yea just kinda got curious. From official to 3rd parties. How many Mk1 based DMUs and EMUs are there for TSC currently?
Off the top of my head… Class 101 Met Cam Class 105 (Cravens) via Weardale. Old IHH model with slightly off sounds, but serviceable. Class 117 (via North Somerset). Sounds also a bit iffy. Think there’s a Class 121 bubble car kicking around too. AP do a Class 205 DEMU which I think can also be bought on Steam. EMU’s well there’s the EPB, plus think also a HAP. The 4CIG and AP’s 4CEP. However still quite a few gaps. A Class 108 really needed as they were quite numerous and one of the last heritage types left in service. A Class 120 Cross Country unit would be useful along with Class 104 BRCW type. DEMU’s, could do with a Hastings unit (all types) plus Class 207 East Sussex units. EMU’s well several DC units needed and pretty much all of the AC Mark One based units are missing, IIRC. Have to doubt many of these will get made at this point in TSC’s existence, other than by third parties with an interest in heritage traction such as AP.
ah i see, a pretty decent amount it looks? Are there still any demand for MK1 based MUs among the TSC community or is it merely because a lot of the developers just focus on TSW nowadays?
DMU-wise, major gaps are Cross-Country (mentioned above), Intercity and Derby Lightweight. Sadly, whilst there are developers jumping on top of each other to produce umpteen versions of the same locomotives, there seem to be no DMU developers out there at all. John
There are a lot of later Dmus and Emus as they still exist and it easier to get details and sounds. There does not seem to be the interest from the younger gamers in older trains
there are MK1 DMUs that run intercity services?? I thought they are commuter based trains? Me who likes any old EMUs with a old sounding motor like on the PEPs and Mk3 EMU be like: and yea i can kinda see that? idk at least in my opinion the EMUs after the MK1 based ones are more... interesting? Mk1 EMUs and DMUs are so confusing to me because most of the time I cant even remember their TOPs numbering.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_Rail_Class_123 They were deployed on fast services between Paddington and Oxford plus various other routes over their existence. You also had the Class 124 Trans Pennine units which worked across the Diggle route from Manchester to Leeds.
The Mk1 DMUs were a small group and ran regional services in the 1960s - 1980s.Not Inter City Services Class 123, 124 and 126 were the units in question https://railcar.co.uk/type/class-123/ https://railcar.co.uk/type/class-124/ https://railcar.co.uk/type/class-126/
Also class 111. Cosmetically nearly identical to the 101, some under the hood differences I think? IHH did another class as well as the 105/117, possibly a 114? In a pack for Creative Rail's early eighties ECML. There's a class 303 as well, AFAIK the only first gen AC EMU available.
Also be aware that after you have purchased the base model (e.g. Class 101 from steam) there are a myriad of reskins and upgrades available from Steam and 3rd party developers. Examples include :- https://www.goldengoldsmithstudios.co.uk/assets-reskins https://backdatedtrainsim.weebly.com/multiple-units.html https://store.steampowered.com/app/277736/Train_Simulator_BR_Regional_Railways_Class_101_DMU_AddOn/ https://store.steampowered.com/app/222564/Train_Simulator_Strathclyde_Class_101_DMU_AddOn/ Just also be mindful of the fact that a lot of the old DMU Reskins also require some of the AP sound packs which have since been discontinued. Not sure if they will still work without the sound packs but maybe worth trying?
If you are particularly interested in first generation DMU's, I can recommend Diesel Railcar Simulator, just search for it on Steam. It's not as pretty as TSC (or TSW) and most of the routes are fictional, but it has come a long way since being released into early access. It allows you to try the Class 127 DMU which was a 4 car suburban type used out of St Pancras on local services to Bedford. Differed slightly from the DMU standard by having an automatic hydraulic transmission. On the topic of suburban DMU's, also missing from TSC are the Class 115 Marylebone 4 car units, the Class 116 and Class 118. The latter two similar to the 117's but with detail differences.
in the german community most payware creators have pivoted to TSW under the flag of TSG. It´s not just one or two people from what I read over on Railsim: there are at least 7-8 people who have publicly said: "I´m working on stuff TSW now". On the english side of things it still looks much better with AP, ATS and many others going strong. To my big suprise, JT has returned to working on TSC freeware route over the holidays, as seen on the Train Sim TV channel:
JT haven't, it's Thomas and Mark, and maybe Jack, working away. Things may end up being available through JT but they won't be JT commissioned projects. See the thread at https://forums.dovetailgames.com/threads/end-of-year-round-up-from-just-trains.88018/
ooooh i see- so thats how they look like. I tried getting a class 442 reskin in SWR livery before. But since that required the 442 soundpack from AP and i dont have that. I had to get someone (thanks gary) to help modify the bin file to get it working. And neither do i know how to edit bin file to make it work so... thanks for the suggestion, i have only been looking into Mk1 EMUs so happened because i was looking into past rail scene on the brighton mainline (or during the era where old stock switch to new back in somewhere the near start of the privatisation era), only to discover MK1 EMUs 4CIG, 4BIG and 4VEPs? that mainly ran the brighton mainlone. Alongside class 319s for thameslink out of brighton. I already bought the class 442 and soon class 319 i am unsure would i get the 4CIG just so i can complete old trains on the brighton mainline lol, even though i dont think i will be getting it for TSC. And then again MK1 MU classification is confusing as heck to me lol. something a little off topic i wanna discover about the trains. I find it amusing that some TOCs/operators in the south dont have dedicated MK3 based EMUs. Like how thameslink with their Class 319 and the Southwestern side with the Class 455 and 456 (I know connex/southern once have these but these mainly run on the southwestern side of the region so i dont count them on the southern side) and just stuck with very very old MK1 EMUs until they were done with them at least with the southern side because southeastern side have 465s. wasnt that like their personal project or something? Still a shame and i am sad that JT stopped doing TSC stuff (sorry but TSC is just much more worthwhile playing when i cant get long enough distance before getting cut off in the middle of nowhere).
The IHH unit is not a 114 - even though they called it that as the body is wrong - it is more of a 108? After the Cabs there are 2 big windows then a small window and 4 normal windows. The 108 has the same 2 big windows then 3 big windows and one small Even then IHH got the Guards van end wrong Peter
Yes, 180 bhp Rolls-Royce C6 engines rather than AEC or Leyland 150 bhp units and slightly beefed up gearboxes - SE4 vs R14.
I thought the IHH model was a Class 107, ie the Derby Heavyweights that only ever ran in Scotland. But then saying that, those screenshots appear not to have roof-mounted headcode boxes. I didn’t think anyone had produced a DMU with the more rounded cab-roof, ala early batches of Derby units? (Where did you get it from?) I believe someone also does a patch to convert the 117 into a 118, with the curved-top headcode box, although it’s a very minor change as the fleet were basically a further batch of 117s.
Ooh, nice little route and quite near to me. I hope they extend it further to go the other way towards Mirfield and the Calder Valley.
It is the IHH Unit from the days when IHH Sold their DLC. When you compare the body arrangement its quite close to a 117 with the window arrangement but IHH made a mess of it and forgot to add a Roof Headcode Box so they numbered it as a 114. I don't think non Guards van coach has Engines so it could not be a 117.
yes, yes I know all that ... it´s people from just trains and not official company. They have released several routes under the name of OTS. I am just very suprised to see them working on a TSC route in spare time between TSW development. That´s a pleasent suprise.
You've got me there. If Iron Horse House had ever released a Derby Class 114 it is extremely likely I would have bought it. On the other hand they did release a Pressed Steel Class 117, correctly formed DMBS+TCL+DMS. I can't say I have studied the window details but it definitely has a headcode box (configurable) plus a range of appropriate WR destinations. This is the model adopted by Railsimulator.com and morphed into a Class 121 too. The only other one I know of that they sold was the Class 105 Cravens, which was also subsequently released by RS.com. John
1st gen DMUs are ridiculously ignored in TSC. No idea why. They formed the backbone of the 50s modernisation period of BR and were ubiquitous right through until the mid early to mid 80s . There's a lot of attention paid to pointless wheeled kettles, but DMUs are sadly overlooked in TSC.
Probably because there is little interest in them, so not commercially viable. Many people, myself included, seem to prefer pointless wheeled kettles to pointless rattling buses.
The IHH Class 107s do have headcode boxes. I've just re-installed my copy and the blue-grey variant certainly does. I've not checked the others yet.
That would be great. I could then drive the section of line very local to me and where I have made several videos of trains passing by. The route could then also be used to simulate TPE diversions when the line between Leeds and Thornhill Jctn/Ravensthorpe is closed.
I knew I'd forgotten one - there is of course the 1500 volt DC class 506 for the Woodhead route as well.
Bit of a grey area as they were ordered by the LNER pre WWII in 1938 but didn’t enter service until 1954 after electrification was finally completed. In appearance they have a Mark One style and in truth the Mark One coaches itself was derived from the existing company designs.
506 units don't look anything like a Mk1 coach They are the same design as what was built for the Liverpool St to Shenfield line and designed in 1938. introduced in 1949. https://www.lner.info/locos/Electric/shenfield.php How you can say a 506 has features from Mk1 coaches built from 1951I'm not sure
Actually now you mention it, they probably have more in common with the original LNER Tyneside electric units!
So what comes before Mark 1? There's no such thing as "zero generation" so all of the grouping (and earlier) diesels and electrics get lumped in with the BR Modernisation Plan first gens.
That makes no sense. Something that is pre BR cannot be a BR modernisation product, otherwise every steam loco made before BR would be a BR standard. In any case it was BR's first type of coaching stock (and derivatives), it wasn't a technology generation. They are different things.
That is like saying a GWR Steam loco was part of the BR Modernisation plan. Have you not heard of the Big 4 and before that Pre-Grouping (Pre 1923)? They built a lot of different coaches that were the basis of the Mk1 designs that BR introduced. The Class 502 and 503 units that operated on Merseyside were built by the LMS, The Southern Railway had Emus built before the 1923 Grouping and the Brighton Belle started running in 1931.
I was talking specifically of diesel and electric locomotives and units; both those produced by the Big Four and those produced under the BR Modernisation Plan are considered first generation. Therefore the class 506 EMU, although built to an LNER design, is to all intents and purposes a first generation or mark one unit.
No they are not, only loco's, dmu's and emu's. Commissioned from 1955 onwards under the BR Modernisation plan. Are covered by the said definition, the two LMS diesel classes for starters are not modernisation defined classes.
How can you say something that was designed 10 years before BR and the category Mark 1 existed to be a Mk1 unit? The first Mark 1 units were the 4 Cep units for the Kent Coast Electrification as they were based on the Mark 1 bodyshell The LNER/LMS/SR Emus might be considered to be "Mark 1" by you but not by most people
This is not true. The 506 EMU and BR Mk 1 coach family have different design histories and engineering. They are different branches on the tech tree. BR continued to construct big four steam locos after nationalisation, but that doesn't in any way make them part of the BR Standard loco classes.
You could call stock 1st Generation or BR Mk1 but it does not follow that they are both e.g the GWR "Fying Banana" Railcars are a 1st Generation diesel unit but they cannot be considered to be BR Mk1 stock. The first of the BR Mk1 coaching stock appeared (if my memory serves me right) in 1951 and was considered to be revolutionary at the time. EMUs using the same shape and features followed later on the Southern Region.
It is a first generation unit because by definition you cannot have an earlier generation than first!
The original question was about Mk 1 DMUs and EMUs. When people use the term Mk. I they invariably mean the BR Mk. I family of coaching and related stock, which were designed and built by BR in the '50s. The 506 EMU was not part of that technology tree and most people would not describe it as a BR Mk 1 design. However, I think enough has been said about the 506, so I will not be saying anything more about it.
My apologies chaps, I have clearly misread the original post (badly) and gone off on completely the wrong track. Sincerely, Red-faced of Tunbridge Wells
By that argument, Stephenson's Rocket is a first generation locomotive under the BR modernisation plan
