Help With Speed Limits Without "next Speed Limit Hud" Needed

Hey guys,

As the title suggests, I've come to the stage where I feel pretty confident operating trains with minimum assistance, especially on German railways, where I always drive with all safety systems active.

Today I decided I was ready for the final challenge, and that is to turn off the last assistance; next speed limit HUD.

The run went OK, but I noticed a few things that need clarifying. So, this is for MSB route;

1. The main HUD will still display max allowed speed with the red dot (can this be removed?)

2. Out of Gemunden, the speed limits are changing from LZB (45km limit), to rail limit 40km that increases to 60km and then to 110km (I think), but I couldn't see any signs for these limits? The reason I knew these were the speed limits is because of the red dot in the HUD (mentioned in point 1).

The only speed limits I could see is the white triangle (for speed increase) and orange triangle (for speed decrease).

What am I missing? How are these speed limits marked if not with the triangles? What do I need to look for?

Thanks!

 

Don't own the route, nor really have an interest in German railways. But, if you come across an unmarked speed restriction, make a note of a nearby landmark.

 

Signals probably. What was the aspect on the exit signal?

 

If you are able to plug a keyboard in (even temporarily) you can hide the HUD element that sits in the bottom right of the screen by pressing Ctrl+5. This will require you to rely on the train's dashboard for speed and brake information. If you want to remove only the red dot, I'm afraid you can't.

As for the limits out of Gemunden (I think the start of the route), I don't have the route, but I suspect that it is because you are changing track. (so you started on one line, then over the points at a limit of 40, then you reached the next line with a limit of 60, then you reached another line with a limit of 110. Remember that speed limit increases only take effect once the back of the train passes it.

 

You understand the signalling wrong. Line speed is always changed with Lf 7 (white rectangle), does not matter if increasing or decreasing. For decreasing, you will have advance warning Lf 6 (orange triangle) roughly 1 km ahead.

Note that for railways, speed increase is only valid after whole train passes the point of increase.

For speed reductions enforced by main signals (in stations and/or when changing tracks), they apply until next main signal (if imposed by entry or intermediate signals) or until the train left the last junction (if imposed by exit or block signal). The seemingly random increases you are seeing on HUD is likely the end of your train leaving the station and the speed limits there.

 

This may sound a little weird but station tracks themselves don't really have a fixed speed limit that you would have to be aware of so if you are departing from a station track onto the line, you should look at what speed limit is displayed on the exit signal and stick to it until the end of the switching area. Then accelerate to line speed, which you should know.

Same goes for entry, where you should see a speed restriction on the entry signal and follow it until you stop on the station track.

If the signals don't show any speed restriction, it means you won't be turning on any switches and can just drive at the line speed. As simple as that.

Here is a simple example from SŽDC D1 (Czech railway rules but it's all the same stuff), which illustrates the situation.

 

Thanks for all the answers guys! Really appreciate it. If I still struggle I'll record the first couple of minutes of me departing the Gemunden station so you get a better understanding of what's going on.

Regarding switching off the HUD, I am on PS5 and the only way I can turn off the HUD is by holding the "start" button. But by doing that I can no longer do anything other than acknowledge safety systems.

 

Ok, I was somewhat in a hurry when making my reply and this is a really interesting subject so let's explain it more properly with a little station diagram that I made and show what's the proper way of setting speed limits in a switching area and how TSW does it wrong.

If anyone is more knowledgeable on the topic, please correct me.

Here you can see typical double-track on the left, then a switching area and then a station on the right with respective track numbers (which is fairly similar to Gemunden except for the 100 km/h crossover, which I added for extra variety). Then I added some labels and colors showing the design speeds for various parts of the switching area.

As you can see, the rails that are going to platforms have a higher design speed (meaning smoother turns and longer switches) while rails that are going to the freight track (number 5) are slower because it's simply not necessary to build them to such a high standard.

Now how do you, for example, decide the speed limit for going from station track number 5 to track number 2? It's pretty simple. You just look at what is the most restricting bit of track along the way (the first 40 km/h one in this case) and enforce it's speed limit for the entire way through the switching area (with a signal). Then once the train passes the last switch (excluding ones where it's going straight), it can accelerate to line speed because none of this stuff matters anymore.

The advantage of this is that you can go faster or slower based on which routes the train is taking so if you are for example going from track 2 to station track 4, you will get a 60 km/h speed limit because that's the design speed of the slowest section that the train is going to go through. Or if you go from track 2 to station track 1, you only care about the 100 km/h crossover and can go that much faster as a result.

Also if you are just going straight, you aren't passing through any points with a restriction so there is no point of having any special speed limit.

Now why do station tracks not have any of their own speed limits. It's just because there is already always a dynamic speed restriction when arriving or departing from them. As simple as that.

And lastly, with all the information presented, I want to say how Train Sim World HUD does it wrong. It's simply because it can't read signal speed properly and mainly looks (or maybe even only looks) at track speed. The route devs just set a fixed speed for every bit of the switching area similar to my diagram, which isn't too bad but the HUD just can't tell that it's a switching area and treats it as an open track with that many speed changes. That's why you for example see a speed limit bump as you exit the 40 km/h bits and drive into the faster 60 km/h sections.

 

Beautiful!

 

I'm reading through your comment now! This is indeed interesting and it makes sense. I have to read everything, and then process it in my head to fully understand this. As this is exactly what I've been struggling to understand, as I was not familiar with all these different "accepted/agreed upon" speed limits for the side tracks.

My issue was that if the red dot on the speedometer wasn't present in the game, and there are no signs within the train station area indicating speedlimits of 40/60/110 for different rails/crossings etc, then there's no way for me to know these actual speed limits, right? Unless I've studied this beforehand and memorised these?

Obviously, this goes back to having to learn these beforehand?

 

Nope, I don't think you need to learn them beforehand and the topic of how speed limits are created is not very important for the drivers anyway. I just went this deep in order to show where TSW is wrong and what it's showing you (that it's displaying raw information and not processing it properly). You should just look at what the signal is saying and follow it all the way through. Remember that the signal speed is based on the slowest section that it routes you through.

 

The signal tells you all you need to know, there is no need to memorize layouts of individual stations. If you need to go to any of the sidings, the signal with reflect that with showing the lowest speed along the way. And this speed is what you must adhere to already from passing the signal, even if the HUD says you can go faster until hitting the junction. The HUD is teaching you completely wrong things, as is sadly the case with most of the TSW HUD.

Same goes for your case of leaving Gemünden (the signal will tell you the speed you can leave with, valid until end of the train passes last junction). In addition, as it is the starting stop, the PZB will be in starting mode (flashing alternately) requiring you to stay at 40 km/h, until the starting program ends, or until you press Free button. You can only free yourself if the main signal is showing permissive aspect allowing departure with speed > 30 km/h.

 

So the signalling of green/yellow, yellow/green & yellow/yellow are indicators for maximum allowed speed on the lines? Is this what you are saying?

Also, where can I actually learn about these things?

 

Indeed! You can check for example tygerways#2596's youtube channel.

 

Not sure if already mentioned but technically you should be reducing speed to the restriction at the home signal, not the track location. This is enforced on TSC German routes but TSW does not seem to recognise signal speeds.

 

Oh! Now things are starting to make much more sense. I'll most certainly look into the YT channel you posted. I really want to nail the understanding of signals and signs, as I feel it's important to know these things and it makes the gameplay more fun!

Edit: Just subscribed to his channel and watching! Thank you!

 

Nailed it! By holding "start" button on PS5 controller everything related to HUD-help disappears. Finished 2 freight services fully on my own, paying attention only to signals and speed restrictions. Finally!

 

Happy to help. I would suggest continuing with the follow-up video on Ks-signalling (the one I linked is H/v signalling). Both signalling types are used extensively and often mixed together within a single route, including the Main-Spessart Bahn.