Upcoming Release Centro Regional Railways Class 323 - Coming Soon!

No offense taken tbh
I don’t have a dog in the fight, I just don’t understand how this release would be a negative.
If anything it’s pretty insignificant, but not negative.
Creators club stinks. So I don’t see this conflicting with CC in anyway. Problem with CC is that if I throw a regional railways livery on a 323, the substitution rate is going to be unreasonably high. Also, some consists will be mixed with old and new livery. Absolute eyesore.
That said, besides outdated liveries and some scenarios and a super low substitution rate (which is good)… it doesn’t add too much but it also doesn’t cost us much if we wanted to add slight variety to BCC.
Doesn’t do enough for me but I can see why someone else would grab it

 

Solution to that issue with the livery designer would be if the player had control on how often they can see a certain livery or on what train a livery can appear in. It is surprising that DTG have not implemented a tool like that in the game

 

Sure, Rivet and Skyhook haven’t exactly gone on to produce much in terms of good content (with their debut releases being some of their weakest), but at least when starting off they released things that contributed a good bit to the game. There’s plenty of value that came from River’s new locomotive (which was the first German diesel in TSW!) or Skyhook’s first route (first TSW desert route + impressive scenery). When comparing their TSW debut to SimTrack’s, it’s hard to be very inspired by what they’re offering here: a regular livery. Like I’m so sorry to SimTrack, I just can’t feel positive about the future if this is all there is to offer for a while. It’s just a poor first impression for me.

I’m hoping to see some good releases from this developer in the future, but how optimistic can I be when this is all they’ve offered, y’know? Admittedly this is a tough crowd. I don’t even know why I feel the need to complain about this. “Vote with my wallet” yada yada yada. It’s just frustrating to see a new developer come to TSW and immediately join what has become a trend with things like the loco bundles, livery packs, and now the small gameplay packs that have been getting released for TSW4. I don’t want TSW to continue in the way it’s going and I wish I could have more of a reason to get excited for what’s being made for the game. But I can’t, because we’re getting tanker wagons and simplistic liveries being sold to us when they really shouldn’t be costing extra money on top of what players are already paying for the routes these add-ons are for.

Sorry for the rant I feel tired typing out words and producing thoughts with my brain

 

Just Trains, Rivet, Skyhook and TSG are all examples of third parties who have experience with working with DTG and releasing products previously.

This is totally new to us. Starting off small allows us to learn in a more controlled manner whilst we continue to gain experience with the tools and development processes.

 

Out of interest, will SimTrack focus on any content for routes before the TSW 3/4 era? I ask as, in my opinion, a lot of the older TSW routes/locos i.e. those from TSW 2 and before, whether RSN and MSB to BML, ECW, NTP etc are more interesting, thus I'd like to see content for these which definitely need some freshness and new gameplay.

 

Oh hell no, another paid repaint, I think this shouldn‘t be the first step for new developers, to get into a partnership.

 

We're certainly open to it, but at the moment there's no firm plans. We're taking the suggestions forum into account, so it's definitely worth suggesting ideas and getting support for them.

 

Those were just reskins. They didn't come with any scenarios or new features in the cab.

 

There are many scenario packs for TSC that cost more than this and don’t come with any reskins or features at all. I would also expect this livery to be significantly higher quality than those on creators club.

Some people seem to be mistaking their own preferences for facts. It‘s fine to not want it, but saying they shouldn’t have done it as a first project is in my opinion wrong. It’s their own choice and they‘ve provided their reasons.

To balance the argument. I have a connection to Birmingham and remember Centro. I also prefer scenarios. I find timetables incredibly boring. So £5 seems like a bargain to me. It’s less than a cup of coffee where I live.

So I applaud them for getting involved in TSW. Hopefully they will prove themselves as delivering high quality and interesting DLC.

I‘m looking forward to this more than Skyhooks wagons (and I don’t dislike them either, but still don’t know the price).

 

I just paid £10 for a beer.

I don’t have a problem with this for £4.99, good on these guys for stepping up.

 

Don't know what all the fuss is about. Reskins have been sold on TSC for many years, often without any scenarios. I've purchased a number of them myself.

 

Many great film directors started by doing music videos or adverts. SO ST is starting small- so what? If you really think the price of a Starbucks is too much for a livery and five scenarios, don't buy it.

 

It was not Tory policy to privatise the railways until the 1992 election. The Centro brand introduction was about regional identity, like Mersyerail, not as a precursor to a sell-off.

 

They would have been planning the privatisation a few years before it actually happened.

 

Nice! I'll buy this

 

I worked for BR in 1990; we weren't planning for it then. Indeed, Thatcher was still in post in 1990, and had ruled it out. It was only in 1992 it became a serious proposal that "they" then had to plan.

 

I thought it had started with the sectorisation in the 80s.

You learn something new every day, I guess.

 

What's that supposed to mean? Again, as a person who hardly plays scenario and I ain't the only person that doesn't use scenarios, this doesn't offer much if anything at all. A couple new buttons and switches for what is essentially the same train we already have doesn't justify this being payware.

 

Why are people so upset at this?

It's a new developer. This is their first TSW project. They just so happened to decide to give the 323 a new livery and some scenarios for a pre-existing route.

They are obviously not going to make it free, as the money they make could go towards a bigger project.

 

Some people will want it. Some people will not. Don't see the issue with having a view on the product.

 

There's having a view, and there's thinking it should be free because it's 'just a reskin' despite it being from a different developer new to TSW.

 

I would rather have the developers start small than to do something too big and doing a poor job on it. Remember things take time to make and eventually they are going to need money. A brand new loco might not have been financially viable or too much for them to do. Simtrack are completely brand new team made by a few people and have not made content before. Tsg had experience in tsc and in tsw, they were a 2nd party who helped make trains but didn't release their own version until tsw2. Rivet and skyhook also made many routes in tsc and have much bigger teams so they can work on much bigger projects. Even rivet started small with the 204 which didn't turn out great. Skyhook went with a short freight route and recycled some content. All developers gotta start somewhere and I would rather have them do what they are comfortable with than to do more than they can chew

 

As I posted earlier, liveries and scenarios are already available on CC, and can be done using the tools ingame (livery designer and scenario planner) so the reason that they were learning the tools isn't valid here, you don't need to use dev tools to do this.

 

Honestly the fact that you guys have managed to fix the AI PIS bug on the 323 is so amazing and I’m so thankful that you finally had a look at it.

This probably isn’t possible, but since you have been able to fix the 323, can you also fix the SEHS trains as all of them (except the 700) also have the PIS bug, and it’s so annoying and DTG clearly are not interested in going back to fix it.
Thanks

 

Sectorisation was something completely different. It actually does make sense to have staff and rolling stock dedicated to particular types of traffic, each with a distinct "identity". The Sectors were divided that way, with comparatively few and porous regional divisions. Regional Railways was the Sector with the most obvious regional structure, with some specific regions obtaining their own variant of the RR livery. NSE was also conspicuously confined to one corner of the country, displacing Regional Railways from it.

The situation was different in the infrastructure departments, which were organised regionally and meant to cooperate with the operating departments (ie. the Sectors). But they effectively got their own operating Sector as well, in the form of the Dutch-liveried "departmental" stock. This meant that they didn't have to borrow stock on a regular basis from other Sectors.

Privatisation erased all of the divisions by traffic type (except for keeping passenger services distinct from freight) and imposed very stark divisions by region and route instead. All of the "identities" and internal cohesion that BR had carefully fostered, and which were beginning to show concrete success, were deliberately destroyed. The different subsectors of Railfreight and the Parcels sector were clumsily carved up into three regional "bundles", which made so little commercial sense (since freight by its very nature tends to cross regional boundaries) that nobody would bid for any single one of them; EWS snapped up all three as a job lot. What they did to the infrastructure departments was arguably even worse.

So instead of traffic being organised by type and infrastructure by region and route, which intuitively made sense, we ended up with traffic being organised by region and route, and infrastructure by type (which did not make sense). On top of that, rolling stock was now owned by ROSCOs who were allocated it by class and type, so when operators leased stock they effectively had only one ROSCO to get the stock they needed from, but had to compete with other operators in bidding for that pool of stock. It's difficult to imagine a more dysfunctional way of setting things up.

 

What tools do they need to learn to make a new livery and some scenarios? The tools are already in the game. That reason is just not valid.

 

We have another payware reskin? Really? What is the point of these? Why is there a need to charge for what is essentially a reskin and some scenarios when I can get liveries and scenarios in TSC for free? This whole excuse of this is a new developer trying to learn the tools isn't valid considering that the tools to make liveries and scenarios are already in the game. Not to mention the editor. Dev tools aren't necessary to make a new livery and some scenarios

 

Tools are still tools. They still had to learn how to create liveries, add new cab elements, fix bugs and create scenarios. They still gotta start somewhere no matter how small it is. Once they master that, then they know how to create more advanced content. I'm happy to pay for gameplay packs. Only limitation is that I don't have unlimited money and don't really play the route enough because it just takes too long. To each their own

 

I wonder how other players were able to make modded/non modded liveries and scenarios without changing a penny. They would have to learn themselves as well. This is just a cheap way to make a quick buck in my view

 

Simtrack is in for making money, players using the scenario editor, livery editor and TSW editor aren't.

That's where the difference lies.

 

Hence why it's a cheap way to make a quick buck in my view.

 

If there was a chance to earn easy money, I'd take it.

 

Will it have PS5 Dualsense feedback? Audio alerts coming through speaker on controller.

 

They would earn more doing new timetable. I would pay for this 10 bucks.

 

Welcome

I keep reading your name in my head as Saint Lucas

Please help

 

So you wouldn't mind having shady business practices. You would make a great ceo of DTG or EA with that statement to be honest.

 

Glad It's not just me

 

I wouldn't call a loco reskin a shady practice, that goes to releasing routes with bugs and not fixing them.

 

Don’t really see the issue with this pack to be honest. The fixes look to be coming regardless if you buy it or not, would be more of a shady practice if you had to buy it to get the bug fixes. Some will like it some won’t, but just don’t buy it if you don’t like it.

There are a lot more actual issues like a long list of unfixed issues across all routes and lack of quality in general release of DLC.

 

The tools in the game are absolutely not the tools used to create liveries and scenarios for DLCs. It's a completely different process.

Correct. The WMR livery fixes are not locked behind a paywall.

 

This is so strange seeing this post as this livery appeared in my game a couple of weeks ago on one of my timetabled services

 

So it's not only me doing that then! Makes me feel a bit better.

 

You probably installed a Creators Club livery.

 

No creators club livery installed

 

You can't already have it if it hasn't yet been released.

 

You either downloaded a creators club livery and forgot about it or it's named something else or you have a pc and downloaded it from the mod website. There is no centro 323 in tsw

 

I will buy this as a gesture of good will and I like the livery, so no problem for me. It's a start and I am sure this new developer will bring more to the table once they get off the ground.

 

I’m not an idiot, nothing is installed or downloaded. It just appeared as part of the unit

 

How can it appear, without being a mod or creators club livery, as part of the game when the official product hasn't been released.

 

Personally it doesn't interest me. But like other DLC if it doesn't interest me then I won't buy it.

But not really fair to dump on the product, or the company making it because you are not interested it.

I'd understand if it was full of bugs but it hasn't been released yet.

I had no interest in the UP reskin pack, or the trainbow ICE repaints. So I don't own them.

I'm not too keen on steam after SOS so I didn't get the Peak Forest route, or the steam Rivet add on for WCL.

And I don't really play Arosa so i said no to the RHB anniversary pack and the new one they released.

You don't have to buy it if you don't want it. You won't miss out.

But I have no opinion on whether they have value or not. Just because I don't find value in it doesn't mean someone else will. DTG look at sales numbers for sure and if something doesn't sell after a few tries then they will hold back.

i.e. US freight doesn't sell well so thats why there have been a pause in freight. Steam isn't selling as well so thats why thats been few and far between. But that will probably change when we get manual firing as that seems the biggest issue.