Where's The New Suspension System In Train Sim World 4?

Train Sim World 4 was published on September 26th, 2023, and it is now February 27th, 2024, five months later, and we still do not have the new suspension system, which was intended to be a "core feature". It was not even in the roadmap, and there was no mention of it on the Dovetail Direct stream either. What happened to it? When is it going to be released?

 

They did mention it in The DTD. TLDR: they‘re working on it. It‘ll come out when it’s ready….

 

Have a feeling that they will use it as a main selling point for TSW 5 when it comes..

 

Soon™

 

So, if it wasn't ready, why was it advertised as a core feature for Train Sim World 4?

 

TSW8 probably.

 

Now that is the $64,000 question.

If you search the forums you will see a number of threads about this, about Formation Designer or about the public Editor, all of which fall in to the same "Where is it?" or "When will it be fully updated?" categories. A bit disappointing really.

 

It looks like it. DTG's new business model involves false advertising and promises.

 

Suspended?

 

What's even worse is that some people defend DTG on this. Some people say, "Yeah, they have to look at it from a business standpoint, blah blah blah," but as a consumer, why should I worry about how a private company manages its money and business?

 

Perhaps DTG shouldn't advertise features that they can’t put into the game in a timely manner

 

There must be some developer with lots of tasks at DTG.

I assume he is still trying to finish and debug the Rush Hour passenger system which had been sold to us years ago and doesn't work fully or is integrated to all routes of the pack.

Same developer still seems to have the to work through the steam physic improvements which had been promised with the release of Spirit of Steam (I know, in the last stream it was told that they are no longer working on Steam improvements - so the they lied to us).

Same guy now has to fix and finish the Editor, build the Formation designer and integrate the new suspensio System. But why rush? We already paid...

Most underrated post of the day!

 

That perfectly captures DTG's business practices.

 

Its coming with the new Steam and US freight routes.

 

In one of the charity streams Matt did over the weekend he did say in hindsight they probably announced it too early.

 

Yeah, they announced it too early for Train Sim World 5, because the game won't come out until later this year.

 

Strange thread filled with strange posts.

In the DtD Stream, Matt said that they had found an issue in the Suspension System that, effectively, would ruin the game's experience.

I think it's very safe to say that nobody here wants the game to be made drastically worse.

There's no conspiracy - it just went wrong.
Also, at TSW4's launch it was made fairly clear that Formation Designer and new Suspensions weren't coming at launch. They haven't lied to you. There's no conspiracy. It's nothing more than something's gone wrong.

As always, it's Damned if they Do, Damned if they don't.

 

Oh, come on, i try to be fair to DTG, but this is nonsense.

Formation designer and the suspension system were absolutely supposed to be the stars of the TSW4 show, along with the PC editor, which also seems dead in the water lately.

It's 6 months after release, Formation designer barely works and is riddled with bugs and the new suspension is of course pushed back even further.

We all know TSW5 (or whatever it will be called this time) will be out by September and by then the new suspension will only be for new TSW5 content.

I'd love to be wrong...

 

The Pacer does have the new system. Suspension system was announced for autumn of last year, shortly after relase. 0 of the in TSW4 included trains do have the system now.

Possible they found problems, but it doesn't justify to announce something as a sales point back in August last year when it isn't in a state that you can at least be sure that it works the way it is intended. The Editor, the formation designer and the suspension system are not working (or being implemented) nearly 6 month after release. Also it is nice that Matt does tell this in a stream, but the obvious thing would be to speak to the community via roadmap update, forum topic, whatever to let people know whtat is going on. But it is always the same, something is coming, not working as intended / feature complete. Then we are told it is fixed down the road. Next step is it to disappear from the roadmap and no longer talk about it or react to it. Then after a year "well yeah blablablabla *insert reason why we didn't finish it* but maybe in the future.."

Me and other people are not the ones who make false promises and raise expectations of people.

 

When TSW5 inevitably gets announced this year, just base your purchase decision on the included routes and ignore everything else.

Put TSW4 down to a "learning experience".

 

Well it's certainly not "Damned if they do" is it?

This is what DTG wrote on 23rd August 2023 when they were hyping up their new product (TSW4).
Two additional features will be coming to Train Sim World 4 within the first few months after launch.

• Improved Suspension Physics - Vertical movement in the suspension is now simulated when the train passes over track joints. Watch as the suspension reacts to every undulation in the track and get a more dynamic feeling ride from the cab.
• Formation Designer – The formation designer will allow you to build your own consists for use in the Scenario Planner and Free Roam. Custom Formations will be shareable via Creators Club.

So all that really needs to be discussed is what does the phrase "Within the first few months after launch" actually mean?
TBH I think that 5 months, without either 'product' working in full, is pushing it a bit to say the least. (But others may differ).
After all we have all paid for these 'new' features, haven't we?

Of course there isn't a conspiracy. However there is also nothing wrong with holding companies to account when they fail to deliver on their promises. IMHO DTG should be doing much better in this regard.

 

once their in, tell me their coming, not done then not coming

 

I thought TSW2 was the learning experience

 

I thought founders was

 

Presumably most people on here have never had anything go wrong or not go to plan. They surely wouldn't on purpose ignore updates on the suspension situation by DTG staff and instead post on the forum how awful DTG have lied to them, it wouldn't be like these forums at all.

 

Why do people always assume there is only black or white? Yes I'm pissed off by these things. Do I still play the game? Yes I do. So I'm not happy about what is going on and other people as well. But why must we always be put in these corners like "people on here have never had anything go wrong or not go to plan". It is just that DTG promised again stuff and is not delivering. We had this multiple times in the past.

I would welcome to defend DTG here myself but these things did happen too often already.

 

Okay then, let's have them deliver the update now and see how that works.

I agree that DTG shouldn't have announced it before they were confident of it's launch, that's fine.

But there is zero point in anyone complaining about it. It's done and we'll just have to wait until it is ready.

 

Can you really blame people for being critical when the promised Steam fixes are still not here? How about the 313 fixes?

 

I mean it does let them note to tweak general release plans/policy for future stuff, if there was nothing but positivity or no feedback to issues for something like this then they wouldn’t see where the issue is, and chances of it repeating would go up.

 

It at least seems that we have to remind DTG on a regular base what they have promised or announced. Even with the roadmap streams there is a lack of communication with those things.

And of the Steam fixes we now know they will never come...Same thing as above. Said in a stream, but no official word in any roadmap update.

 

Strange comment. In my business, if I sold a product that didn't work as specified, I wouldn't have people grumbling on a forum, I'd have to refund the customer or get taken to court.

Things do go wrong, but expectation management and delivery of the full product are core business competencies for most companies outside of software development.

Customers have a right to complain and a right to be told what is happening.

 

It isn't ideal and I am looking forward to the suspension improvements when they are ready. Things go wrong in business, often intentions are good but they aren't always deliverable in the timescale intended. Maybe DTG were being a bit too ambitious.

They have told us what the current state of play is with the suspension improvements and no one has said people don't have a right to complain. However there seems little tolerance on here sometimes.

 

If this wouldn't be just another break in the community - dev relationship, sure not a problem as such.

But this is going on pretty much since Rush Hour. At least thats what i feel.

When im here reading all the comments, its really interesting. Because year in year out players complaining about the same things over and over. There was more than enough time for DTG to get things right. They have decided not to do so and thats why these threads even exist in the first place.

Since Hamburg Lübeck we are discussing problems with level crossings, and here we are in the new German Route years later and with the same problems.

Like mentioned before : Steam updates, promised fixes for routes like Linke Rheinstrecke, missing.

So im really curious to see when ppl start realising that DTG just won't change in that regard. They always promised big things just to not even tell us later that its not coming. Those Infos were squeezed out by the community. Its a bloody shame.

So yeah, TSW is not dead for me and thats because we've seen some fantastic 3rd Party stuff over the last year. But regarding DTG products they have simply lost all of my trust.

Thats of course my personal view on things.

 

I see what you’re saying on that, a lot of the bugs and stuff do stay for far too long, and a lot of the times response hasn’t been ideal at all. Other cases it’s been a lot better.

still pointing out those things years/months on etc is still a good thing, ensures they are not forgotten and still could be the next thing fixed however, it’s definitely not pointless to bring up continued issues.

edit: the game for me definitely isn’t gone, having a lot of difficulty currently with a known issue but I think apart from that my collection has a lot a lot of fun to it, and eager to have that fun fully when the issue be resolved (particularly the new stuff/upcoming/of course current collection and notably the DB 193)

 

Remember when preservation crew updates for TSW2 where ready to go they were just waiting for the right "release window".
Don't by anything from this company based on future promises purchase every thing as is. I will buy TSW4 when i can find it for less the 20 bucks from a steam key reseller

 

It will be coming in ‘the spring’




… I’ll get my coat

 

only in tsw5

 

It'll come when it comes. Whenever that date comes is anyone's guess.

If I were able to give a reliable estimate, I'd say the 12th of Never

 

Absolutely.

In the end we are here giving feedback (sometimes complaining) about all things TSW because we like it and want it to be better. Not resulting in yet again a frustrating experience. If DTG would done everything wrong, nobody would be here either. But thats should not be the aim, the aim should be to create reactions á la Niddertalbahn or BPO, because they were outstanding and i want more of that type of quality. A Quality that also reflects the asked price way better than any DTG Route.

But thats wishful thinking. They have to come up with some really good stuff to get me in the boat again.

Feedback therefore is superbly important and DTG should focus on such and finally trying to iron out all the really broken stuff before just creating new problems.

 

This company must not taken seriously on their promises, only further evidences and ready products should be considered. Period.

 

So, if I advertised something to you as a Business, got you to pay for said advertisement on agreement that you would receive what you have paid for, and then didn't deliver, you'd be ok with it?

Good one.

Sorry, not being argumentative but come on, this is the reason alot of us are getting bent out of shape. Not because this is a one off, but multiple times we as a customer base have paid and not received the promised fixes going back to TSW2.

And all we get is silence, or excuses that it's "not on the road map" like it's a universal get out of jail card. This will be another thread where there isn't a peep out of them

 

THIS! They also have told several times after route releases that they are working on certain thing or improvements, which later never came or they are "investigating" stuff blablabla...

This never leads to anything which only gives you the conclusion they must have internal builds with lots of fixes (unlilkely) or they are really lying to us in a sense of an appeasement strategy. I don't know, it just tells me that basic organisations structures are missing or not working. The roadmap for example is a thing you show to the community after these decision have been made internally. You are not placing random things on it without having a similar roadmap (more detailed) internally and have spoken to the teams or different developers.

So if we would miss one of three features and they had told us "OK this is leading to problems" OK! The Editor is still the best example for this, at the day of release it was clear that it can not cook content. It will be fixed soon, updates, tutorials, everything is coming (presented on the silver tablet) and what is happening? Nothing...

 

So you'd rather they gave you the broken suspension system to live up to their promise?

...

No, you wouldn't. It would break the game and then you'd be whining 10× more.

They promised it would come - it broke/something went wrong/took longer than expected - and it had to be delayed.

Fixes and a new feature are two completely seperate things.
Fixes are something worth shouting about.
A new feature (that would break the game) being held back isn't.

Based on their record with fixing things - surely a broken suspension system is the last thing anyone wants.

"It's not on the roadmap" means they aren't working on something. I don't know where you've found a get out of jail free card in there.

And there's a good reason they don't reply to threads and I absolutely done blame them:
People will spin what they say to become negative.

 

I don't post on here very often, and I hope that my feedback is taken in the way it's meant - there's little point "howling at the moon", but the above post by JD sums up (some of) what people feel vexed about.

The thread is full of users/customers complaining about vague updates on promised features and a lack of confidence that the supplier will ever achieve what they set out to. The summary above does nothing to build that confidence.

"..team are working on it...", "hopefully be able to show you", "Still a while away yet" etc etc.

I guess that JD is limited in what he can say, and I don't mean to be critical of individuals, but why couldn't we have an update that covered "why" it is more difficult that expected. Which bits are working, or what have you learnt through the processes that might change things in the future.

I don't expect that a company would air all it's dirty laundry in public, but more transparency would surely calm tempers. Or decide to say nothing and leave people speculating, but just saying "maybe later" doesn't really seem to help one way nor the other.

Just my two-penneth, and no slight on DTG JD

 

Lets be honest, even if the suspension feature would have been cutted out permanently before tsw4 release, no way the marketing team would break the hype in the middle of release & preview time.

I guess thats what happened to the manual firing. Probably the nice peak forest didnt get aborted due all its reasearch already finished after sos.

Just my own thoughts..., hyping a nonexistent feature on top of the hype is really cost saving....

Too many features have disappeared or turned out to be a one time thing, thats where my point of view is coming from.

 

One could say the same thing about “project steam engine”!

 

Typical DTG over promising to justify a whole new release (TSW 3 to TSW 4), then woefully under delivering.

Fortunately the BPO route from Just Trains benefitted from the new suspension system from Day 1 of release and it makes driving the Pacer an absolutely wonderful experience.

DTG are really quite useless at delivering things on time. Just Trains with their very first route pretty much blew all of DTG’s own routes out the water. I can’t wait to see what they can achieve with their next one - when they have even more experience with the tools.

 

We really need to be holding DTG to account more firmly (no need to be rude or personal), but it’s just not acceptable what they’re getting away with. As a community, we shouldn’t be making excuses for them or blindly buying into the hype. If we were more reluctant to buy stuff from them until they upped their game, they might decide to get their act together.

In the meantime, I’m glad to see Train Planet is looking like a potential strong competitor. Competition always drives improvements and innovation. It’s either that, or go out of business.

 

Sorry I purchased TSW4 SOLEY for the suspension. At first it didnt come at launch and was in the 0-3 month category of the winter core update. Then the winter core update was split into two parts with suspension and something else in part 2. Now they have gone silent.

Would you be happy if you purchased Goblin and then download it and find out the 710 isnt there because its not finished? No. So why should we be content that its just 'coming'?

Would you be happy if you purchased a new phone but theres no screen because Apple didnt make enough? No. Dont play around. You guys will defend DTG with your life as if they give a toss about you