I am so sorry to have to post this but ever since the West Cornwall St. lves branchline was produced in 2021, l have been extremely disappointed at the whole route especially with Rivet’s disgraceful attempt at portraying the beautiful resort of my beloved St. Ives which l have known since 1954. Before the release back in 2021, l contacted Rivet to respectfully ask them to portray the beautiful St. Ives realistically and offered help and photographs. My communication was ignored as it was again after release when l was truly disgusted with their results and a lot of the scenery along the route is so shabby and unrealistic. Everytime I have contacted Rivet they have never replied. Last week on their website forum l showed a few images, this time Jasper responded to inform me l am now banned from posting on their forums for the next six months. That is so childish, they should be listening and working to please their customers, but quite frankly l feel that they are not bothered and if they don’t produce better content they will soon lose more customers than they gain in the future. The whole WCL route is way out from the real world, but here I show how they spoilt for me, the look of St. Ives. Rivet have made it look how it possibly could have looked in the Middle Ages!!! There is a video on You Tube which advertises the real route as the nicest in the UK, and arguably it is! I can only show a few images in this post as DTG limit the amount! Rivets version below The Harbour Wall and lighthouse Rivets effort below is childish I may be out of order here, as l have no idea how easy or difficult it is to portray scenery accurately. I do know however, how Tom Harrison from Just Trains works, following his videos and the excellent and exceptional scenery he produces for Just Trains and in particular their outstanding TSW Blackpool Branches, which has been lovingly and passionately recreated with superb attention to detail. If Just Trains can do a superb rendition, why is it that Rivet can’t improve both this route and all the others since Arosalinie. Rivet have shown they can replicate the Forth Bridge so beautifully, so hopefully they will improve some of their past releases and bring them up to a better standard. There are plenty of other flaws along the whole WCL route including inaccuracies at Penzance and Carbis Bay, but Rivet needs to concentrate on improving the beautiful St. Ives first. With another Just Trains route coming soon, which undoubtedly will again make Rivets offerings look even worse in comparison, so in my opinion Rivet need to, step their standard, look at the Just Trains achievement and either match that or if they can’t, they must stick at just working on locomotive releases which they are relatively good at. They will make more money in the long run and displease less customers, but their route designing skills are extremely poor. It’s about time that Rivet produced a route full of quality and worth the money we pay. If they do that, then there is no excuse that they cannot upgrade their whole catalogue, if they can’t, then please Rivet give up route designing we no longer want your rubbish!!
The first thing I would start to critisize is the color of the roofs, which are in that brickred orange tone and pretty remarkable. I don't think it should have been to hard to make a texture for the houses with a roof in this color. Also there seems to be less houses than in reality and therefore tress (more to that in a second). The second thing I can see is the harbour wall, which if I see correctly, is only a (floating?) road landscape spline running into the ocean, not to even mention the missing lighthouse at the right side of the end of it. Yeah, definitely a shame one that. Third thing, in Rivet's version are way more trees there than in real life. Why? Fourth thing. The building in front of the perspective, left bottom in the first image, is obviously not even of wrong color, but completely different shape and size. It seems also to be a lot of grassland here, where in reality probably are way more houses instead. Fifth thing, the wood fence on the platform should be a steel palisade fence instead. Definitely not a fine to replicate an authentic scenery.
Here are some bridges they got wrong too. The penultimate bridge on the approach to St.lves station. You will notice the sloping angle of the bridge and Rivets version. looking at the sloping bridge going out of St. lves where you can see it properly. The final bridge on the approach to the station. Rivet’s is completely wrong. Rivets replication is extremely poor and incorrect. This type of work is replicated throughout the route and is similar to their other routes too. It simply isn’t good enough.
I don't know where this thread is supposed to go?! I think you know perfectly well that your opening question is a rhetorical one with a very obvious answer: Never! They fixed that atrocity of a Truro Cathedral and a few other things here and there. But that was it. I'm by no means a suspect for being a Rivet fanboy, but hey: Is it fair to use the lowest possible resolution screenshots with the sparsest asset distribution from TSW2 for comparison? I think not. Far from perfect, but the 4k images from PS5 look much better.
It indeed looks much better, especially the beach in front, but premise you don't compare it to the real life counterpart again. If you do so, some aspects still do completely mismatch. I see in your pictures that they even got rid of the harbour wall completely. Just like they did with the house north of Kinghorn station in Fife Circle. Interesting. They seem to be notorious landmark killers, once they can't find a way to modell them correctly.
l agree, they can’t be bothered. But this is a statement of their work, which is shameful and not needed in this wonderful game, as it down values it!!! DTG shouldn’t have allowed it to appear and in this state it should be withdrawn from sale for the future and until it’s put right.
With all due respect, it seems you're a bit manic about this route. It's a TSW2 route, software is sold as-is, and it's not that bad. If you think a train simulator route should depict everything 1:1, modelling all 30,000 houses along the way correctly then of course you'll always be disappointed. I do like the WCL. But, the TSC JustTrains version from Penzance to Plymouth is far superior. You can choose.
That same bridge appears about 50 times on the route. Very lazy development reusing the same asset over and over again.
For one of the most scenic areas I must say the way they try to "immerse" you into the game is appalling. I somewhat understand why they might not accept the references but it is still unacceptable that they don't take advice from the community. I see your attempt to make the route better but unfortunately I don't think there's much we can do.
This is by far Rivets worst route for sure. The side by side images are shocking to say the least. What were they thinking releasing this route in this state The only way this route will ever get to the standards we all desire is if someone starts a passion project, similar to WSR.
WCL certainly didn’t represent any Cornwall that I know, way too many trees and a lack of chimneys from the old tin mines. I think Rivet just produce generic UK scenery that could be almost anywhere, as well as airports without aircraft. The fact that they are so defensive and ban people for pointing out the truth on their forums sounds like a guilty conscience to me. In the interests of balance I thought their Bernini line was good though, so they can do it if they apply themselves.
All fair points, but it's your decision to buy something or not. If you don't like it, why bother? And for buying on the premise that the product might improve later on, you can only make yourself responsible. I've bought it in some bundle ages ago, cost me 2 or 3 €. Else I wouldn't have made the purchase, so it's ok for me.
Speaking about the bridges, I can assure that it's not so easy to replicate each and every bridge exactly. However, these bridges do look completely different (It's not just a wrong texture or something like that) and as a professional and aged third party developer, I would expect that they can show way better.
Spikee, this is my local route, l know it well and it’s both frustrating and disappointing to see a beautiful landscape portrayed in this way in TSW2 and beyond. Just Trains Cornish route in TSC is brilliant just like all their other routes, so much attention to detail, which we don’t get in Rivet routes. Rivets Berninalinie was slightly better but again their replication of the buildings etc was still poor in the route. With a little more care they could have got the Tirano Basilica spot on. It was a decent effort but still not quite right. Nearly perfect If Rivet can make a reasonable job of portraying the Tirano Basilica in Berninalinie, then why cannot they replicate the rest of the scenery accurately in all their routes. Do they pay for an expert to replicate something important and throw the rest to children to produce, as some of the buildings, certainly look like they do on a school classroom wall!!
If they haven't decided to improve the route after all this time, then I highly doubt they will do so given their track record. Honestly I wouldn't mind if Rivet no longer made any DLC and just remained as a second party to help DTG with modeling. They may know how to model trains, but their routes have mostly been a letdown with terrible scenery, sounds and physics. TSW would do just fine without Rivet Games releasing DLC
I understand you as a local (I'm glad my home route Karlsruhe-Strasbourg is well represented in TSC). But it is what it is, the development has become more costly in TSW. You cannot model all structures in a route, and the longer the route, the less objects you can develop for it as each model takes development time which is reflected in the price to be sold. Just Trains and DTG have a huge library of assets they can make use of - as the TSC meshes can be converted. But in general, if you demand a fixed price for a route, the manhours of development must be the same - which means short routes can be more detailed than longer routes (else you would need to demand a price per mile or so). Even Maik Goltz once said a TSC route like Konstanz-Villingen (considered to be one of the best) makes no economical sense as the customers are not willing to pay the real price that's needed for the work that got into it. Just enjoy the TSC version
It’s never going to be improved. They would have done it by now. Typical Rivet product where it gets a few fixes and that’s it. This is fine when they get it mostly right, like Island Line 2022 and Bernina. Not so good when it’s WCL or Fife Circle which are both lacking. I actually don’t mind the route, but where the Goblin Line is totally recognisable throughout, Cornwall is a very vague resemblance and in places totally fictional (just covered in trees). The sad thing is that one a route is done, nobody else is going to do it again. So I fear that for Cornwall that’s all we’re going get.
I agree, for a game it’s a pretty good representation. I go on that line 2 - 3 times a year and can place most of the landmarks that I remember in the game. I don’t expect it to be photo realistic but it’s easily recognisable. My only complaint with Bernina is where it ends.
That's true, but they delivered what they promised. It's a commercial business, and whilst track has been laid up to St. Moritz, placing the scenery would've made the route exceed the target selling price. The TSC version also came in two parts. Train Simulation is a niche market. SimRail can have long and highly detailed stuff because their devs are not depending on it financially.
I'm not disputing the landmark fidelity. I wouldn't dare since I don't know the area. But using blurry low res pictures for comparison to make your point seems to me a bit too much of a stretch. That's all.
It’s pretty good and shows if Rivet did it themselves, they can do it. It’s some of other buildings in Berninalinie that aren’t given the same attention.
Spikee, Just Trains TSC look of Penzance and the rest of Cornwall captures the beauty and charm of the lovely County.
I would say highly unlikely. So far as Rivet are concerned they probably regard it as a former product. They couldn’t even be bothered to go in and fix that erroneous 20 MPH on the Up virtually all the way from St Ives to St Erth, as they forgot to put a resumption of the normal 30 MPH line speed after the restriction which was just for a foot crossing.
People have been asking like myself if WCL can be updated for the last year but nothing has happened so I wouldn't hold your breath about a future update coming
The speed restriction issue annoys me more than the scenery. I see it as the difference between an ‘upgrade’ and a ‘fix’. To improve the scenery across the whole route would, in my view, be an upgrade - and I think it’s up to developers whether they upgrade their routes, which is a decision they’ll take based on whether the extra sales they’ll get justify the extra work. I’d like to see it upgraded, but I can see why they don’t - ultimately, they’re unlikely to get a big sales boost at this stage for all their extra work. The speed restriction issue is an error/bug, requiring a fix. It’s not subjective - it’s simply wrong, and they’ve acknowledged the error, and then said they have no plans to fix it (even though it would be very easy to do, and the current situation means you can’t really drive the St Ives branch in any sort of realistic way). In my view simply refusing to fix a known error/bug is unacceptable. I see fixing bugs and errors of this kind as a moral obligation once you’ve taken players’ money, rather than a commercial decision. River’s failure to do so has caused me not to buy Rivet routes ever since - partly so as not to reward their business practices, but mainly because I know that if there are errors/bugs in those routes, they won’t fix them either.
WCL is definitely the route with the identity crisis. It's clear that it was likely a modern route hastily editied because if licencing. I do wonder if that a substantial loss of motivation and effort to get it right.
If Rivet copy what DTG are doing with LIRR 2.0, they might make route updates when they get extensions. Basically, if Rivet can't make money by extending or updating routes, they won't ever bother to fix them.
There's three DLC affected by today's Spring Core update of which there is no mention in the Announcements. One of them is WCL.
"Drop £1500 on a mid-range PC, just so you can play TSC at 30-40FPS on a good day". Yeah.... I don't see a stampede of people rushing to grab an RTX4080 for that.
But spending money on a console for a game that needs mods to look good and suffers from Z fighting and low res textures is a good choice? Everyone's own decision. And a PC can be used for much more you know But please stop blaming PC users for console problems - it was your own choice.
We all do. But if we buy it even if it's not to our quality standards we only have ourselves to blame. And the comment "Console users can't" (enjoy the TSC version) is superfluous. Of course you can, you just have to buy it like everything else in the world.
No idea what was updated in Fife and WCL - changes were not communicated by DTG. Nothing to be found on the Rivet forums either.
I've a suspicion the changes in the WCL pak are related to Formation Designer compatibility, nothing with the route has actually changed.
