Pfälzische Ludwigsbahn Has A Tiliting System...

Discussion in 'TSW General Discussion' started by FreddieTheShepherd, Sep 8, 2024.

  1. FreddieTheShepherd

    FreddieTheShepherd Well-Known Member

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    According to Wikipedia (in German), the Pfälzische Ludwigsbahn route (Mannheim-Kaiserslautern should be equipped with tiliting technology. I don't know if anyone already mentioned it, but I came to this because in Germany, there are several versions of the tilting technology - one of them is ZUB 262. It is equipped on the BR 612 and on the ICE-T. Also on DCZ and Frankfurt-Fulda as we know, but also on Mannheim-Kaiserslautern. Do you think, DTG will implement this although there wouldn't be new tilting trains? Or will there be new tilitng trains - missing ones are: BR 605 "ICE-TD", BR 415 "ICE-T 5-car variant", BR 610 and the BR 611 but I'm unsure if these trains would fit into the period and the place....
     
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2024
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  2. Myron

    Myron Well-Known Member

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    what about the 5 coach ICE T? :P
     
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  3. OpenMinded

    OpenMinded Well-Known Member

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    Good question! In fact the route between Neustadt und Kaiserslautern was equipped with ZUB122. The part between Kaiserslautern and Saarbrücken will not be build in TSW.

    However, in 2014 there was only one service per day using it, an ICE-T, which was about one minute faster then an IC1. The 611 and 612 never really used the GNT on here, even though they were based in Kaiserslautern until end 2014. They only ran out of Saarbrücken and did not run any services through Kaiserslautern, as far as I know.
     
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  4. Jo_Kim

    Jo_Kim Well-Known Member

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    Due to the discontinuation of ZUB122 the line is no longer equipped with GNT in the present day. As the route will be set in 2014 I can't say if the system was still active back then, as there is very little public information about the details of the installed equipment.
    The only tilting trains on this line are the ICE-T and RegioSwinger (BR612) . The BR610 was only used in northern Bavaria. The BR611 was used on the Neustadt to Karlsruhe services, but as far as I know this was only in the late 90s and early 2000s, but not in 2014. The ICE-TD was only used on the Hamburg-København service via the Fehmarn Belt ferry.
     
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  5. OpenMinded

    OpenMinded Well-Known Member

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    This is also true for the Kaiserslautern to Saarbrücken part, which was equipped with ZUB262. I am not sure exactly when this was decomissioned, however, I am pretty certain it was still in use in 2014. The ICE-T at the time was 3 minutes quicker then todays service between Kaiserslautern and Neustadt.
    What services exactly did they run, though?! I know they were based in Kaiserslautern but I could not find any reference for them driving anything in Kaiserslautern. They were used out of Saarbrücken until 2014 but not on the line to Kaiserslautern, let alone Neustadt. What services did they serve and when, do you know?
     
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  6. grob-e

    grob-e Well-Known Member

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    Well, reading the article, it mentions quite a couple of trains/locos running there...ICE1 LDV (BR 401), ICE 3 (BR 403 and 407 (Siemens Velaro D)), TGV Euroduplex, EC trains with austrian BR 1016/1116 (austrian iteration of the BR 182), BR 425, BR 429 (Stadler Flirt), BR 1440 (passenger), BR 185 and SBB RE 482, BR 155, BR 152 (freight, mostly Opel factory in Kaiserslautern, I guess...), the unavoidable BR 363 shunting on non electrified sidings and BR 294, a couple of BR 212 and BR 218 (Ludwigshafen-Schifferstadt, Neustadt-Hochspeyer and then, I guess, branching off to an unelectrified branchline)... so nothing really tilting, even there's a picture of a BR 611 in Kaiserslautern in the article, it's not mentioned in the rolling stock section.
     
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2024
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  7. Myron

    Myron Well-Known Member

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    which article was it again, 2nd part of the roadmap?
     
  8. grob-e

    grob-e Well-Known Member

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    No, wikipedia article of the 'Pfälzische Ludwigsbahn'

    From the roadmap stream background...

    Background Roadmap.png
    we can be quite sure, that the BR 425 is somewhat 'confirmed'...to the right side, and the BR 403 to the left...as the somewhat 'lifted or higher ceiling' doesn't go continously over all waggons...what would be on the 407...(and both waggons have doors seeable, not on BR 407/ICE-T)

    [​IMG]

    while the ICE-T doesn't have the higher ceiling at all...

    [​IMG]
     
    Last edited: Sep 9, 2024
  9. Myron

    Myron Well-Known Member

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  10. Jo_Kim

    Jo_Kim Well-Known Member

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    In 2014 the ICE-T was used on a single daily service between Saarbrücken and Leipzig. The RegioSwinger was used on the regional services from Neustadt to Grünstadt, Karlsruhe or Wissembourg (which would only be AI traffic) and on the RE6 from Karlsruhe to Neustadt with single trains being extended to Kaiserslautern.
    The BR425 is confirmed, as all S-Bahn services on this line are operated with these. I don't know the service patterns on this line in 2014, but if I remember correctly between the introduction of the S-Bahn Rhein-Neckar in 2004 and the introduction of the SÜWEX in 2015, the S-Bahn services were the only regional serivces on this line (with exception of single extended journeys mentioned above).
    The ICE on the train is not a ICE3MS (BR407). The 3MS has (as all past-2010 ICE rolling stock) spuare windows, whilst the ICE in the picture has oval windows. The 3MS was introduced into the international services to Paris in mid-2015. The actual trains used on these services were the ICE3MF, which were modified ICE3M for France. Changes include the TVM and KVB safety systems, reinforced undercarriage, modified SiFa (to comply with VACMA standards), addition of a Emergency Shutoff button in the cab and one modified compartment for passengers detained by the police. These modifications resulted in the removal of 6 passenger seats.
    But I would bet it will be the old ICE3M (BR406) from SKA, as besides from the slightly different cab the changes are so little that it wouldn't be noticable in TSW.
     
  11. OpenMinded

    OpenMinded Well-Known Member

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    That would mean that DTG would need to incorporate GNT for a couple of 612 services (how many, maybe 2-4?) and one ICE-T service. I would doubt that but would certainly hope so. It was ZUB122, though, while DTG tech is based around ZUB262. Not much difference for the driver, I suppose.
     
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  12. Jo_Kim

    Jo_Kim Well-Known Member

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    The operations for the driver are the same, no matter if it's ZUB 122 or ZUB 262. The the differences between these two systems are in the transmission equipment and protocols, but the displays and operations for the driver are identical, that's why the system is called GNT. If the line will be equipped with GNT in TSW it will be the same solution as they've implemented in DCZ, which whilst being quite different from the real system, is a good compromise as long as TSW doesn't have the EBuLa working.
     

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