Hello everyone, I wanted to pose a set of questions to those who have had the chance to get involved with the Formation Designer Beta on Steam and Epic Games, and been hands-on with the new feature Of course, we're still looking at the flagged issues, but I was hoping to focus this more as a reflection on the Formation Designer tool itself, and the aspect of us introducing it to you in a beta format. Questions: How have you found it? Is it what you expected? Did you like having access to the feature early as a beta release? What is your favourite part of Formation Designer? What elements do you struggle with most? If the answers to this are more bug-related, we can take that feedback on and add it to our trackers, but I'm more interested to hear about the design and the general use of the feature with this question. Any other mentions or screenshots you want to include? The plan would be to include a quick summary of these points for our upcoming March roadmap To set expectations, we've not yet got more information on a console release date, and we're still looking through the feedback that's been submitted - thank you to everyone who has shared their thoughts already!
It's the same problem Livey Designer and to some extend Scenario Planner already have: The Formation Designer sadly isn't optimized for mouse and keyboard at all. Everything feels pretty clunky and behaves like you try to emualte a controller with mouse and keyboard.
How have you found it? Is it what you expected? I am enjoying it, I think it is a great addition to the game, one of the standout features and main reasons to move from TSW3 to TSW4, the other two being the editor and free roam mode. Multiple unit trains being compatible with formation designer is a welcome surprise. Did you like having access to the feature early as a beta release? Yes, it is nice being able to access a feature early to see how it works, and to give feedback. I would enjoy more features having early beta releases. If early access to new locomotives/routes was considered that would be fun (perhaps as a perk of preordering) What is your favourite part of Formation Designer? Being able to create unique formations quickly, saves a lot of time compared to spawning things individually in free roam. Seeing what the formation looks like in real time. What elements do you struggle with most? Doesn't work well with mods. For example, if I try to use formation designer with a modded Class 66 that has coupler changed from Buckeye to Tightlock, the formation editor will either crash, or not understand it should be compatible with other things with Tightlock coupler (such as Class 465), even though they can couple fine in-game. Some things that have same coupler in real life aren't set to be compatible in-game, for example 314 and 323. Formations appear too dimly lit, exposure is too low. Restricted camera movement. For example I can't move camera from one end of a long formation to the other, without changing the selected vehicle in the formation list. Individual units of a multiple unit train not having unique names or icons. Lack of categories to filter list. For example, would be nice to have more countries than just UK, USA, Germany and Other, having separate categories for passenger coaches, freight wagons, etc. Formation name limited to 30 characters, would be nice if it was more. Overly restrictive restrictions on formation name. For example, I can't name a formation "Class 66" (presumably because it contains the letters ass). Ideas Add more backgrounds rather than just light/dark, such as train station, depot, etc. Add ability to change weather/lighting. Add ability to hide the menu so it could also be used as a photo mode to take screenshots of a created formation. Stats/details for each vehicle, for example whether it has vacuum/air/dual brakes, type of multiple unit working system, what cab cars it is compatible with (if applicable), gauge, etc.
Yes, I like that fact that this long-awaited feature came as beta. Still better than not having it at all. And I hope the bugs are tracked and an update will follow. That's the most important thing when it comes to beta: It says to the players 'give us feedback so we can implement it'. And now it's DTGs turn to do that. If the relationship between open-beta players and Studio stays like this (feedback-fixing-circle), I'd personally have no problems if future features are also tested in that way!
This is the most important part of the whole process. There are now over 50 threads in this 'section' and each one deserves some sort of reply. (Several have similar themes so that should make DTG's job a bit easier). However there are already far too many silences on topics within this forum that should be fairly easy to reply to. IMHO you need to show there is a will to deliver a fully working, bug free, feature within the next 4-6 weeks to regain your credibility as you have already taken far too long to get this up and running so far. DTG should fully engage with this forum, provide actual answers to people's questions, and not just say "Our developers are looking at it" and leave us in the lurch. Equally there should be some sort of proper timetable as to when certain things will be finished so that we are given more confidence that things are moving forward. Stop ducking the more difficult questions and grasp some nettles. Trust me it will pay dividends in the long run. Probably the two most basic, unanswered, questions early Beta questions at the moment are, 1) When will ALL players (purchasers if you like) have access to Formation Designer? 2) When will ALL models be available to use in Formation Designer? Obviously there are far more questions than this but, for starters, answering these two, with specifics rather than generalisations, will be very helpful and will drive the process forward. In summary, rather than adding details to about Formation Designer to the general roadmap you should be creating a separate FD Roadmap which says clearly what your aspirations are for this feature alone and to what timetable you are currently working. Then, having published this, you should be allowed to celebrate your successes so long as you also own up to your failings.
How have you found it? Is it what you expected? As a first Beta it is good fun and adds a completely new dimension to the game. I am familiar with Livery Designer so the menus were quite intuitive and I was more or less able to get it to work without reading any of the instructions. Yes it is exactly what I expected although, I suppose, I was also expecting that all vehicles would be selectable and that the naming conventions would have been established prior to release. Did you like having access to the feature early as a beta release? Yes. I think involving the community in a beta release is a good thing (for us). Less certain that it is a good thing (for you) as people will now attempt to whizz off in all directions which will make it harder for DTG to keep things in check. Perhaps the beta release should have been limited to rolling stock from 1 or 2 routes only to give a 'flavour' of what could be achieved rather than the current "We're not sure what works and what doesn't?" approach. As a creator I would always want access to a feature as early as possible as I would like to be involved in helping to improve it. However I wouldn't want the beta approach to be used if it was simply to mask how late something was in coming out. In this case there is a suspicion that DTG have taken the beta approach simply so it can be said, now, that the feature has been released. What is your favourite part of Formation Designer? Being able to create something new and, hopefully, original. To improve game-play for both myself and others. To use some of the liveries I have created in a more realistic fashion. To be able to see what you have created immediately (either in the designer itself or in free roam or in scenarios. What elements do you struggle with most? Poor naming conventions / Multiple instances of the same model having different names The profanity filter. (You really must get this sorted). Missing models (I am waiting for the 1938 stock and the Limestone hoppers at the moment for projects). Inability to export formations to Creators Club. Multiple units. Making different length units and then trying to apply liveries to them. (Might be a LD issue). Filtering models - although I have now worked out some of the new naming conventions (LPC / LMR etc). Some models appear to be in FD but if you select them you can't do anything with them. (PCA / PGA). Lack of info about the various models to help, in advance, tell us whether things are able to be coupled together. (Filter?). Other Is it time for DTG themselves to release some additional formations to cover selections that we can already predict nearly everyone is going to make? Do we really need 50 different versions of a CL31 with 4 BG Mk1s? and then 50 different versions of a CL31 with 5 BG Mk1s etc etc The game could quickly end up with 1000s of formations that are very similar and which could have been dealt with by DTG releasing additional 'core' formations in advance? Multiple units are also difficult to handle at the moment with formations and liveries due to the fact that Livery Manager is often linked to a full set rather than individual coaches. (ie BKL stock is set to 7 cars rather than the 3-car and 4-car units that actually make up a 7 car set). Are there plans to make individual coaches available for all multiple unit sets which can also be linked to Creative Centre liveries? Any plans to create a Formation File Manager (ditto Livery File Manager) as per Raging Lightning's mod? This is very useful re Back-ups and File Sharing.
How have you found it? Is it what you expected? found it as in liking or found it as in discovering? it is not exactly what I expected, but it comes close. Did you like having access to the feature early as a beta release? definetly. What is your favourite part of Formation Designer? creating custom formations, duh. and destroying the designer too. What elements do you struggle with most? the camera controls. why can't you make it middle mouse = orbit view control? or something similar to freecam to observe the whole formation at once. same applies to livery designer, as a matter of fact. Any other mentions or screenshots you want to include? I broke the thing. twice.
Honestly i don't enjoy it as much as i thought. Camera Movement is really awful and also, my main issue, different carriages must have different names. For example, i tried to build an ICE S from the ICE 1's carriages. But it was very difficult because every carriage was called DB ICE 1 (or DB BR 401, i dont recall), and so were the Powercars. The Carriages need to have either descriptive names, like ICE 1 Restaurant or ICE 1 First Class, or something like ICE Car 2 or 11. Or, even better, Carriages should be named using their UIC Code, so for example the IC Coaches would be called Avmmz and Bpmmz and a Dosto Carriage would be called DBpza or something similar depending on which Car it is. That would make the creation of trains much easier
ICE 1 middle cars actually have their own classes, such as the Bordrestaurant is class 804, so that would be really useful
I like it, and you have got a very good basis, it's just the odd little things for me, such as the multiple working cables on the class 20, 31 and 37 not connecting to the RHTT wagons, but I'm sure things like this will be ironed out in time. I'm not a content creator for TSW4, I'm just an end-user really, so if it's a Sim, then it should Sim. Overall, not had any major issues .
Two addition questions from me. What are the plans, if any, to integrate Formation Designer with the Official Public Editor? Yes I know you can create your own formations in the editor itself but, presumably, we would want to be able to access our own formations when 'building' Scenarios and Timetables in the official editor? (The same goes for Livery Editor too). Will you ensure that all future DLC releases (routes & standalone stock items) are automatically compatible with Formation Designer? That the new DLC is correctly named, that if it is a multiple unit individual coaches are easily identifiable and that it can couple to other stock items, already in FD, that it could do in real-life.
Too much clickery for a single train. If I wanna do a whole-unit container train I can't say place this wagon 30 Times. I have to individually place or copy a wagon to add it. I can't select the container which are to be loaded on a container Wagon. I'd like a whole train of Hamburg Süd. Impossible. You want a pink ONE train? No Chance.
found the formation designer fun, limitations making it not as creatively free as it could be but none the less its fun early access to features are quite fun, helps get beta testing widely open to help development very nicely my favourite part is allowing me to create my prefered setup of units the struggle for me is livery formation designing, i wish there was a way to use custom liveries with formation designer as then i would be complete with formation designer, would love to have a 5 car 387 in my companies livery
I'm sorry Alex but that was a very quick summary !!! I'm not sure that just saying "We assessing what we need to do to take FD from beta to full release" really cuts the mustard. You have quite a substantive FD forum here now (65 threads) yet there are very few replies or acknowledgements from DTG anywhere. In the roadmap you spent time answering several live questions that had already been answered earlier yet didn't reply to any of the pre-submitted (and pre-requested) questions here. So what was the point?
tried getting a similarly looking train working with Taurus (+dosto + 3 IC coaches + dosto control cab), but from the control cab end, you cannot get power :/
just downloaded the update for this on console x box series x , so far im having some fun with it even if there some thing that dont work just yet or need fixed etc.. I definitely would want to be able to use creators club liveries with freight and passenger cars in the future. At least creators club liveries for most of the locomotives are working for me..looking forward to making some wild formation s been seeing some interesting things on the forum s others have done.
There are issues (which is to be expected in a Beta), the 158 will glitch if I try to make a 3 coach set, the 170 and 158 won't be compatible despite coupling up with no issues on free roam. The HST becomes a dead weight if it's coupled up with a 47 and won't move, even with all brakes off. The 170 won't be compatible with any other rolling stock so you can only couple up with other 170s. Is there any way of removing the centre carriage of the 170 to make a two coach set? This is on PS5
I have a couple of issues with the Formation Designer - this is on Xbox Series S When I place down a BR Class 801/2, 395 or 375 I have no option to couple it up with anything else other than its own coaches. For example I place down an 801 coach with the cab and then when I go back to the menu I can only add 801 coaches nothing else. Surely the whole point is to be able to put it with what ever you want. This is exaclty the same for the 395 & 375. Also if I put down a BR Class 66 I can connect it to any of the trains in my collection except an 801/2, 395 or a 375. These trains don't show up on the list, even when I searched for them. When the BR Class 66 is connected to the East Midlands Trains HST (2+8 formation) I cannot drive the 66 at all. I release all the breaks, the engine is running but it won't move at all. This happens when I'm in Free Roam and I have spawned in the custom formation from the Sand Box options. I have a clear path ahead on the signals.
I don’t know how to use formation designer but I created one with the Class 387/2 and the 150/2 REG yesterday the 150/2 Mixed New TFW Red Arriva Revised and the Original Turquoise and cream arriva livery
i tried the formation creator itself today for first time, created a train formation. Let me even use my own liveries but after i saved it i could not use it anywhere even tried to look up the file name that didnt work either .. The only way i ve gotten formation s to work is spawn in free roam and place what cars i want there etc
I tried formation creator again yesterday figured out how to spawn multiples of same car ,you click the 2 squares on the far left , but i gave up since cant play the formation i created , pressed save etc but everytime i go into formation. Design. It says 0 created . So far the only fun ive had with formation creator is in free roam where i can spawn just the generic DTG liveries etc can only use creators club liveries on locomotives only ..this still needs a LOT OF WORK..
I’m on Xbox Series X & it works beautifully, no problems at all even with Livery Designer stuff, very easy to navigate, works fine every time. Many thanks to Devs. for your work.
The formation designer is a great addition to the game and I absolutely love it. Everything works fine, except for 2 things: 1. The new ÖBB Bmz coaches don't show up in the menu. 2. You can't unlock the doors of the DB IC Coaches on locos like the ÖBB 1116 or the BR 143 At least that's what I experienced on Xbox...
I have mostly enjoyed the formation designer update. You can make formations that are similar to ones you would see in real life which adds to the in game immersion. However, one problem I I have is that if you spawn a 801/2 with livery from Creators club, you can't take away two coaches (excluding the driving vehicles) and make it a 7 car or even adding 2 additional cars to make the train look like an 11 car one instead of the standard 9. Another thing is that with the MML HST, you can't take the power cars away and have just the MK4 coaches left so that you could add a class 66 for example to top and tail it.
its a bit of a mess. The electrostar have you try to form 3 cars. One of the gangways goes haywire. Not only that, the issues of the class 377 have the issue when you spawn it in as a custom formation, the rear gangway just has its doors locked open (i think its about time DTG fix this when this is happening both in the route itself and outside of it). A lot of the emu carriages doesn't have a listed carriage classification and it's very confusing of whenever I want to select them. Also frustrating is that some trains cant be used as separate carriages or loco yet some does. Whenever will the developers be able to let us use different rolling stock instead of forcing it using it in one consist when spawning it in. and the fact that the liveries we downloaded from creators club that were used as a consist isnt support as a separate carriage is also frustrating.
…that’s good mate me also, apologies for the late reply, been listening to ‘The Captain and Me’ all afto…denied access to the Xbox by the Mrs…have you managed to put a train together in Formation Designer yet ?!?
That's ok No. I tried once ending up with a 31 front melding with a wagon and gave up in frustration at lack of guidance.
…Ooph, I don’t have the 31 in my collection, reading other peoples posts, it seems to be a bit hit & miss as to which locos will perform in the BETA, just guessing but try coupling the 31 (or another loco) with era appropriate stock, I know the 31 was a stand alone DLC but I’ve defo seen it working with Mk1 coaches, always some good tutorials on You Tube, good luck !
…let us know how you get on mate… works really well on Xbox for sure, any questions don’t be afraid to ask, I’ve received loads of help from others on the forums to get me started !
I've made some formations using the Designer, and overall it's pretty good. I do have some issues I've come across, maybe due to my inexperience or due to limitations. For example, if I add a BR403 cab car and then a powered car, I can't add a cab car on the end to make a complete formation. Is this a limitation?
Why isn’t the holiday express route compatible with the formation designer if we can please can we add it apart from that so far it’s good (this is for ps4)
Is it possible to change the view so that you can change this to this? It's really annoying when you have to google the text to find out which wagon it is.
Took my first plunge the other evening, setting up a consist with the 218. tl:dr if already mentioned, but why can we not select multiples of the same vehicle at the same time? Click, click, click, rather than click, back to the menu, scroll through list, find vehicle, click then back again? There also seems to be a two step process to saving, thought I had saved a loco and 12 coach consist but when I went to place on a route, only load 3. And I found the consist 3D window zoom to not function. Those issues aside it is a nice tool, just needs a bit of polish on the interface.
I like the formation designer! I actually used it a few times and it seems to work great!!! Had to be careful with the number of rolling stock I use, else the train gets way too long in some situations.
While we can upload formations to creator's club now, there seems to be no way to actually use them at the moment Fixed now
Formation designer beta???, well I've heard of formation designer but not formation designer beta, looks like a upgraded version of formation designer.
