There are a number of excellent German freeware routes around but they all use signals that are unfamiliar to me. They display every colour you can think of and I don't know which aspect is relevant for which situation. Can anyone help please?
From your pictures this would appear to be the Hl System - https://www.sh1.org/eisenbahn/shhl.htm mainly in use in Eastern Germany and some other European countries Then there is the Hp system - https://www.sh1.org/eisenbahn/shhp.htm The main usage was and is West German routes The newer Ks signals will replace the older Hl and Hp systems - https://www.sh1.org/eisenbahn/shks.htm
I wonder why the German person who wrote the webpage got the name wrong? https://www.sh1.org/index.htm The Stop Signal is a Hp - maybe that is why he called it that?
No idea how he got that wrong. Who knows…. The main signal aspects in the HV system are called Hp0 (stop) Hp1 (proceed at line speed) Hp2 (proceed at limited speed, 40km/h if nothing else is indicated) The distant signals (Vorsignale) are Vr0, Vr1 and Vr2. Same as the above only with “expect” in front. Likewise the aspects of the KS (Kombinationsignale) system. Ks0, Ks1 and Ks2. The HL system have a LOT of possible aspects. Like 11 or 12, can’t remember offhand. It has one perculiarity that’s worth knowing. There is actually NO aspect for proceed. Whereas green always mean “pass” in western european signalisation, in the HL system it always neans that the next signal is “at least” a yellow. You can happily ride a tsc route with HL signals without knowing this little “difference in definitions” but it us actually worth knowing. Green does not mean pass. Fun thing, eh….
Most European Signalling seems over complicated because it is speed based. UK Signalling is so much easier as the Signal informs the driver which route he will take at the next junction and lets the driver reduce the speed as required. A German route I was driving had the Signal before a through station tell me to reduce to 40kph as the train went in to a loop But the Signal was a least 1 km before the points and had an 100kph crossing to change from Track 1 to 2 before the 40kph
But it is correct by German Signalling Rules - AFAIK If the train goes thru a Junction the indication on the Signal before will be for the slowest route being taken
I hope we are not getting into one-up-manship posting here. I am only answering questions (and mis-conceptions) about German signalling. Could be great if this didn’t get into my sword is bigger than yours territory. Don’t trust German TSC routes to fully reflect reality! Particularly those that don’t use Schuster signalscripts. That’s why i pointed to shoddy route building. Anyway, the point about points: The Germans have Zusatssignale (Zs3) so they can route with any speed through points if they are built for higher speeds. These are sadly often wrongly implemented in tsc, particularly routes that use Kuju signals, which is one of the reasons you get situations like the one you described. Another reason is wrongly placed station entrance signals, the lack of intermediate blocksignals within stations (so you can give trains a new speed after a set of points) etc etc…. It’s playable but often not correct. You can ask yourself if German (or even european) signalling really is inefficient in real life? Probably not. Probably every countrys signal system reflects the needs and safety concerns that country has empirically built up the last 150ish years. Not better or worse, but with it’s own set of strenghts. Speed signalling. When used correctly (which it will be in real life) is there to keep the trains going as plentiful, fast and efficient as possible. Just as route signalling is.
I was not trying to get in to a posting match. And the route I noticed the Signalling with was not a DTG one. So I'm unsure in how a route would be signalled You are at the last signal before a Station with two through lines with a loop around the island platform and then three more goods loops The speed on the lines 1 & 2 is line speed at 140kph and there are crossovers either end line1 to line 2 and v.v at 80kph The Signal before the station would signal to all tracks - 1 > 1 at 140kph, 1 > 2 or 3 (Platform Loop) at 80 kph.and 1 > 2 > Goods Loops which is 40kpm. So the Signal shows the Maximum Speed thru the Slowest Points - 40kph The point I was trying to make is you have to run a 40kph even though the line speed is 80kph at the crossing. Instead of going over the first crossing at up to 80kph whilst slowing for the 40kph in to the loop.
Ahh yes, that is where the zs3 signal would be applied. If it is on it will display an “8” and you can pass with 80km/h if not on it’s 40 km/h. Modern zs3 signals are lightsignals and can display any number.
So the zs3 would display an 8 for 80kmh even though the driver will drive over a 40kmh before the next signal?
No, in that case i must have misunderstood you. I think i need a drawing of the track layout to get what you are saying.
Not the best The train is approaching on the Right Hand track bottom of the picture It crosses first to the left line thru an 80kph crossing then thru a 40kph on to one of the yellow yard tracks The signal is before the first crossing and then at the far end of the station to exit.
That first point is indeed unusually far away from the rest of the station. I wonder if the real world version is like that? What route/station is this?
Never tried any of the eastern european routes. However, afaik, the HL system was not too dissimilar to other eastern block systems. It was their way of (sort of) integrating the east block railway systems, and unifying some of the manufactoring of railway tech so it could be used across all east block countries. I can however easily imagine east block being far behind in efficiency in comparison to west block. The HL system is an east block invention and nothing like the west german Hv or even the Ks system. They are worlds apart in conceptions, though the Ks system did take a few pointers from the HL systems. The Ks system is quite brilliant in it’s simplicity. Unfortunately, again, the Kuju ks signals gets speed signalling wrong.
