So I've come back on here after leaving at the announcement of 4, to see if anythings is going to happen anytime soon about the content that's broke that I've already paid for on tsw 3. I haven't been paying attention as I'm still that fed up with the announcement of 4, I'm not buying it, all I want is my content I've already bought to work correctly and bug free. Is that too much to ask? But looking on this forum there's now next to no mention on 3 anymore, brushed under the carpet never to be seen again no doubt. Bet we won't get the sehs stop markers, whens the nyt timetable coming to 3? Will the hst wipers get fixed? Absolute joke I don't know why I've bothered to come and check.
Indeed. I am one of the lucky ones who was happy with the price for TSW4, but I do find it unacceptable that TSW2020, TSW2, and TSW3 are not getting bugfixed. I can understand them not getting new features or updates - TOD4 on SEHS not coming to TSW2 and TOD4 for Dresden not coming to TSW3 is fine for me, but fixing bugs like the Boston Sprinter's Cold as Ice scenario an the Talent 2 introduction bug on Schnellfahrstrecke Koln-Aachen, and the BR143 introduction on Dresden should not be locked behind TSW4, even if you do want and like it (like I do).
TSW4 will not be any different based on the evidence of what has gone before. Again based on history TSW4 wont have a long shelf life before becoming abandonware itself. Not much of an incentive to buy, especially to get fixes for obsolete software that probably wont be delivered before it itself becomes obsolete (again based on evidence of what has gone before). They've got to fix the mess that is launch first, then deliver the editor etc etc which should have been part of launch... then continue shovelling DLC out the door.. At no point in that priority strategy do I see a space for fixes. No doubt the empty promises will be told, perhaps even well meaning intentions but I have my doubts. Empirical historical evidence informs us of the realities.
I think it has to do with how TSW DLC are build. Each TSW Version 2 ..3 .. 4 is literally its own DLC. Im sure they would want to threat the older versions equally, but it's additional work, and they focus obviously on the newest version first. There are other games where it's just the same. Once a new version comes out, the old one get maybe 1 or 2 last updates then it's up to the players to either "move on" or play "as it is and will remain" It sounds maybe a bit harsh, but that is the reality in gaming industry. They simply can't babysit older versions forever. Nowdays it's all about life service games and the neverending treadmill that requiere people constantly moving on and invest into their gaming. Thats how it it's and to be fair it's meanwhile widely accepted and became " normal standard " within the gaming community.
Hey - the latest can be found here on the content coming to TSW3 (scroll to the bottom): https://live.dovetailgames.com/live/train-sim-world/articles/article/tsw4-roadmap-part2-24th-august
To be honest though JD, that looks a lot like the list at the bottom of the roadmap when tsw 3 came out containing fixes for tsw 2 which im sure never really came, so i'm not holding my breath we'll even get that. And i find it unbelievable that all of us who bought the class 700 but not tsw 4 will never get the updated sehs, the markers for a train we already paid for. Not to mention the list of other issues that will never get sorted.
This is very harsh seeing as the Class 700 DLC was only released about 70 days before TSW4 came out and support was dropped for the sim it was released for!
This is only the 2nd day since the full release of TSW4 and there are issues on the release, I would give them time to work on those, and then the "short window" in which TSW3 patches are promised. So a couple of weeks I would say, maybe a month, will show whether TSW3 will have the same fate as TSW2.
Knowing their track record, most of the issues with TSW4 content will not be fixed until TSW5... So if you like the TSW4 routes, don't buy them now, but wait for TSW5 coming in a year to actually recieve fixes for them. With the current DTG policy it just does not worth it to buy anything at release. Content is rushed and released with full of issues, only to be partially fixed half or a whole year later at best. Just look at NY - Tenton, for example. Even if the updated timetable releases for TSW3, they introduced a few new bugs alongside it. And even if those bugs get fixed, I am pretty sure the future patch will only be applied to the TSW4 version. So if you bought NY-Trenton for TSW3, you are f..ed and stuck with a broken, abandonware route.
Well meanwhile people should know how DTG works on their releases, how they communicate things, and how their after salery support does handle issues. Nobody here, aside those who stumbled over TSW for their first time, should expect miracles and keep their expectations realistic. I mean gaming studios earn some sort of long time individual reputation each. My personal example is the DB 187 loco. Wanted to buy it for 2 years now, and still have not, and gave up on it meanwhile. The sound is still absolute garbage, even after the recent patch. People can always wait for reviews, watch the usual route introduces on their stream and decide then if a product is worth the purchase and their time. Just need to overcome the urge to have everything right away on the first day, especially when they know about the tendency that released content has its flaws and quirks.... literally every time something gets released.
Seeing that TSW3 was such a mess that it pushed off TSW2 fixes and now the sorry state of the TSW4 launch... I wouldn't be surprised in history repeated itself yet again.
It took a long time for DTG to give TSW2 the coup de grace, the poor thing suffered long and painfully at the stake. I don't think it will take anywhere near as long for TSW3, although those few remaining patches could " wait for a release spot " for several months before they fade away and receive the " stroke of mercy ".
it’s a thread about TSW3 and how it’s been abandoned without bug fixes, even when it’s had recent releases. just kidding I see what you did like with Edinburgh thread
You’ve set your expectations too high my friend. Bug free? Bugs will exist in this game, no matter what game version you play. It’s impossible for the devs to fix everything. Example, Just today I encountered two broken services. When spawning in it didn’t spawn into my train, but instead a different station (on foot). Once they get fixed it will then break something else. If you feel that way about TSW then it’s probably best you find a new train sim, since this one will just end up disappointing you further. I know in my heart that this game will never be perfect, and I’m fine with that. Other people wouldn’t be able to comprehend that thought process though.
No software is ever bug free, but this is not an excuse to leave your game in such a sorry state. TSW is a joke in this regard, because it's filled with easy to fix issues that could have easy been avoided with some minimal polish. But this is what you get when you rush every release and when your QA admitedly consist of simply checking if the game runs without crashing, not looking out for anything else.
I truly believe that the whole reason for having TSW4 is so that TSW2 and TSW3 can be laid to rest and forgotten about. Prove me wrong!
But the same thing will happen in a year or two when they release TSW5. Because they will. Once they see people keep buying it up each year, they will keep releasing it each year, because it's basically free money. Would love to be proven wrong though.
Pretty soon TSW4 won't be getting updated or bug fixed either, in less than a year probably. But it's good for business as it almost forces you to buy TSW5 doesn't it?
I would suggest at least adding the HST wipers/rain texture bug to this list of TSW3 fixes, as it is a game breaking bug and was introduced in an update when livery designer capability was added to the loco, a feature that only some players use. All players need to use the windscreen to see through. It does also need fixing in TSW4 as a matter of urgency too. It should have been fixed immediately after the update that broke it, when reported, even if it meant taking away livery designer capability to fix it. I know it is only one bug out of many but it is one of the most serious ones that has been introduced by a lack of testing of a new feature on an existing train. As for the missing timeframe for all TSW3 fixes, it would be a good idea to get them done sooner rather than later so that a repeat of the now abandoned TSW2 fixes doesn’t happen again. It will still be abandoned software but it will at least have conformed to what you have promised.
Yes and this is what i fear, it makes me glad to have not bought into 4 this time coming on here and seeing the issues. But it means anything for tsw 3 will most likely get forgotten. Same thing will happen next year with tsw 5, so whats the incentive to buy any more? But thats the issue, how is it so unstable and untested that any tinkering with it can completely mess something else entirely up. And its not on leaving bugs in legacy content that have been introduced by new content or fixes. I've played games my whole life i'm in my late 20s and i've never had an experience like this with any other company or game. I've enjoyed playing for the past couple of years but yes it has all put me off really and so i haven't been playing anywhere near as much as i was. It doesnt help that i'm loving starfield, cities skyline 2 and forza are coming out soon, so its a great time for new games. It's easy to put it down. It's great ive got loads of content that i've paid good money for, but whos to say it'll even work properly the next time I fire it up. This is my issue. You heard it here first!
Just like 2 , 3 was forgotten about a week after it launched! More import was given to banging out new DLC as fast and as frequent as they could than was given to fixing most of the bugs and issues the game has
I was pretty enthusiastic about getting TSW 4 and then a little time later I just stopped caring. None of the routes with the game appealed to me, and I don't see the point of getting it yet since I only play ECW and London Commuter about 90% of the time. However, if a route came out that I have an interest in, then that will change. Also, there is no debate when it comes to TSW 4 vs. Assassin's Creed Mirage.
Going to pre-order my copy of AC Mirage today. I’m very hyped as they’ve finally taken the series back to its original roots. The whole reason I fell in love with AC in the first place.
If the reports of frequent crashes to desktop on Xbox are true, then even the "runs without crashing" test was overlooked
Well, yeah. I just watched a video of a dude playing the new NY-Trenton timetable. Poor man tried to take a screenshot with the new free camera tool, then the game crashed, lol.
Okay so the updates aren’t exactly a lot are they considering the amount of issues that have been reported on this forum.I feel it’s all been overlooked because you wanted to make more money and not help your existing content. I’m sorry but my patience has worn very thin now and many others likewise. I definitely won’t be getting TSW4 as DTG obviously hasn’t learnt a single thing about sorting bugs out as it’s still happening as I type in TSW4…what a waste of time doing this. It really is a big hype for next to nothing. Why don’t you forget about trying to put old content into new as it’s clearly not working and sort out better optimisation,I’m not spending a single penny till I see greater improvements
Well. I certainly forgot. Not because I’ve “upgraded”, but because because I feel like I’m playing the same game, just with new routes. Look, don’t get me wrong, I like the new routes and they’re part of the reason I bought into TSW4. Pricing was fine for me, for what I was getting. The other reason is because I do enjoy the game (warts and all) and want to continue to have access to content and updates. I play a lot, I get my moneys worth. But this thing they’re doing where they sell a new “core” that’s basically the same as the last core- and then forget about the old core that is pretty much same as the new core… it’s just going to get increasingly annoying on so many levels. Then old routes get broken, like no passengers on BRO, Mainz, NYT, Peak Forest, etc. Red light issues on BRO. Subbed CC liveries are all wonked out. And then having to redownload and piece together an increasingly growing library for no good reason just gives me the ships. I don’t have the solution and it’s not about the money to me, but I really hope they are thinking about doing something a little more sustainable and less annoying for the players. Anyway, thanks for listening to my Ted Talk and remember to try to enjoy the game.
the bugs of TSW4 have nothing to do with the presence old content, maybe the crash has something to do with total memory but that would happen if the new iteration had an equal amount of dlc aswell. I’d much rather my content comes along than stay on abandoned iterations, they’re would be no collection otherwise (well very minimal collection) and TSW4 would have 5 locos instead of the current 60 or more ish.
This could very easily be avoided by not re-releasing the same game every 1-2 years... DTG is simply causing problems for everyone, including themselves. But that's what you get when money is your only motivation.
My own thoughts on the elements in your post which Ive selected (and which I completely agree with btw) are below. Forgive the self quoting but I couldnt type that lot out again..
-"delivering recurring revenue -a step forward in moving up the value chain -Dovetail should record in excess of £15m in revenue for the year ending March 31, 2023. -For years, the studio has adopted a robust business model based on synergies between full game releases and a strong live service content strategy providing recurring revenue -This acquisition of this UK-based studio, with established owned IPs and delivering recurring revenue is aligned with Focus’ Strategy..." It works for them. Theyre not going to change that, especially given the acquisition by Focus. TSW3 will probably (almost certainly) go the way of TSW2, TSW2020 etc. DTG have to sort out the mess from the launch, clearly priority 1. They have another DLC looming from 3rd party sources. Then more DLC to prepare and pump as part of that umbrella strategy. I dont see much space in that for fixes on what has been officially labelled obsolete product. Best application of effort in my view now is to place pressure on those elements you'd like to see resolved for the inevitable TSW5 release probably back in the regular cycle period next year.
It just does not worth it. Even if you are passionate about something, at best case scenario it gets taken care of in a year. By that time you have given up or we are already at the next TSW iteration. Unless you are entirely satisfied with a given DLC, it does not worth buying it, because even if it recieves updates or new content, by then you will have the buy the next release of the game - so no point in buying anything and hoping for improvements. Thanks god I have not bought New York - Trenton for TSW3, because even if the new timetable releases for it at some point, who know what else gets broken. And those newly broken things will never get fixed. I also regret buying Oakville Subdivision a few sales ago based on the promises of the passenger layer, because who knows if that one ever gets released at this point... Even if it does, I bet it will not for TSW3.
Well, the UK DLC at least has this going for it... It runs a a lot better than the real railway. Perhaps that could be an advertising point. "TSW4 UK, better than the real thing. Optional extra- replacement bus service courtesy of our new tie in with Bus Simulator. Experience the thrills of packing all your passengers onto a bus designed for half the number of people. Experience the danger of standing on a packed platform surrounded by stranded trains as your entire workforce downs tools. Decide whether or not to help sort out the chaos or retreat to the nearest Weatherspoons for a cheeky pint.. TSW4 UK, Live the dream".
I don't know what the difference between a ordinary consumer and a dev kit xbox is, but should not be it always tested on exact the same ordinary consoles that everyone is able to buy ?
I believe a devkit Xbox has a lot of debugging tools attached that can help with optimising the game and seeing why a game crashed. Indeed, it would be a good idea to test it on a consumer Xbox before release, but DTG can't get one for some reason. Why can't they go to the shops and get one? Probably because in order to test the game on the Xbox they just bought, they would have to release the game onto the Xbox store, allowing everyone access to the untested product before downloading it onto the Xbox, and then they get the bug reports from us anyway. Basically, it doesn't really make sense to go out and buy one.
From what Matt said on the roadmap stream the devkit is supposed to pretend it's a retail kit for testing but for some reason retail kits install the game differently to dev kits, which is why the game crashed on start up. They have now worked out how to make the dev kit perform exactly like a retail kit so this testing error shouldn't happen again. It does, though, raise the question of what is the point of Microsoft's certification process? I was always under the impression the game was supplied to the console manufacturer's for certification, and that they would fail it if the game didn't even load, so did Microsoft just not bother to test it, or are Microsoft themselves testing on a spec that differs to retail kits?
