Freeware routes. My problem is the Amount of Payware that is required. I understand you need DTG South Wales Mainline but why is the JT Western Mainlines required? What is unique about the Cambridge to Peterborough and Chat Moss lines that needs to go in to this route What is unique on WCML Missing Link that needs to go it to this route? Is there another Warrington Bank Quay between Bristol and Swansea. I think the Author could have looked at the assets used and found alternatives in some of the other payware. The comment "if the amount of payware is an issue then one option is to have a crack at duplicating the payware issues yourself by a bit of modelling" is a bit sarcastic - just because you might be able to create stuff for this game not everyone has your skills
Not really at the moment, I was far too busy enjoying myself to remember to screenshot, and when I did I missed an AWS .. Here's one of the few very similar ones I did grab though..
funny enough when I saw this released I thought of you lol. Seems to be our week this week in TSC completely agree with you the developers have done a fantastic job and look forward to the further progress they have on this. as usual people complain about assets involved like you I am Lucky I was only missing the freeware ohle pack. Developers appears to be dammed if they do and dammed if they don’t. People want realism. Freeware developers give us that at a price by means of large requirements. They don’t do realism by cutting down on requirements and get moaned it. I do feel sorry for freeware developers at times sometimes they must sit there and go why do I even bother if people will just moan.
As you say the concept of having payware assets in a freeware route isn't a new thing but im not sure they needed to use that many different assets (freeware or payware) in 1 route. I think they've used the platform lofts from the ats Cambridge to Peterborough route but would anyone have noticed any different if they had used something else? I'm not so sure tbh. I can understand a lot of assets for scenarios especially if you want realistic stock but for routes when they are effectively just reusing assets from so many other routes I'm not sure its entirely needed. Thing is everyone will have an opinion and developers will know that and need to accept that if something is going out to the public. I certainly applaud the work gone into it though and like I said before I'm sure its fantastic and maybe over time il pick the bits up needed for it but for now its a non starter .
You want a problem, use Phorum Peninsula when LTHC has the same core assets (except for some dolphin tables and such).
my attitude as well and with all the projects on the go alot is going to be exclusive to subs i reckon
749006 wrote: My intention wasn't sarcastic. I don't do sarcastic on this forum as its too easy for people to react as you have done. It IS an option. The point is that for those of us that don't have the skills or time to make replacement assets, and I include myself in that we for many complex assets, then we have to accept the choices made by those who are giving their time and efforts for free. Its an attitude thing. It looks a lovely peice of work, I don't have all the assets either, but I don't think that is the creators problem.
Your right it is an attitude problem - that the builders of some routes will put as many different things from other routes on their map. They own the various stuff to start with so they think its ok to include other stuff that "think" fits. No consideration of instead of using assets from xxx route to use similar ones from yyy route. Compare that with German routes https://rail-sim.de/forum/filebase/entry/1604-rodachtalbahn-plus-3-1/ This is the Rodoctalbahn Plus 3.1 which has 160 miles/200km of track with 46 stations And it requires TWO Payware routes that have been around from 1992 onwards and cost £20 for both. The rest of the assets for the Freeware Route are FREEWARE
It's not 'an attitude problem' developer end and to say so is rather impetuous if you ask me. The things included are included for a reason. Did anyone think to go and ask the developer why such and such a route is needed for such and such an asset? There are a lot of assets used to make this as realistic as possible and even then, because it is a freeware project they've had to use kit bashes in certain areas because they could not afford to have assets built for them. You have two choices - accept that you can't play it because of the requirements list (which is a shame) or over time, get the requirements to play the route. Nobody is forcing you to do either and quite frankly to have a go at developers for producing something as good as this route is, is abhorrent
It's "abhorrent" to suggest that freeware developers consider the possibility of cutting back on requirements? I don't think just because something's free makes it beyond criticism. Not to mention of course that the continental mindset is completely different in this regard.
My view point is yes. It doesn't matter how developer 'A' does things on the continent. The fact is developer 'B' here has used what they have to make the route as realistic as is possible and have spent 18 months developing this wanting nothing in return for it. Quite frankly having run it a few times, I find it to be of pay-ware quality and had they gone that route perhaps the requirements list could have been brought down. It is what it is, but I stand by my statement.
First I have no idea on how to ask why an asset was used. Second I have the Steam routes but I don't have most of the other stuff. Having ran it thru TSTools the route requires - From Peterborough to Cambridge - 6 Scenery items (two lamps, two trees, a wall and a post.) From Chat Moss - Two Track Rules and 8 Scenery items - (Decals) From South Western Expressways - ONE Item - Barton Hill Sheds for £30.99 - the area is modelled in the DTG Base route. TBH I would have preferred for ATS to have packaged this up with the ATS assets included for a cost. I'm not having a go at what has been produced as the quality is very good from what I have seen. I'm having a go at the choice of some of the assets used
I feel the way it happens, first someone just nicely notes their sadness or somesuch, but then as people defend it, the expressions escalate and people feel forced to think about it and get more and more emotional. Best to leave it from the get go and accept these as a personal opinion. Applying to both sides, there is no need to convince, change the mind (approach of any regular). Like how I'm sometimes considered a loser for not buying the entire UK 3rd party catalogue, all the while my casual ignorance was shouted back that I must be on a campaign against 3rd parties, shoo, get out. That's the difficulty of discussing 3rd party here. Some of you already have their offerings, so this is just a nice touch and would be silly not to have it. Others don't, and to those this can be a mountain of content, on top of already owned, yet to play mountain. This may be a little difficult for some to process (example: I have some Class 20 and 60 scenery shots, but checked the DLC, it's too big, so I had to make a choice, however I could also come back and nag at the author every opportunity, sign of an unresolved internal conflict) and hence a bit of bantering must be accepted, with just a reminder to keep it civil and avoid going in circles. The idea is universal, I was discussing many years ago with RBJets why he only uses stock supplied with the routes. He said, he wants people to be able to play their stuff, everyone is welcome to swap in anything fancy they own. Of course this is a route, so.
