Wcml Preston To Crewe Discussion

Even more so with Cumbrian Coast. In all honesty they shouldn’t even have announced this until C2P is out the door. Though how much of this is down to pressure from DTG to pad the Roadmap, we don’t know.

 

Knowing their eye for detail/realism, I wonder if J.T. considered adding the Class 33 (as AI) at Crewe on Cardiff services ?

 

I presumed this would be imminent with the announcement of Cumbrian Coast.

Would be a good opportunity to rework this in BR Blue.

 

Maybe it was accurate then but things have happened since and it's accurate now!

When you make things timescales slip.

 

And the 37 in BR Blue, and the 31 in RF Grey, y'know, while they have paint open.

 

Yes…it’s a shame that the 31,33 & 45 don’t appear in Livery Designer, there’s a few routes that these would fit nicely into, is it a complicated process to add them ?!?

 

looking between the lines on the latest update it seems the route as a whole is done but the its the TT that's the issue. those freight moves on the MGR seem very complex to get right balance in them for people to play. i mean some of the services i would imagine in one run would be 2 hours plus. do you split them down and detract away from the pit to power station aspect of no stopping or keep them as one long service. it was a very good update on the complex TT that's being done and im sure they will of tried and failed a few time along the way to get the right balance.

also do we know for sure that train faults wont be included in the route now they have come out in TSW 6 that something that may need to be added to all locos and would be another time consuming process

sure its frustrating that we don't seem to be any closer to a release but by heck what a route we are going to have when it dose release.

keep up the good work its going to be worth it.

 

Hopefully they keep all long services, it’s a pain in the butt having to do part services

 

The Crompton really is underused and could do with some love

 

i hope they keep them long but its the latchford bit that intrigues me and how it will work and to how long a full service would be

"These trains, once they arrived in the MSC Sidings at Warrington were faced with an interesting task to reach the line to Fiddlers Ferry Power Station, which goes east to west directly under Warrington Bank Quay station. Whilst some trains saw the locomotive run round in MSC sidings, others saw a pilot attached to the rear for onward haulage for around a mile to Latchford Sidings, where another reversal took place to access Fiddlers Ferry itself. During the mid-1980’s this pilot was occasionally a Class 08 shunter, which was certainly put to the test hauling 45 loaded HAA hoppers and two dead locomotives on the rear, this is the scene we have chosen to portray in some of our operations, though there are a variety which do double run rounds at both MSC Sidings and Latchford, thus adding to timetable complexity!"

thats says to me that there will be
47/3 with a double run round
47/3 with an 08 pilot
TnT 20s
TnT 20s with an 08 pilot
and maybe a single 20 with a double run round

if IRL the local services to Bickershaw and parkside start at warrington and it was a full round trip from there that would include running out, the moves at the colliery, loading, back to warrington do the above shunt. head to fiddlers ferry, unload and back to do the same shunt move before ending up back at warrington. in the case of the yorkshire 47 moves you might end up back at newton le willows. a bloody long run with a good mix of driving.

id also like to see them as a full run rather than many stay in game parts as the first part may be 10-20mins long after the first, old verns save is buggered as it wont record progress something i have fell foul of

 

They will be decent length. This is a great route in terms of variety. The WCML services and the coals weave around each other night and day perfect mix.

 

If already asked sorry does the military and nuclear dlcs layer into this route.

 

AFAIK they are currently working on the TT. Since those DLCs are used in the Preston - Carlisle route, it makes sense they will appear here too unless JT finds it hurts performance too much.

Guess you will get a better answer when JT is closer to finishing the TT.

 

I mean it's been quite a few decades so my memory is extremely fuzzy on this but the Bickershaw run would be 2x top & tailed 20s from Springs branch up to the colliery then back down to the branch, 1 pair of Choppers off there with the other pair to take them to wazza. I think then they did just run around as required.

Looking at how JT implemented the loco swaps from diesel to leccy on the Shap route I expect the diagrams are split into part 1, part 2 etc... so that you can do just the run to Latchford from Wigan, or maybe that you want to just do the 08 piloting etc... I am sure that knowing JT's QT methods this will be the biggest pain in the arse for testing, given how they previously run the TT for days on end having so many "little" moves might start to cause pathing issues and trains backing up...

 

Guess we need a more seamless way of doing multiple services added to TSW7 alongside more seamless route hopping.

 

there are a few moves on the leccy side and a few else where that are not listed in the TT on shap. sure there are some listed as part one part two etc but there are a lot of non listed moves as found here on the list i did.
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet...nZ-E5HLQu18b9Zx4LMVCmY/edit?pli=1&gid=0#gid=0

i do agree that its a pain in the arse for testing and getting the right balance hence the delay. but JT set a bar that other 3PD are now starting to hit. i think and hope that with this route is they set the bar a few notches higher which judging by the updates they are a good way to doing. my only concern is that the whitehaven route may be a bit underwhelming after this. i'm yet to be convinced, but i thought that about BPO and that's what made me swap over from TSC to TSW

 

I'm just excited for the Mk1 RBR. Nice to have another Mk1 ingame. Hopefully another few Mk1 coaches can follow on the future?

 

And why not some nice Mk3 sleepers to drive Carlisle - Crewe (and vice versa) trains uninterrupted !!!

Those could then be modified to feature the Night Riviera on Western routes !

 

damm them sleepers i did the ecs move from upperby to preston and got looped at shap. had to follow one forgetting that they are timed at 80mph not 110mph. yellows all the way to preston.

 

Yes, please! I really don't want to get that railtour pack, as I know JT can do Mk1s so much better.

 

I agree on all points there mate, I do think that given the nature of the workings they may not "hide" as many short bits of diagrams like they did for Shap as someone loading up the TT for 20s would be expecting that vs someone trying to sift through 86 & 87s to find an appropriate high speed run - though thinking back it was more to declutter it. We will have to wait and see on that one I guess.

As much as I have faith in JT and that the Whitehaven route will be excellent, I do also have some fears that it might be somewhat underwhelming as even with 1980s levels of activity towards Workington it isn't going to be as busy as we expect/wish for. Honestly though I think JT are throwing us a bit of a curveball and that there is a second route in the works which hasn't been announced yet, something that will of course utilise the 108 and most probably all of the other traction they have developed - I'm not saying what route as I obviously don't know, I just believe that Whitehaven is to "give us something" while they cook up something truly spectacular, especially if DTG were pressuring them into making some announcement for their end of year posts.

I mean think about it, Preston/Wigan/Crewe is in QT so it's just timetabling now, no modelling or route building is required, those guys will be on Whitehaven, but Whitehaven is an order of magnitude shorter than Shap or PWC, it's also less "detailed" as there are not many built up areas along the way nor very demanding in terms of trackwork. The route building team could fairly quickly get that polished off and move on to something else. The timetables are not going to be anywhere near as intensive as the other routes either. As for the vehicles, well obviously there is the 108 but one has to wonder is that all? Are they going to sort a new 37, with the steelworks at Workington they will need to make appropriate wagons at least.

Say we get PWC in March, Whitehaven could drop in August and the third route could come around December/January for TSW7. It all depends on how big the dev team is, if it's several teams then great, if it is just a few guys who do numerous roles then just forget the past two paragraphs...

 

Ah man I bought that pack and it's terrible. I don't understand how they managed to introduce bugs into a product that was actually fine as it originally was (looking at the 45 and Mk1 BG).

 

We desperately need a new class 37. Considering the amount of routes and eras it can run across, it’s unfathomable DTG or a 3rd party hasn’t looked at introducing one. Same goes for the 56 really, it’s so frustrating TSC is way ahead of the game in this aspect, and it’s 20+ years old!

 

Not forgetting a Class 25

 

Probably the most popular era spanning diesel both for BR times and current day ops and has 3 versions in the sim. Out of dozens.

 

As much as I love JTs stuff, one thing I don’t think they’re doing quite right is how their locos are modelled. Considering their stuff is in the late 80’s getting on 90’s, they need to get them looking more…decrepit.

The BR stuff they’ve done has been great but they’re really missing the level of neglect the later years of that era suffered. Especially now they’re getting deep into the NorthWest.

 

The weathered 87 looks quite tatty.

 

I've probably driven that loco more than any other 87, Love it.

 

The new 47 looked pretty good from the screenshots IIRC looked much better. Although I'm unsure if they're governed by licenses etc and the conditions as sometimes licences do dictate how the locomotive can be shown and represented in game.

Although it would be nice to get more used and abused stock!

 

Like Mk1s in the 80s after a "football special"...

 

Plus one for the Sleepers. There is stacks of trains they worked in the period and only one type of coach. Really dont get why they are not done?

 

I agree and surely they are the easiest to model, the interior would just be the vestibules and a corridor, the rooms can all be "locked".

 

Why my mum and dad never let me travel to away games to watch Everton

 

Agree with this. Huge omission from all the night trains.

 

Better that than nothing, but would be nice if you could lie down tho, turn on the different lights, etc.
In this regard, TSC MaxTracks Mk5s had interesting passenger views.

 

All with the same sound pack, which is underwhelming at best.

 

We do have three of them already. It’s not like there aren’t any. There could always be more though. As you allude to, they have been around forever and are still going.

 

TS lacked a nicely done Class 47.
It was a good thing to quickly introduce one in TSW.
Now we need a 37 that is on par with the AP one.

 

My brain would explode if we got an insane study level 37 like the AP one.

 

Nobody seems motivated to produce one. Without doubt it would sell but devs seem to stick with multiple units although its good to see the 70 appear which acknowledges more than just 66s operate in the UK at present.

 

Wouldn't surprise me if jt got round to revamping the 37 eventually

 

It’s the sounds and exhaust dynamics I’m mainly referring to. As others have mentioned, an Armstrong Powerhouse version would genuinely take TSW to another level for me.

 

AP havent so far produced anything for TSW.

 

A large logo 37/4 would be nice.

 

They produced the sounds for both the class 31 and 87. That’s before checking what else they have been involved in.

 

The AP sound sets/recordings were given to the teams that use them but the individual Devs on the teams still have to mix and use them etc I think. AP hasn't produced anything for TSW as far as I was aware?

 

Yes. IIRC Richard has no interest in developing for TSW.

 

Indeed & that’s what I’d like to see as more of a standard, rather than unique.

Anything still in BR Blue in particular at this point in the 80’s would have been particularly worn.

 

Aware of that but as far as I know they havent fully produced any DLC?

 

Now this bit of industrial details is what gets me excited about the route. As the narrator says "it's not just a passenger route with a few freight runs thrown in."