So we got another update for Train Sim World 3 today. Please forgive me if I am just really stupid, but can somebody explain to me why Train Sim World is so fragmented, because I really don't understand the logic. Train Simulator Classic has been around for over 10 years and it gets a new release every 12 months. It is treated as one game, and you don't see DTG releasing updates for 2018, or 2019, or 2021 this year. Train Sim World also gets a new release every 12 months in the same way as TSC, but instead of treating the whole thing as one unified package, DTG keep it as four separate games. Wouldn't it be simpler, and far less work to unify TSW as one game, in the same way as TSC, instead of writing-off some parts of it (TSW2020 & TSW2) and trying to patch other bits (TSW3 & TSW4) to try and stop them from falling apart? Even if TSW2020, TSW2 and TSW3 run on different versions of Unreal Engine 4, surely it would be easier to update the older routes and DLC to the latest build, instead of just keeping them on life support with quick fix patches? Again, I apologise if I am being a bit thick here. Just really don't understand DTG's thought process.
Oh it's one of those threads. Well sadly patching old game that doesn't sell anymore is not money-friendly for DTG. And you can sell a "new" game every year also instead of free updates. If you want to learn more go to the enough is enough thread but please don't start another war.
TSW is harder to develop DLC for. TSW DLC takes longer, so I presume a yearly game release is to ensure profitability. That's my take on it, could be wrong though.
They had some bizarre ways of releasing content, to be honest. Especially the way the older TSW routes and locos worked. Where to get a loco DLC to work you had to have a specific route that it was designed for, so say you buy the BR101 from the TSW2 era because you want to use it on Dresden Reisa, it won't work unless you also own and install the Rhein Ruhr route. They fixed that with TSW3+ where at least now the locos are tied to the training centre so you can always at least install them regardless of what other routes you have... but the TSW2 system lives on in legacy content which must be confusing as hell for new players. I am glad it does because I want to be able to use my older TSW1-2-3 stuff on TSW4 of course but I can see how this is super odd and unclear to someone who hasn't been following the game for a while. Then this annual release thing has further complicated things. Honestly they should just have one core TSW game that stays the same forever with ongoing updates and if they want an annual revenue boost just release a big DLC pack annually that most players would want.
It’s TBA on whether a bundle comes this year or if it’s straight into TSW5 (or Episode V - The Engineer Strikes Back) As for the exact reasons why TSW is like it is or how it is going to progress are probably only known to DTG’s bosses.
Possibly because Sony and Xbox/MS would rather see a new title than just update an existing one, even though they would still be getting money from the route DLC.
Flight sim is very similar, older stuff sometimes works on the new sim but you can't back track like using the new on the old. Also as they progress you sometimes need to upgrade your PC to be able to run the new version thus costing you more money. I saw one post from a guy bosting he got the new flight sim at a bargain price but he also said he bought a new PC to run it lol. Col.
I think the OP is not starting another "war" but asking a perfectly reasonable question. I see trouble ahead for DTG if they continue to exclude anyone buying new DLC if they don't own the latest version of TSW. It doesn't promote the same level of brand loyalty as, for example, TSC where you can be running TS2017 but still be able to buy new releases. I was better off when TSW4 came out but with me looking to quit my rather stressful job and take something less lucrative I will only be buying UK DLC and only getting routes/traction that I'm definitely going to play. So TSW5 won't be going into my Steam "Cart" until there's something in it that I really want in my collection.
It brings more profit to sell one each year or close to each year, than it does to keep alive what would be an old game, it guarantees sales of at least the price of 1 route (up to the usual 3) to all that don’t leave the franchise. not ideal for the customer but ideal and profit when it comes to companies, ideal don’t stand much chance
Probably tech in each release and the fact of the dlc list in relation to having a maximum amount of achievements/trophies
I'm surprised these older routes and engines still work in the latest version unles they have been upgraded somehow.. Col.
It has nothing to do with profits or making money. DTG, is not some mega rich company doing the bare minimum they can get away with, as much as the gaming community love to spout that narrative. The truth is DTG is barely keeping its head above water, hence the reason it needed to sell itself to Focus Entertainment. The facts are, the annual release is all about “market presence”. The vast amount of typical gamers do NOT buy DLC. They do not follow game socials. They do not watch YouTube videos. They don’t bother with forums. And they absolutely NEVER look at the DLC/Add-ons section of the various console/PC market places. Therefore… the ONLY way for DTG to get a market place presence is to release a whole annual “NEW” game. This ensures that they get at least a month of promotion in the “coming soon” section as well as being able to get trailers highlighted by Sony & Microsoft as well as focusing on their biggest marketing campaign of each year, adverts on Facebook, features on gaming websites etc. Then on top of this, once the game releases it will hang around in the “new releases” section for a month or two…. Then further to that, the game will go into some sort of Sale, and will get highlighted in the Sale by Sony/Microsoft (something that doesn’t happen for old games which just get listed in the A-Z section of the sale). NONE of any of that will happen with a free core game plus DLC model…. Even if they did a big annual DLC collection package each year. This is the same reason why FIFA doesn’t just get a patch every year, or why Destiny doesn’t just run a subscription model, and why AAA games such as Assassins Creed get a “Game of the Year” rerelease where it gets re-marketed and listed as a “new” game. What a lot of people on this forum are seemingly missing, is the fact that DTG are bending over backwards to offer the annual update at an exceptional value. With 3 routes minimum and normally some extras plus the core update, they would be well within reason to charge £90… but they normally charge little more than the price of 1 route, and a couple of months later put it in a sale for less than the price of a single route. People need the accept this model is probably here to stay, and that DTG are doing everything they can to make it affordable for everyone.
Theres a vocal group of people who get very angry about the annual releases lately. I understand the angle but in the specific TSW case I hold my criticism because when you do the math for anyone who wants any of the new routes, the game is "free" anyway. Just compare the price of a standalone TSW DLC route at full price with the "new" game (which includes at least one DLC per package) and you can think of the game itself being like a thrown in bonus that happens to accept all your old routes too. Now, if I was interested in 0 of the new routes and adamant I didn't want them, its not lucrative since it means to get the game I'd need to pay up for something I don't want. But so far, with TSW3 and 4, I've wanted at least one of the new routes that came with it (actually all 3 in both cases) so in my mind its like a route bundle that is cheaper than if they each came out as independent DLC. DTG has to do that though because if the "new" game isn't lucrative then many people stay on the older version and expect support for it. Lately with the bundles they release on the new game it seems to at least entice the most hardcore users to buy the new game. I'd be curious to know the playercounts for TSW1-3 these days but I think TSW4 quickly usurped 3.
Barley surviving. Haha. Making millions of dollars every year is barley surviving? I'm sorry but that sounds like complete nonsense. DTG are fine financially even before tsw4 came out.
Worth pointing out yet again that there has been exactly one paid annual release--TSW4. Given the time it's taken for DTG to catch up on some promised features, hopefully this will also be the last one.
I completely get why DTG reinvent TSW every so often. It's their choice and growth of brand awareness, leading to growth in sales is a good thing for a niche market. More sales will lead to more releases. Which is also a good thing for us train sim fans. And we are just consumers, we can vote with our wallets, opt in or out as we choose. I just hope that those who can't afford to buy every release aren't left too far behind. And fair play, DTG do sell starter bundles that come up in sales. But I also understand the collective groan when TSW gets a rebrand and people are still waiting for game-breaking fixes to the DLC they already have.
I agree. That was my original point. Someone running TSC2017 can buy the most recent release, the Berlin Ringbahn and run it without issues. Someone with TSW2 has a collection that's stuck in TSW2-era releases. I get the point that other games re-release every year but, taking my favourite Football Manager as an example. Once you've got that year's version of the game there's only one additional DLC to buy, the in-game editor for £7.99. When TSW 2025* comes out, it's only the start of the DLC releases. And yes, it's difficult to conflate a football sim with a railway sim but when you're on a tight budget, which game are you going to buy? I think it's a bad business decision personally, time will tell. *Guesswork I know but I think the nebulous numbering system will be replaced by annual versions.
completly wrong, but carrying on Ok this has gone crazy, are you saying they need to make profit and not doing that literally selling things to people as a business what makes profit (crazy I know but it’s what you say) or not ? so it’s nothing related to money but it’s all about money…
At the end of the day, same as last year if it is TSW5 we will moan and grizzle but probably end up buying it anyway. Particularly if the route package is interesting, though ironically despite my enthusiasm at the time the three TSW4 routes are now dropping down towards the hardly played part of my list.
they must be making somewhere around a million at the least to survive, for every full time employee they must pay around at least around £25,000 per year that’s 4 for £100000 and 40 for £1M, all before profit working outs and expense on production non staff related. edit: I do forget with living ii the north the £25,000 is likely to already be higher if it wasn’t already due to wage differences required for the differences in cost of living in the South.
Presumably not all “employees” are full time salaried with a pension scheme. Would like to bet a fair bit of the creative side is outsourced, either to companies in Eastern Europe or Asia or individuals working on a commission/ royalty basis quite possibly in addition to an unconnected full time job.
most likely not all full time employed, though as above states 181, I’m willing to bet at least 40 to cost at least/over a million is most definitely fully employed, do remember it’s senior staff on that number to, they ain’t outsourced or be on £25,000 and only come in on Wednesday for £10.90 an hour. And that’s just talk on employee salaries nothing more.
