Just Trains Next Route Predictions

There's a big ommision here which is more what I've been arguing - that JT have changed their minds internally and decided just to go for it.

Obviously in that instance they'll not issue a public statement saying "btw we've changed our minds we could do Glasgow" because to the community that reads as a decision being made.

How many times - talking to everyone - have you & a group of friends decided to do something on a whim which you previously ruled out.
Okay, JT aren't just a group of friends, they're a studio, a business - but the principle applies that JT may well have had a more in depth look at it after WCMLOS was complete and fully launched and decided 'well, if we do this [86, TfW Pacer] then we'll have enough time to have a stab at it.'

As I've said (contrary to Double Yellow) I'm just speculating and theorising rather than presenting it as fact - but the point stands that it is not a straight choice between "JT are liars" and "JT are doing what they said."

 

Routes take a long time top develop and they certainly don't start building it just a couple of months before announcing, so its extremely likely that when that comment was made the decision on their next route was already made and at the very least research if not even track laying had begun, yes its possible that in the future they may change their minds and go back to WCML North but for their next route I find it very unlikely. Of course it is entirely possible they made that u-turn days after that comment or had simply made a red herring to keep us all guessing, but if I was a betting man I would put my house (that I dont own) down saying its not going to be Carlisle - Glasgow

 

I need to be clear about something here. I’m not calling Just Trains liars about their upcoming route choice, I have no idea what that is, only wishful thinking to what I’d like to see.
So I don’t know why anyone is bringing this up in your argument.
What I don’t believe is that Just Trains don’t take some form of direction from DTG, independent or not.

 

No I need your proof to back up your argument, not theirs, though it would help. As I am a guy that works on facts and hard evidence with a capital E.
Damn straight I’m passionate, where would we be if Nelson Mandela didn’t stand up to his beliefs.

 

I loaded up the 87 again the other day and loved it. The sense of speed especially is great

 

Yeah the 87 is an interesting drive with the power gauge. Before I did the tutorial I was wondering why I kept cutting out the power on the train. Stay out of the red zone

 

It takes off so quickly though doesn't it. Its incredible the sense of speed.

 

They weren’t BR’s flagship electric locos for nothing! Some of you may have seen Video 125’s fantastic Driver’s Eye View of the WCML in the early/mid 1990s.
When Fred Dineage said an 87 can take Shap at well over 90mph, he meant it!

 

Anything that runs from Liverpool Street or Fenchurch Street please. Any era will do.

 

I had that DVD but ended up selling it along with most of my railway DVD and model collection years ago after a spot of redundancy :/

 

I don’t see why they have to do a 3rd 80’s route as we have 2 already covering many miles with long drives. I’d like to see them change tack and bring the Metropolitan Line to TSW, something completely different and a nice varied route with brand new rolling stock, not more 87’s, Pacers etc.

 

I think the reason JT do 80s routes is because most other routes released by DTG are modern (although quality has slipped), and DTG probably won't do any 80s routes because it "doesn't sell". I probably prefer modern routes myself, but lots of people like what JT do, and without them there'd be more or less no representation for quite a substantial era in the railways.

 

As long as they bring a new loco I don’t mind but I don’t want to pay for the same engines over and over again. I do like 80’s routes a lot myself but like I say not more repeats. Some emu slam doors or a thumper would be nice. Another 87 route no thanks, and we have Pacer coming to Cardiff.
I said Met as they have all the research ready done and waiting on TSC, it’s a great route and the stock is fresh.
Come to think of it I can’t see JT releasing a route without a new loco, not their style.

 

i think they will stick to the 80s, or 70s. namely because they have a good pool of locos. they have already reworked the 47 and 101. if there was a bit of TLC for the TVL 20 and 37 back to blue plus a new loco/unit would only add to that on a few new routes

 

Can't disagree with you on that - Met would be great, in any era

 

If they did the Met, an appealing option might be to cover the transition period from the A60 to the S stock. I personally don't like the S stock very much, it's about as iconic a London Underground train as those awful Flexities are a proper Blackpool tram but i get it that some people like them. A subsequent DLC could be the C69 stock or, going retro, some CO/CP or R stock.

 

I don't think it'll be anywhere close to London NSE territory because that would mean having to make several trains from scratch which would be incredibly expensive and JT would want to do them justice.

However somewhere like Salisbury to Exeter for example would be interesting if they were to do NSE.

 

I think would be great if they could do settle to Carlisle. That would be cool.

 

TSW appears to be insanely hard to develop for. That means through cost new routes tend to come with one new train and maybe a recycling effort of an old one. It's took two and a half years for JT to produce a couple of routes and a couple of new trains with a third on the way. If they produce another area and/or era then that would take years if more than one train is required.

 

As discussed earlier in the thread though, S&C in the early to mid 80's was a traffic desert with just a handful of trains in each direction. Not enough to generate a decent TSW timetable or scenarios, even if you buffed it with a few railtours etc.

 

Scottish ECML from JT would be beautiful .

 

Unless JT went modern image. But agree train wise for the mid 80s train dessert but beautiful scenery though.

 

Then modern is driving from letterbox view Sprinters, so a real “Hobson’s Choice”…

 

Even modern though, passengers trains only run about 30x daily (both ends).
It would definitely be one of the quietest timetables for a route if it was made.

 

Away from the S&C for a moment, another curved ball for JT would be South/West Yorkshire coal. Inspired by the SIAM Aire Valley traffic simulation and based around Knottingley in 1990 extending from Leeds to Goole (use the 142 for passenger services) with Ferrybridge, Eggborough and Drax Power stations with as many coal mines as they can fit in to the map. They would give us the Class 56 and possibly the Class 60 as the new motive power. Both could be found thundering to and from the power stations on MGR services, day and night.

 

How about South Humber Mainline, Cleethorpes to Barton & Doncaster?
Not sure how it was in the rolling stock department in the 80s but in the 90s/turn of the millenium it seemed to have loads of freight in and out of Immingham and Scunthorpe with 37s, 56s and 60s (later, of course, 66s), with 158s and 153s on passenger work.

 

Way less than that. It's roughly 2 hourly, up to hourly between Long Preston and Leeds thanks to the Morecambe services.


This is made more obvious by the fact the thing's dual line throughout, aside from Ribblehead Viaduct and the approach to Carlisle. If it were a single line, it'd be less obvious it's so quiet.

 

Yeah there is little point building a route with only 27 services on it.

 

How busy was the Carlisle, Hexham to Newcastle line back in the 80's? Could this be a contender perhaps?

 

Busier but not by much. Think I mentioned earlier in the thread, trains roughly hourly between Newcastle and Hexham, but two hourly at best all the way to/from Carlisle. All DMU, too. Not that much freight either by the mid 80’s.

 

I wondered if JT would consider the Hope Valley line in the 80s, but again I suspect it’s too quiet. That being said, we have plenty of layers that would work so well for that route.

 

Their routes are like a fine wine.

 

I'm starting to think that JT may head south into the Western Region, introducing a Class 50 to run alongside the Class 45s, "Westerns" and brand new IC125s in the mid 70s. The sea of BR Blue and grey punctuated with the occasional sighting of the Western Region Class 47s that retained their original green livery for over a decade.

The section of the Great Western wouldn't really matter, being able to jump back to my childhood trips out west would be amazing. Exeter to Plymouth & Paignton maybe.

I'd still prefer a mid-80s NSE electric route but the above would be more likely given the great use of existing rolling stock in TSW.

 

Do you folks reckon it will be teased etc in August like last year with wcmlos?

 

Since WCMLOS has been out since late November of last year, it’s guaranteed we will see a JT reveal soon. Work on their new route most likely begun sometime after the new year.

 

Think this has been mentioned earlier, but with the 86s on the way for WCMLOS, there is potential for the GEML?

 

I wonder if there will be something on Thursday.
The default date on Shap route has been 5th June for quite a while now.

 

Bristol to Exeter would be a great shout

 

Matt P mentioned somewhere on here that he'd love the GEML with 86s and slam door EMUs but it's not on the project list at the moment.

I do get the feeling that they'd want to make the passenger engine better, slam door behaviour (i.e. the driver doesn't have to "open" the doors because that's the passenger's job, getting doors to open and close at different times and possibly even upgrade the guard function before tackling a busy Network South East slam-door train.

 

Something else: modern Hope Valley line, or historical Woodhead line for me, please...

 

Nobody is asking for more than one new train that I’m aware of?

 

There are.
A few people in threads have been ranting about how it's a terrible thing to only get one loco on a route.
Generally if you go to any thread about a new route or pricing you'll find a few ranting about how it's not enough and they need more new motive power or they threaten not to buy it.

 

That’s silly. Each one is a major undertaking.

 

He sold out Wembley arena, unlike Manchester City’s most recent FA fixture.
That’s a W in my book

 

It's not that it's a terrible thing. It's simply going to leave some routes empty or duplicating trains beyond the numbers that really exist. London to Brighton has Electrostars subbing for 455s. WCML over shap has 46 turns for 87s. There are only 31 in the fleet. It's not that it's terrible it's just sometimes a little too much compromise. No Eurostar SEHS is another and yes I know the timetable is decent already on that route....

 

I think (and hope) that the next route be WCMLN Carisle to Glasgow. Now I am sure everyone is familiar with this section of the mainline, but if this is true, I have questions about the loco. There's already a 87 and a 86. So there are multiple possibilities. Maybe an APT? A Class 85? idk.

 

They've already said no to that.

 

They who?

 

Liverpool Street to Norwich Inc. route to Clacton and Walton-On-The Naze. All the old EMU from the late 70s and early 80s with all the slam door EMU. All BR blue, now if anyone remembers these, there were quite a lot of EMU. Class 309, 307, 306 and 305. Inc BR Class 31. 37 and 47. Now if this happened, then it would be seriously impressive. JT if you read this..you know it makes sense.

 

Tom and JT gang