Upcoming Release Class 86/2 Loco Add-on: Coming Soon!

I hear ya. There's a few out there but none seem mature enough to challenge TSW at the moment, flawed though it may be. And becoming too expensive for what we're getting.

Real competition would almost certainly lead to changes for the better at DTG HQ.

 

Its down to Just trains if they want the CL dlc in their timetable. They were asked and they said no. That's it. There's no spat regardless of what you guys think.

 

But as a player that's all immaterial.

Whether it's a "spat" or not, it makes for a worse game experience for me.

So, it is what it is, and their choice obvs, but JT's lost a sale from me on the 86 if it doesn't incorporate CL4 into the timetable. It was already kind of a hard purchase to justify tbh, as it adds no new services AFAIK.

 

I couldn’t care less what goes on behind the scene, what I care about is my experience being lessened.

Not being able to see what should be complimentary rolling stock as AI on a route lessens my experience.

JT charged a premium price for WCMLOS which was absolutely fine with me because I got a premium experience in return, but now they are charging a premium price for the Class 86 but I’m getting zero extra services (ie actual gameplay) and being told that if I choose to purchase this I need to write off my investment in CL4 because I won’t see them together on the route.

I won’t be paying anything like full price for the Class 86 and to be honest I’ll be hesitant in purchasing any further JT releases because of these shenanigans.

Yes it’s their prerogative on what they allow on their timetable, but it’s also my prerogative to decide where to spend my money and I’d rather spend that with a company which works with other 3rd parties to give me the best experience possible rather than a rubbish experience

 

They are making it realistic, the class 86/2 was for cross country passenger services which were already in game due to the class 87’s timetable.

the coaches are a big part on why this pack is more costly, you are getting 4 mk2 versions and the mk 1 food coach, which both bring more realism to the route and would probably layer into other br routes.

you are basically complaining because the original timetable was basically perfect since it had services for class 87 which the class 86/2 used for.

yeah it would have be nice to get the class 86/4 for freight but you are basically guaranteed a high quality train and rolling stock.

There’s already a good chunk of addons that layer onto west coast main line 1980s so they probably found a problem with CL4 and the other addons hence the two timetables

 

No Im stating that they charged a premium for the route because it had a "perfect" timetable as you state (its far from perfect, with many services hidden from the menu and have to be started on foot or as a continuation of the previous service). And then they want to charge a premium for for a loco add on which adds zero services, and are locking it away from another add-on I've purchased for this route. That is double dipping in my book, had they either not been charging a premium, adding additional services (IE Game play) and/or not locking it away from other purchases, it would have been a day one purchase for me.

From the cab (where the vast majority of players spend the majority of their time, rolling stock is rarely visible, I am paying for game play and immersion and this pack is lacking both.

That may well be the case, but if so what they should have done is allowed for a copied timetable with shared progress, this copied timetable could then have had minor adjustments made to fit in CL4 and at the same time meant we could run both add ons on the same timetable. Instead we now have 2 entirely separate timetables with no shared progressed.

 

Honestly guys I totataly agree you and understand your reasoning for it.

Hentis

 

Another way of looking at is JT are responsible for their timetable, Skyhook made a copy of JT timetable for CL4. As such the onus really is on Skyhook not JT to update their timetable to suit, it is somewhat unfair in my book to expect JT to fix someone elses timetable when it wasn't them that created more work in the first place! Timetables are no easy things to make and take considerable time to even make slight alterations.

 

The way I understand is that JT have refused to allow SHG to layer it on, is this not the case?

 

I don't know any specifics in that regard, but I would suspect if it was the case it would be down to the fact the WCML is a 100-110mph line, and there are only so many 50-60mph freight paths that are even possible to have. Military trains are somewhat abnormal anyway, as such If it was my own timetable I wouldn't overly want stuff using up paths that may be required in future for whatever reason, since when something is added you can't really take it away! At the end of the day its JT's timetable and they can do whatever they want with it.

 

Sorry not sure I was clear, I meant my understanding is that SHG have been told they can’t put the 86 into their (SHG) version of the timetable? Is this not correct?

 

No idea, I can't see any reason either which way. And It is not my problem anyway! That should be taken up with JT/SHG

 

That is not correct, this is the quote from SHG.

Finger's crossed it will be added later.

 

And good luck with modelling any sort of plausible representation of the route from Preston to Carlisle. I doubt even Pete Waterman could manage that!

 

Plus the model railway comparison is not on an equitable basis.
To run TSW you also need a decent gaming PC and monitor which is going to cost upwards of £1k.
If on console you’re going to need a PS5 or XBox plus a decent TV to play it on so again, upwards of £1k.
A model railway provides a tactile and three dimensional experience that watching a bunch of 2D pixels generated by a bunch of 1’s and 0’s is never going to come close to emulating.
Most model railway stuff keeps or even accumulates in value. Once you install a software add on and play beyond any refund window, it has no resale ability.
And if I got up what I have spent on train sim software alone over the last 25 - 30 years, the total is probably eye watering!

 

And you would probably be able to afford a model railway with that money you spent on Various Train Sim DLC

Hentis

 

But then comes the other hurdles. Declining eyesight and manual dexterity as age advances and my carpentry skills were never that good. I need to replace the beading and sills on our self built (by previous owners) wood frame conservatory and bricking it.

 

Are you high or something?, because a tv to play console games ain’t no where near 1k, at most you only need like 700, 500 console and 200 tv but if you’re like most gamers you already have the tv meaning it’s only the console price

 

You can pick up a 50hz 4k TV for pennies. If you want one with a high refresh rate for gaming then £200 ain't gonna get you much.

 

Well I must be definitely high as my 65inch 4k TV was 1400 quid and then the xbone series x was nearly 500 quid, so that's nearly 2k straight away.....

 

Mine literally only costed 200 and runs everything perfectly fine, why is high refresh rate even important for a train sim, like isn’t it only important for shooter games,

I mean it’s probably more important for pc than my Xbox

 

Well yeah if you only play tsw then why bother wasting your money on high refresh rates.
I'm guessing most people play more than just tsw though.

Then I guess instead of wasting money on a ps5 or one x you could buy a 8th gen console, if high refresh rates ain't your thing.

 

Not last time I checked! Our 4K 65” LG TV cost well over £1k and that was over 5 years ago. Yes you can probably get cheaper but then you also get what you pay for. And I must add, TSW5 on the PS5 on that screen is superlative, though I still primarily enjoy my gaming on the PC.

 

Well I guess we're looking at a July/August release now.

 

As I have feet in both worlds eyewatering is correct, although these days as I have mostly what I want in both worlds the outgoings reduce. I still only buy on sale in both formats so it takes a special release to get day one money. Revolutions 314 unit is one such release and as for Train Sim I think me and TSW are separated heading for divorce such is the pace and quality of releases. TSC has my time back as the massive amount of DLC I own means its feels the most fulfilling.

 

Here is another quote from SHG that states JT said no.

 

Said no to a different question!

That question is Can CL4 be added to the base WCML - the respone in that case evidently being No.

The other question however from the earlier post I'm not aware of any public response, that being can the 86 be added to CL4 timetable.

 

My PC is 4 years old and runs TSW (and Flight Sim 2020) absolutely fine and you could buy what I have for under £500 now. Naturally my next gaming PC will cost over £1k because I like to "future-proof" myself for at least 5 years.

I totally get the tactile thing, you don't get to put your favourite local on a shelf (A two-tone green Deltic in case anyone is interested) and pick it up and marvel at it and my collection of locos and coaches are worth more that their purchase price but due to advances in model railway technology my 35-45 year old collection isn't worth enough for me to cash in yet. My grandad gave me a huge collection of stamps and coins in the 80s and said "that'll pay off your mortgage one day" but the market there has collapsed.

Compare that with my football shirt collection, some of the rarer tops I have are now worth 10 times their purchase price. I calculated that my kit collection is actually appreciating in value more quickly than my pensions.

PC games are sunk costs but I prefer having a choice of routes to suit whatever mood I'm in, which isn't an option unless you own multiple model railway layouts.

Each to their own obviously but I do think PC train sims provide me with far more entertainment than my old oo gauge model railway, so I take that hit on it having no resale value.

 

That’s the thing I don’t have a mass tv, I only need one to fit in my room, anyways after 7 long years my tv finally killed itself with massive random white pixel lines oh well…

 

I think after Alan Thompson route coming out the class 86 will be coming just a guess but here's hoping

 

Wasn't 84/85 around the time of the remodelling of Crewe? Might explain why the timetable looks a bit odd with Runcorn stoppers going fast through Crewe. It could be that the stars of the show for something like Birmingham to Preston could be Class 304s and 310s (with original wrap-around windscreens and the bizarre half-a-unit gangway access).

As far north as Crewe anyway. Then it's back to 101s, Pacers, 86s and 87s up to Preston.

 

This brings me back to your comment you made before about not playing many games on your Xbox. A more expensive tv with VRR, 120HZ & FPS, Picture enhancement settings would probably be wasted on you if you only play TSW.
High refresh rate is a must for any gamer though if you play multiple games on through the year.
Take Death Stranding 2 for example, a game I’m very much looking forward to. I couldn’t imagine playing a game of this calibur on a sub-par tv.

 

It’s actually more simple than that. All trains have to stop at Runcorn. I believe it is stipulated in an Act of Parliament from way back when the station was opened back when the line was built. Something to do with permission to build a whopping great bridge over the Mersey in the town and therefore the railway must always benefit local people. So for as long as I have known and for much longer before that, no trains pass through Runcorn, they all stop, local trains and express trains alike.

I have tried doing a Google search for more info (and some further reading for anyone interested) on exactly why this is the case but Google AI insists I am wrong about all trains having to stop there. I don’t know why it gives false info but it is very insistent that some trains don’t stop there and waffles on with reasons why a train might not stop there, all incorrect assumptions, and zero facts. The normal Google results (and other search engines) just assume I’m looking for train times so no joy there I’m afraid, so you’re just going to have to take my word for it, trains must stop at Runcorn even if doing so is inconvenient to the TOC. They have no choice.

Maybe someone else can expand on this. (Apologies if this thread is getting further off topic).

 

Is multi working through coaches going to work if so will it work with the likes of 37s 20s 33s 31s?

 

None of those. All those diesels are fitted with the Blue Star multiple working standard. 86s and 87s operate on either a proprietary within class only control jumper or TDM via the RCH cables. TDM was used mainly starting in the late 1980s when DVTs first started showing up on the WCML and DBSOs on the GEML. The 87s in TSW oddly have the RCH jumpers fitted but TDM isn’t simulated, only the driver-guard buzzer is.

 

The TDM equipment came later around 90-91, the RCH cables were originally added for Driver to Guard communication with a ripper unit which is the state the 87 is in game. When the loco was equiped with TDM it was usually indicated with this symbol on or near the holder

 

Hey look its the TSW barber pole

 

Release 15th of July

 

Awesome news. Day One purchase.

To slightly misquote Ash from Alien, “Buy Class 86 DLC. Priority One. All other DLC’s rescinded. Steam Wallet funds spendable!”

 

Can't wait, take my money!
At least it also now stops some of the daft conspiracy theories about holding back for a route or TSW6...

 

So how many buffet cars are you having in your first consist Vern?

To be fair given how DTG have been in the past, it is justifiable to believe they were holding back for something like TSW6

 

All of them!

And yes I am not in the slightest bit repentant for trying to get to the bottom of what was a somewhat odd and unusual situation of announcing a release then... nothing.

 

Yes, it was very odd. Obviously, something was discovered at the last minute and the release date was pushed back. Announced as " coming soon " on May 13th and only released July 15th, 2 months later, makes no sense. What harm would an explanation do?

A little transparency goes a long way, but it's not DTG's forte.

 

Seeing as we have a date going to give the 86 pack a chance. Reinstalling over the weekend. Always really liked the Shap route despite TSWs shortcomings. Don't let me down JT.

 

Very encouraged watching tonight's stream of this. Definite day one purchase !

 

Agreed. I had already decided it was a Day 1 when it was announced but I still watched the stream and enjoyed it immensely.

 

Slightly disappointed in all honesty. Only one variant of the class 86 - the /2 - and the mk2f’s which are new to the game. As I already have the route and the 87 I’m conflicted as to whether to get it day one or not as there is no compelling reason in my opinion really…same same with a different train.