This time I got through Standege Tunnel, thought great whatever was ahead must be clear by now and after about two miles going downhill just getting up to 65 MPH - blam, another red without any warning. So yes, signalling rework absolutely essential and apart from TOD4 this is another route which would beefit from the reverb adding to tunnels and bridges. Imagine that 45 echoing back off the roof of the tunnels as you crack the power handle open to full...
I tend to turn on the in-cab signalling (ie Hud next aspect) on this route. Had a thrash with a tat (40) Manc to Leeds this afternoon. Lovely
Yes, but wouldn't you prefer the modern sound of a desiro on a 12 mile route, we will throw some working lifts in to make the experience less dulling of the senses.....
Similarly I Tabbed the signaller which you would never do IRL (back in those days there was no cab radio, for one thing!) and was told permission denied at the next signal. Crawled down the hill at 20 MPH and by the time the signal came into view, had cleared to green. The 2D map does show a 2 car stopper in front. You can sort of glean from the running time that you’re probably following something, which is where a more comprehensive timing display similar to the working timetable, passing times as well as station or operational calls/objectives would be useful. If I know I’m not booked past Marsden until 20/00 and it’s 1956 then I know I’m running early and probably need to ease back.
Ah yes, that melodious Desiro/Electrostar whine throbbing back off the tunnel wall. Then maybe cue some dramatic music!
And don't forget, absolutely no other rolling stock so all the major stations are dull and empty and lifeless.
I WANT to like it more... but yeah it's really dated, especially at night, etc. Sadly I'd put it in a similar state to WCL, which also could be really good but the scenery just isn't up to par. I'm spoiled by newer stuff that's simply amazing and this is just "okay." It's not "bad" just... meh. When given options, I'll drive something else. A remaster/revamp with better timetable/layers and scenery update would be a lot of fun.
It's all personal opinion. I don't see much difference in the scenery, especially the far scenery. (Whole hillsides with no grass for example) They're both just... meh.
West Cornwall has too many trees and incorrect field patterns, nTP absolutely nails on the scenery of that part of the UK.
This is where I show I'm a casual because I don't know what that part of England has for "accurate trees and fields" (have only been to the east coast and up around Birmingham on my travels) but for me the scenery (mostly the far scenery, not the stations and stuff) on NTP is just "meh". *shrugs* It's a personal opinion. It needs updating badly. It's not BAD. It just could be a lot better. So do I play it? I haven't in awhile in favor of other routes.
I regularly go for a spin on NTP, it's probably my most played route - narrowly beating Blackpool Branches and was the sole reason I bought TSW2 in the first place. It seriously does need updating, the free mod/patch does an excellent job of improving the route but I still find that certain conditions can make it a dreadful (not the good kind) of experience - I have found that rain with overcast basically whites-out everything, put it into summer mode and clear skies and it's still amazing though I do feel that MCV needs touching up (like add the subway for a start) and we could do with some more rolling stock to really bring it back to life On the subject of expansion, well adding in the leg to Liverpool would be awesome and while there's not much by way of challenging gradients it would be great to get 40s/45s/47s to stretch their legs over Chat Moss. It'd also offer a great opportunity to introduce both MGR trains & Class 56s alongside 40 hauled "tanks" which regularly stormed through Victoria on the charge up Miles Platting bank, though from memory I think both tended to go via the Calder Valley?
NTP does show its age to a certain degree and is not without issues (The Signalling once prompted me to do a full uninstall of TSW) WCL has so many issues its difficult to list/remember them all. The 150/2 is terrible, The scenery was not researched, point work is far to sharp for the speeds concerned. The layers are almost comedy level of innacuracy for 1992. Class 40s on Western region Intercity trains are about as far removed from reality as it gets in any era never mind the early 90s when BR didnt allow Preserved diesels out at all. Something went really wrong in the execution of this DLC and its only saving grace is the Seacow and Turbot wagons which are handy to layer in elsewhere.
I know your head has already been bitten off and all the points I'd put against this are in the post above, but to even try and compare NTP to WCL seems crazy. NTP is much, much better, not only for what you get included (45, 47, 101) but like said above the accuracy of both scenery and era.
As I've said, I admit I'm a casual. The "authenticity" doesn't bother me as much as dedicated railfans. I'd have a hard time telling the difference between a 37, 40 and 45 at first glance given the very similar look of them. Already had the 47 and 101 from other routes. (Then again, most Brits probably couldn't tell you the difference between a GP-9, GP-38 or an SD-40...) I haven't touched them in awhile now so should probably go back and give them a go to compare again. However, there's a reason they're both on the back burner. I get that NTP has it's ardent fans and that Rivet is the whipping boy on the forums, but playing them a bit each when I first bought them, neither stood out as really "good." They're both "average." Not awful... just average. That's my impression of them. NTP is a bit better, but it isn't to the level of "good." So that puts WCL as "below average" but still not failing. A route would have to be unplayable (literally buggy and crashing) or have ZERO content I'd use (like Aachen) to really be a "failure" to me. There's just so much better content out there, that SOMEONE has to be just average. It's my opinion. It's often not popular. I don't care for Clinchfield either, or most of the German routes which people understandably love. (Dresden, MSB, Nidder, Koblenz and Maintalbahn excepted)
From what I know preserved class 40's, 52's and 55's were able to run railtours on Br tracks during the 80s a notable one is when scotrail borrow the first deltic. So you might be wrong about them not gracing railtours back in the 80s-early 90s.
I would say it is a much better route than WCL. It has much more realistic traffic for a start and the physics and sounds of the stock are generally fine. It captures well the Pennines in 1983. WCL does not do a good job of capturing West Cornwall nineteen ninety something. Personally don't think the scenery on WCL is as bad as some say it is and the stations are well modelled but it isn't a realistic route, there are too many trees, the class 150 still isn't great, despite revisions and there are issues with the speed limits on the St. Ives branch. Both routes would benefit from TOD4 lighting but I would want that to happen on NTP (with a new timetable) much more than WCL.
1994 was when the first preserved diesel ran on the mainline, it was class 46 "Ixion", on a railtour, apart from a one off event when Western Courier ran a short section of mainline in 1977 on the Torbay steam railway.. The layers on WCL aren't depicting railtours they are supposed to be depicting service trains. Even if they were depicting railtours, you would have one, not several, and not with a dirty blue diesel with a rake of mark 2's without a brake vehicle. The layers are a complete fantasy and are the main reason I don't use WCL, even more than the lovely looking but flawed class 150.
No 40 hauled a train on the mainline between 40122 being withdrawn on arrival at York in 1988 and 40145 which was preserved in 2002 or 2001 I dont recall which year. Which means that WCL is an incorrect deciption of operations in that era. Class 45s were also gone and BR Blue was in serious limited numbers. Dont get me started on headlights etc....
Went back to WCL the other day, mostly because I’ve just come back from a holiday in Cornwall. The stations are great and the run into Penzance looks decent, but so much of the scenery - particularly the lengthy Truro to St Austell section, just looks so basic and generic. And the less said about the Hayle estuary the better. Not just Rivet bashing here incidentally as Bernina and Fife Circle are too of my most played routes just lately, but WCL isn’t the best.
I can tolerate the somewhat poor long distance scenery. The route still feels great. I'm happy when the "Quick Play" randomizer throws me into NTP. Especially when I spawn in that beautifully crafted Class 101 to take her for a ride. Just looooove that old iron. You can see the enthusiasm and dedication the designers had when they modelled her. Sounds are awesome as well. Better than many rushed out content we got to see recently.
I got told off for asking if the new BR101 would layer on to NTP/TVL etc Turned out it was some German thing
NTP would be my pick for a remaster. The new stock from later routes would be a great addition and the route - Manchester - Leeds - has a lot of potential that it is held away from by its age. The distant scenery, lighting and signalling are all asking for a rework. It has the potential to be a BPO-tier route, which, along with JT's next one and TVL (which could also do with a remaster) could leave us with a really good 4-set of BR routes. + WSR, in terms of stock.
I have been to Truro and Falmouth though not down to Penzance, anyway the trees are too numerous and they are the wrong shape as well, Cornwall is famous for big lofty oak trees and the ones on the route are more like Birches, the vegetation also is lacking in some sections without the wildflower clusters and meadows that are typical in the West country.
When I was a student back in the early 70s I regularly travelled by rail between Newcastle and Manchester and although the route is in a slightly later time frame, NTP has definitely become my favourite. If only the Newcastle to Leeds section was available.
I do on occasion. I must admit that driving the Class 47 is fun to drive. If only DTG would fix the passenger issue on that route though. Am I the only one that thinks that the front of a Class 40 reminds me of a pig?
