[fw] Rhein-niers-bahn: Duisburg - M-gladbach Discussions Thread

I can imagine just as well the company may not give a LOVE or straight up say no. Why risk your image for a game, when their business is transport?
Really, the livery designer is so powerful that this is a rather minor problem.

If anything what they also seem to be rather lethargic at (minus TSG) is giving us alternate liveries that use the same licenses but from alternate times/places.

 

If it's a protected trademark, it has a recorded license owner, if it's not, then it's even easier.

 

I believe the problem with public transport in Germany is that you have a lot of stakeholder and the state is always involved. DTG have apparently made experience in trying to get hold of a license for the RRX (judging by what can be read here in the forums) and I am pretty sure that most of the other „coloured trains“ (that are not cargo) will have similar hurdles to overcome.

I am simply having a hard time in believing it’s as simply as „calling the company to buy the license“. I see those comments all the time but never see any proof that this is actually the case. I was hoping locobilly actually knows more than I do and would provide some evidence to his claim…

 

@locobilly
If it's so easy to get a licence, then get one yourself.

And who is supposed to pay for this licence, which can sometimes be very expensive?
You're making it sound too easy.

Otherwise, you can prove us wrong.

 

im sure if a license could be obtained by DTG they would have done it just like they have with numerous others.

Sometimes license holders have no wish to negotiate and no amount of throwing money at them is going to change that fact

 

In Germany, regions do have public transport federations (verkehrsverbund or something like that). There are some in game, like the ones from Dresden and Frankfurt. The trains itself are operated by different companies, so if you want to do it correctly, you need a license from the federation and the transport company.

When licensing is becoming to difficult, maybe it's time to have more fictive liveries, like correct collors but without logos. Just having older and/or DB only routes, is becoming quite boring. Rivet did something like that with Island Line 2022, and having this is better then having nothing. While I'm prefering to drive on German routes, I almost completely lost my interest in the newer ones, because of the same rolling stock over and over again. But even more modern DB trains are missing, new IC dosto or the new dosto on Main Spessart Bahn. DTG can do a remake of Main Spessart Bahn for example, but there are also still DB operated (branche) lines nowadays, even scenic ones. It looks like, almost all routes has to be around the bigger cities and with the same rolling stock.

 

The Main-Spessart route is locked into 2016-17, when the Rampe and Heigenbrucken were still in use before the new tunnel bypassed them.

 

Correct, so it has to be a remake to include the tunnel. But a longer new route on this line would be nice.

 

They said in a Q & A that they were not interested in creating routes with unbranded stock. (Only secondary or AI trains would be considered.) Not the main trains of the route.

 

Well, that sounds not very hopefull, so we're stuck on the usual red DB stuff then. On the GWE remaster, there will be unbranded stuff, so why not on the German routes?

 

No, that's not the case. All I said is that they weren't interested in any unbranded stock (that was significant) to new routes. That doesn't mean we won't get new liveries. I'd say the team who acquires liscences try hard to get them. Never say never to non DB trains

 

Because they aren't main parts of the route. It's just AI traffic

 

They have said doing unbranded liveries for AI stock or secondary stock was something they will continue doing. Just the main part of the routes will have liscences. They said that player feedback has told them unbranded liveries are not welcome (think about the LNWR situation)

 

Oh, really?

Then why is a Czech route DLC being released, and as has been said so far, without licences from the real Czech railway?

 

DTG aren't making that route.

 

It doesn't matter who builds the track. If DTG says they don't want tracks without licences, then that also applies to other tracks.

Because if DTG says that users who play TSW don't like tracks that don't have licences, then users shouldn't like the Czech track either, as it doesn't have a licence.

 

I feel the liscence there doesn't have a great significance in comparison to others. These are DTGs words not mine. No need to be so passive aggressive.

 

From all announced routes, the Czech route is for me the most interesting one, even without license. I also don't see why in this case, not having a license is less important then other routes. I really like to see new German rolling stock, even without license, as my interest in the German routes and the game itself is decreasing because of the unrealistic modern rail scene in game.

 

That's just what they said in the Q & A. According to overall feedback. Unlicensed trains are not well received. Same with incorrect liveries.

 

Personally, I am not interested in fictitious routes, fictitious rolling stock, fictitious railway companies or similar solutions.

 

I was talking about real routes, real tolling stock and even right collors, but without the logo. But everywhere DB stuff, even on routes or services where they don't run anymore, is fine?

 

This feels like a bit of a stretch, given that WCMLS class 350 is unbranded as are all the stations in that route.

DTG seem to maintain this ‘no unbranded stock line’ right up to the point it doesn’t suit their direction at which point it is dropped and unbranded becomes perfectly acceptable.

Personally unbranded trains would be preferable to the sea of red we see on German content.

 

The 350 and all of the stations were originally branded until a liscence misunderstanding. That was a different situation really.

 

To add a example how it can be done, Rivets Island Line 2022. For me it's fine how they did it, ofcourse I prefer to see the official branding, but when impossible, this is better then nothing.

An easy example of what I like to see, is a route with the BR612 in white and yellow bwegt livery. The BR612 is under used anyway, but I would accept it when the the train is only white and yellow without logo. But the BR642 has already a bwegt logo with the lion, so how hard can/will it be to to get a license for the white yellow one?

I can't remember how they asked this in a survey, but the outcome of a question like this is very depending on how you ask it.

 

Five authorities are involved in the implementation of the RRX: the Rhine-Ruhr Transport Association (VRR), go.Rhineland and the Westphalia-Lippe Local Transport Association (NWL) for North Rhine-Westphalia as well as the Rhineland-Palatinate North Local Rail Transport Association (SPNV-Nord) and the North Hessian Transport Association (NVV). Together, under the supervision of the state of North Rhine-Westphalia, they have been responsible for the Europe-wide procurement procedures for the procurement and maintenance of RRX trains and for the operation of the future RRX lines and are taking on the central role in the operational implementation of the project. VRR, NWL, go.Rheinland and SPNV-Nord also own the RRX vehicles.

National Express Rail GmbH currently operates all lines in RRX pre-service operation. Since the RRX vehicles began operating, the railway company has been responsible for the RE 4, RE 5 (RRX), and RE 6 (RRX) lines. On February 1, 2022, National Express also took over the two lines RE 1 (RRX) and RE 11 (RRX) from Abellio. (source: https://www.vrr.de/der-vrr/spnv-aufgabentraegerschaft/rhein-ruhr-express-rrx/)

Maybe it's hard to obtain a license, however there are model trains in this livery, so maybe it's not impossible. But when impossible to obatain a license, unbranded trains are the only possibility to get those trains in game and I prefer this over only DB red stuff.

 

Pft, even so, while we have a livery designer available to make our own liveries for what DTG would deliver as DB only stock, why are we missing so much (even DB red) stock anyway? Where's the flirt (2 in DB livery, and 3 at all)? Where's the Desiro ML or HC? The Mireo? The diesel Talent 1? The 1440? The 440? Any Lint? (Or, God forbid, the Integral, but despite sucking absolute ass it is on its way to be retired and this would be a great moment to digitally preserve it. That and I don't know if it was ever DB....)
I won't fault the small third party team about to make this route as their first TSW effort, but routes in NRW without these feel wrong

 

That is good. Unbranded stuff reduces realism.

 

Really nice and for the route can the DB Baureihe 247/248 159s fit here

 

This would be a nice opportunity for DTG to spruce up the 642 and sort out the sluggish performance, but I'm sure they won't.

 

The real 642 is sluggish.

 

Yes, but there is no way it is as sluggish as represented in game.

 

Is it as sluggish in real life?

 

So is DB red only on a todays German routes.