If the route is as bad as people say it is then the release should be put back until its up to standard
Going against the grain here by the sounds of it, but I actually thought the countryside scenery looked really good in a lot of places, a bit different (in a good way) to what we've seen recently. A bit more driving variety compared to Goblin, but more AI trains needed. Agreed that the ballast surrounds could be tweaked to other than dirt like textures. Also noticed that some of Skyhooks issues have crept in, that being some calling on lights incorrectly illuminated on signals or wrong types. Plus a permanent AWS magnet giving a ping instead of warning for a speed reduction. The 170 seems fun to drive. Will probably get this instead of Goblin.
I hear you. I’m not saying the scenery isn’t important. This is my favourite route and it’s been a dream of mines for it to come to TSW. I want it to be fixed too. The fact the announcements were missing in the stream makes me hope just a little bit that we were shown an early build by mistake. As others have said if that really is the case they would have to show it off again to us. Yes probably wishful thinking though.
Not everyone is saying it is that bad. There were quite a lot of complimentary comments on the stream. I don't think it was as awful as some are making out although there are some pretty horrific buildings at the lineside. For me it is the lacklustre timetable which will mostly hold me back. The class 170 is very well modelled and I thought sounded pretty decent.
Any ECS jasper? Nope. Any rail tours jasper? Nope. Any freight jasper? Nope. Any additional services at all jasper? Nope. Any 8 car services jasper? Nope. Any Aircraft at the airport jasper? Nope. Any ships on the Firth of Forth jasper? Nope. ANYBODY STILL THINKING THAT THIS STILL LOOKS A GOOD ROUTE JASPER? NOPE!!!
The most tragic thing, really, is that has been fairly solid so far, ECML is a good, personally boring, but good, route, AVL isn't one for me to judge, VOR is fun, not the best, Blackpool is among the best, if not the best, (RIVET's) Bernina Line is among the best, Salzburg, from what I've seen, looks quite good Goblin seems to be among the best from DTG to date... And then, Fife.
What's wrong with his videos? His reviews are honest and I find them better than some of the DTG ambassadors who don't offer balanced reviews. By the way, he does recommend routes as well such as Midland Mainline, The Caltrain route, Riesa-Dresden, SEHS, London Commuter, Island Line 2022 amongst other routes so it's not like he criticizes DTG for the sake of doing so
The route looks absolutely atrocious looks something from Minecraft barely any services and for jasper to say its real life timetable is a joke. This needs to be delayed and sorted out properly rivet clearly only give a damn about taking people's hard earned money and releasing shabby DLCS
Right, so where do I start? I say at the beginning. The scenery in and around Edinburgh looked very nicely done and well modelled and this continued all the way around, rather consistently to the Fourth bridge, which itself is absolutely gorgeous and is something that Rivet can be genuinely proud of as it does look truly stunning. After the bridge the scenery for the most part still looked good, but I did notice a couple of things that caught my eye as off, including a passenger walking through a fence at one point and then of course the house and factory (which looked like they came straight off a Hornby Dublo layout!) along with the water in the far distance not looking right and the strange rock sided cuttings. However it must be said the majority of the route did look a decent standard with the water looking lovely up close and other areas of housing looking much, much better. The 170, as predicted looked stunning with very little if anything able to be faulted with its looks, unless you count the exhaust smoke as part of the looks which seemed to be non existent. The cab did look very nice without fault, though from the quick breeze we had over it the GSM-R didn't seem to be fully functioning, but just at the normal TSW 'working' level. The unit certainly looks the part! The sounds of the 170 are better than I feared they would be and do have a drop of 170 essence to them, but it is missing something from the sounds to really make them stand out. Nowhere near as abysmal as Rivet's previous attempts at sound, though they really would have to be shocking to be at that level. The cab is quiet, though I do believe that this time that is a genuine reason and of course there is the window which I will be opening! Next on my list is the timetable, which, quite frankly, is unacceptable. I think, if memory serves me well, Jamie said that on a usual day around 200 trains cross the bridge, but there are only just under 100 services for the 170 which is about half of that figure and seems to be quite a large gap and does bring concerns. Every time it got mentioned it were like Jasper had a VAR screen in front of him and we are still waiting for the decision: knowing my luck when things go to one of these it won't be a good result so am not getting my hopes up for these supposed added services. I don't understand why they wouldn't have added them for release rather than adding them after as he didn't seem to mention any barriers or reasons as to why they were were not added because having so many services missing is not a good thing for the route at all. Another missed opportunity is rail tours which really would be nice to have on this route (even though Scotsman is fudged) along with RHTT and Engineering services just to add a bit more depth. On 'regular' freight services I don't believe there are any regular freight services on the route from my understanding, though I am not 100% sure and more than happy to be corrected on that one. Lastly there were some other things I jotted down and so will just mention. The first of these is free roam! This just seems to be the chuck-away thing to say anything that they haven't included, such as the 170 on EDN and more than a couple of other times throughout the stream. I don't know if it's a blessing or a curse! Another thing I noticed in this route (and on some other routes in fairness) is that some cars seem to go stupidly slow to the point where I felt I need to jot it down. I know this is a small thing but cars crawling along an open road can just ruin the immersion for me personally. And lastly Haymarket depot. Need I say more! Not a single train in sight there, but don't fear the sodding tram depot has static traffic in it! Speaking of trams though it is good they have been included as AI on that section, though a shame about the planes and (less so) the ships. Right I think that is it and I do apologise for this rather long post. On the whole though it still seems to take my fancy more than GOBLIN did/does even with its faults. It also helps I have a £5 voucher from the Xbox rewards thing to claim, so I'll wait for the GP 10% off then use the voucher as well, hopefully bringing it down to closer to £20 which I can't complain about. Steam can wait even with the preorder! I will just sum the route up with 3 screenshots: The Good: The Bad: And the Ugly:
Tauranga goes on random rants about unrelated topics, spends half of his time getting mad at his own imagination and taking about things that haven't happened - rather than reviewing what's in front of him. Also he's got one hell of a perpetually negative outlook on life and quite quick to anger in his videos. His London Commuter one was okay because he (mostly) reviewed what was in front of him. Usually he struggles.
Last week i thought to myself i wouldn't purchase Goblin line as it isn't my kind of route, but seeing the preview stream and the fact it has so much ai traffic made me give it a go, and it's actually a very decent route and i enjoy it a lot more than i expected. Fife Circle however was going to be a 100% day one purchase for me, i love the route in real life and i love that there are so many services and a variety of AI and calling patterns to explore.. this stream has shown that hasn't been brought to life in this route, and that is an incredible shame. i wanted this route in game so much, but the timetable alone is a disgrace, and having known what rivet did for a timetable in WCL and E-G maybe i should haven't got my hopes up, but this is honestly so below par it's unreal, and after such a polished and complete route release in Goblin, this is just sad. all that's needed is a timetable that actually resembles real life and not a bare minimum, not even a sunday service, with AI traffic populating the route.. but instead we have working escalators and a bin collecting scenario, i'm actually astounded this is how Fife Circle has turned out, for such an incredible real world route this is beyond disapointing for me
We must not be watching the same person than because I don't see him getting mad at his own imagination and he does review what is in front of him. He does recommend routes as well. He does like TSW but doesn't like the business practices of DTG and wants the game to be better like all of us. I don't see an issue with his content to be honest but we can agree to disagree
This is a real shame im usually one of the negative ones on this forum and I was quite looking forward to practically being inlove with Fife Circle and was well prepared for the 170 to sound horrific. But seeing this reaction from the community members has made me loose hope.
I assure you that if I complained (I almost never do), it means that there're problems. Nothing can't be solved, I agree with those who see the glass half full on this. The route experiences the following problems: - lack of effort in modeling some areas (some parts of the terrain were empty, not even grass) - Horrible buildings and low resolution textures in the circle itself, after the Forth Bridge. - Lack of freight services (My God, in 2024!) - Lack of access to depot. - Ridiculous Timetable. That said, I think everything is solvable. It's all about Rivet! Which I find very difficult to achieve...
In the London Commuter video he is talking about the Tonbridge (I think) line saying he'd rather it was included, then went into "I wouldn't be surprised if Dovetail released it as a seperate route." With a fairly 'I don't like this' tone. Aka: mad at his own imagination. Insufferable at worst, bearable at best.
I am not sure which version looks more ugly to be honest! Though I don't even think that Paul Tierney would struggle to make the right decision (Rivet's!)!
Watched the rest of the stream, mainly to see the night lighting. Just dreadful as with most recent routes. I realize that much of the route is in open country, but you have to create some ambient light, including moonlight, otherwise driving is disoriented and worthless, you don't have any sense of space and time. It was done fairly effectively on ECML, which is also mostly in open country. Added to all the other problems mentioned already..... Hard Pass. As said above, not ready for prime time. Needs to be held back and polished up. Disappointing because I passed on Goblin thinking a longer, diesel route would be better. Oh Well. What's next? I really hope it's LIRR.2. Got to get something new this year.
Remember the 170 sounds came from DTG not Rivet. And there the only good thing in the stream. Says it all ...
I agree, I was pleasantly surprised with the sounds on the 170, but I honestly thought the route itself would have been done better, hopefully the bad stuff is fixed at some point and not just ignored
I mean it really wouldn't be surprising if DTG were to make the tombrige line as a separate route though. Just look at BML and ECW. Or the San Bernardino Line and the Antelope Valley Line. They are separate lines despite running to the same terminal station although it is understandable as to why that is the case Anyway this is really getting way off topic. Let's just agree to disagree
I haven’t seen anyone comment of the physics of the 170, does its behaviour look realistic? Better than their 150?
Matt should have been honest and said halfway through "this is garbage lads, you really mustn't release it in this state" and closed down the stream. DTG are losing customers by allowing this sort of refuse to be sold for their game. Look at the Goblin line and Niddertalbahn. Why can't that be the minimum standard for TSW4?
I really hope Matt , JD or Alex give us an honest explanation as to why they thought this route was in a fit state to even show off.....when you compare this to Blackpool, Goblin or even something as old as East Coastway it's clearly miles behind in quality, as for Rivet they shouldn't be let near a route again in the future, I can't believe DTG dropped this route at Rivets request....they should have known by now that their routes are notoriously poor compared to other DTG and third party routes.
Perhaps whilst doing the rubbish scenario where you had to collect and tie up sodding bin bags at every stop!
Yes I can hardly imagine the scenes if we were asked to do this in real life, especially in the snow!
If we dont purchase this Rivet will be forced to fix the issues with the route. I hope Skyhooks 158 will help with the timetable. I read on a thread somewhere that apparently the 158 cant sub for 170 services as 1 is 2 coaches and one is 3. Does this mean the 158 will add services? Also whys there no 6 coach services?
This route though is a mess. An unrealistic timetable and poor scenery. The criticisms Rivet get aren't unjustified given their past. That comment is hardly unjustified. Harsh? Perhaps. But not unfair
They said something about doing it in free roam but there aren't any services in timetable doubled up.
I'm just going to say this: As soon as it was announced Rivet were doing Fife Circle, everyone started talking about how much of a mess it'll be for a release. I wonder if those people were able to accurately predict the future?
It's a shame just trains didn't do this route it would look brilliant just like there Blackpool route
No, I think they just have the ability to state the bleedin' obvious! It is a real shame that Rivet couldn't have added more polish to this route as if they got this top notch right they would be on a very good path and position with the community.
DTG would've also done a better job in my view if they made this route. I have this route in TSC and it is amazing.
From reading his comment he hasn't watched the stream as he avoids DTG streams like the plague so he is only going on what someone else has said but yet he still seems primed! The route isn't a mess, it has some bad scenic assets and yes the timetable is poor. I thought I would be purchasing two add-ons this weekend it may only be one, but I don't think it is a mess as it had a lot of good points. Some have the good grace to point those out some seem to be ignoring them. There is a very balanced review of the stream a few posts up the thread amongst the "route is horrific" posts.
Yeah I was in at that point. Irl there are 6 and 5 coach services obviously we cant do 5 at the moment. The issues are just stacking up at this point. [EDIT - Jan - Inappropriate]
We will just have to agree to disagree then because I don’t agree that the route isn't a mess. I watched the stream and I think calling the route a mess is quite appropriate. As for avoiding DTG streams, I can't blame him. The roadmap streams whilst nice do feel like nothing more than PR stunts lately and even the Suffragette Line stream felt odd because they were focusing way too much on other things to compensate for the fact that there isn't much to do on that line even though it is a nice route. Talking about having something like 1,000 AI services that you wouldn't mostly see anyways to act like the main line itself is more busy than it really is. I think the modeling of the Forth Bridge and 170 are great. The sounds are improved as well, but the route as a whole is a mess in my view
There are certainly things that need to be sorted but that is a bit far. I mean in fairness the majority of the route looks fairly decent and whoever did the big bridge deserves a pat on the back and a bonus!
This route seems to have the same scenery issues as West Cornwall, irregular field patterns, lollipop trees, it seems that Rivet games just don't understand the British landscape and the way it is layered.
Omg you did a big red bridge correctly clap for yourself. The [EDIT - Jan - Language] timetable, scenery in certain places. And its not like the [EDIT - Jan - Language] scenery is on the horizon, some of it is right next to the track.
I do like looking through the post review forum and seeing all these new/ unfamiliar accounts posting such nonsense. I didn't watch much of the preview mainly because it was too poorly hosted from my opinion, but from what I saw, I enjoyed it. I do believe it is the wrong build as the "leaked" page from a few days ago gave a higher service count. Still keeping my preorder, but would like to see where it goes
