West Coast Main Line: Trent Valley From All Aboard Studios

Because every year inflation goes up everywhere?
If food, gas and rent goes up, why wouldn't video games?
The biggest cost is people and people need food, gas and rent.

 

How dare you bring economic reality into this discussion! Don't you know that TSW DLC exist in their own little economic bubble and must never go up in price?

 

that doesn’t mean tsw dlc should increase at the rate it has been- look at NY stamford, half reused and costs the so-called ‘premium price’

 

Can say I'm looking forward to this, I do hope the bugs are a minimum though.

 

When was the last time DTG had increased the addon prices? So not 1 addon but overall as a standard price?

 

Who said this was a premium price? Perhaps this will become the base price going forward.

 

It's not half reused. Did you watch the streams on it and listen to the devs?
They said they had to recreate it.
If you don't like the price, wait for a sale or don't play it.
I have a lot of DLCs on the wish list waiting on sales because I think they're overpriced normally.
No one is putting a gun to your head to buy any video game.

 

It’s all gut‑feeling chatter what they do. You can’t just throw things on the table without actually knowing the facts. That’s why I asked when the last real price increase was but of course it stayed quiet, because then you’d have to admit that it’s actually not bad at all.

 

I blame the hippies and turtle necks blowing their vape smoke into the atmosphere. No wonder we get hail stones in June.

 

Best way to protest don’t buy it
Eventually DTG sales figures will indicate they’re being too greedy with their prices and they’ll lower them.

In general if a sale price is at its lowest, it should stay at its lowest and not increase.

I own about 95% of all content on PS5, but I was looking to add a few UK routes to my steam collection, as I dabble from time to time on PC. Terrible sale prices as per usual. I hope the next one is better.

 

I’ll say this, when it comes to actual route building AABS are a top studio the quality of b2b was amazing, however it could’ve been better optimised. That’s imo what stops it from being the best British route in TSW

 

With no hate but...
This is the average complainer in a nutshell… Always whining and complaining, yet owning practically everything. DTG knows this is how it works, so the sales numbers don’t change at all. So the complaining is mostly symbolic so far. (And it will stay that way for sure)

 

I can confirm that! Im on pc so it's not that I experience big issues but the route looks amazing. Can not wait to spend my money on it.

 

Yes, this in a nutshell.

The vociferous complainers keep buying DLC and then complaining more.

 

And then when you point this out to them they reply things like "well if you don't buy the DLC they'll go out of business". No they won't, they'll improve the product to make sure it sells, just like any other business would.

JB

 

I too fall into this category, but as a buyer of dlc and supporter of a company I expect some special treatment from them, from time to time. After all the money I’ve spent on this franchise I expect a gold bullion mailed to me with my name on it.

 

I respect your opinion. I will say though complaining helps, as otherwise a company won’t take notice or change their ways. Some people see complaining as a negative, I see it as a positive. “The customer is always right” and that’s how it should be. Without us they are nothing. There might be a lot of property owners in the comment section who don’t share or value that statement though since they’ve experienced a lot of harsh circumstances or refunds in their lifetime.

 

I have become much more discerning about what I buy.
Didn’t get North London Line, though I might once the extension gets released.
Didn’t buy MIA and having seen the laughable attempt to fix the track clearance issue via a Hornby 2nd radius curve in a recent TSS stream, don’t think I ever will be.
Didn’t buy Wonders Of Sodor which to all intents and purposes is a TSW add on outside of TSW.
Didn’t buy the 145 Pro or the 147.
Didn’t buy the Class 90.
Didn’t buy the NEC Stamford route.

Unlikely to Day One the Trent Valley route either, partly because I have a suspicion it’s a bit rushed behind B2C and partly because it’s probably going to coincide with the release of Running Train. In fact, the only DLC I might get on Day One is Preston to Crewe but even that’s not a dead cert.

 

DTG doesn't set prices on third party content. The creators set prices, ideally based on what their costs are. Again, pushing everything onto DTG as one easy target misses the mark and is counterproductive. It's easy to just blame the distributor, but with third parties that just absolves the creators of responsibility which defeats the purpose.
Criticism of price or content should be direct at those who created it to be the most effective. Likewise, praise and suggestions should go to those responsible as well.

 

The pricing for all the routes, rolling stock and scenario packs is pretty much always the same, barring a handful of exceptions. Do you think all of the third-party developers coincidentally choose the same prices as DTG? Do you also think a third-party can decide to sell their new route for £100 and DTG will just accept it, spend money on QA, marketing and previews and then list in on the store for that price knowing it won't sell?

Pricing policies and ultimately which content gets made are decided by DTG. If their TSW business plan for 2027 features a Class 91 pack that they want to sell for £29.99 and you turn up telling them you're halfway through making a Class 91 pack that you want to sell for £25.99, you can be sure your pack will never be published on the stores and that the developer agreement prevents you from publishing it anywhere else.

JB

 

£100 gets us QA?

 

QA for Questionably Acceptable. It's a bit sad that it's becoming a running joke though, as I want to support creators but I'm not prepared to part with money until I know the product is fit for purpose. And even then I feel I'm keeping my wallet firmly closed as a sort of "ransom" while I wait to see if DTG are going to fix my past purchases.

I can't think of any other product, digital or physical, for which I find myself having to do this...

JB

 

I'd pay good money for something truely amazing. I'd pay £20k for the right 90% of the UK rail network + stock modelled for sure, i.e. leaving behind whatever the hardest 10% is without screwing the other 90%. I imagine a lot of us would (even if not up front, spread out over a few years by some kinda credit agreement).

I do wonder if anyone has the balls to try this.

(Sober me has the right to retract the above claim)

 

All we need is a rich bachelorette that likes throwing money around. Can’t be too difficult…

 

I'd pay £150 for a portion of the country, the whole of Scotrail, South Eastern or Greater Anglia.

£20K though, no. I've never spent that much on a car let alone a computer game.

 

Same here even if it was all of the UK covering every era of the last 100 years with most of the stock used i wouldn't pay that much. I think it would cost a lot nore than that anyway.

The most expensive car I bought was £3000 and that was nearly 30 years ago!

 

Yet we get less stuff per route now and they cost more which is the problem

 

You are posting this in the thread for the longest ever UK route and one of the longest routes in TSW. The price of a route DLC (adjusted for UK inflation) is the same now as it was in 2020. £25 then is around £32.50 now.

 

An people also need to understand that when pricing goes up irrespective of inflation etc, they very rarely come back down to where it initially started from. only thing that brings prices down is competition and aint much in the train sim game!

 

Was replying to a dude which was using it as a point for all content

anyways I don’t care about the price of this, Preston to Carlisle will still be better value for money

 

Or "Deflation". Though that's a rare occurrence. But generally, yes, when the price of basic needs, rent, utilities and rates go up, so salaries go up, so costs of running a business go up, squeezing profit margins, then product price goes up.

In 1991 my brand new car cost £6,500, it cost £18 to fill-up the tank, it cost £10 to see the Manic Street Preachers in London, £8 to get into a game at Arsenal, computer games were £10-£15 and my home in East London was worth £95,000 which was really expensive, 8 times my then annual salary of £12,000. Then inflation kept happening. Except music compact discs, they're still about £12.

 

The other side of the coin is that entertainment software is not necessarily subject to the whims of inflation. A DVD, Blu-ray or 4K disc broadly costs what it did 10 years ago and you are more likely to find older releases at a permanently lower price, unlike ancient TSW content.

 

Yes. Most things in the grocery store are around the same price point because that's what people want to spend. Companies that go too far above don't get bought and go broke and those that go too low can't pay their bills and go broke. That's how economics works.

I think it's no more complicated than the creators looking at the store and saying "well everyone else is selling for this... sell for that."

 

In software it's the office rent, other overheads and the salaries of those who create the software that go up though, rather than the cost of materials (especially in this newfangled digital age)

JB

 

Do you mean discs themselves or content? Automated factories are making physical products much cheaper in some cases... however, movies are NOT cheaper these days. Have you been to the movies lately? For video games it's not the cost of the "media" (since there is none for downloadable games) but down to how much it costs for payroll. Beyond office space or a few computers, that's pretty much your only major expense. It's often over 80% of the cost of a software company.

 

You really think you are getting "less" in a TSW route now (especially this one) than you were in 2020?
Longest route ever in TSW, two new trains, huge timetable, and every update and add on since 2020 (train announcements, physics, updated passengers, etc) and you still want to say you have "less" than you did?

Even just using the unrealistically low gov't figures, that means all else being the same you SHOULD be seeing 30% higher price just because the value of money is lower from massive currency printing.

So that $29.99 should be at least $39.99 just from sheer money inflation, let alone extra features packed into every route and increased detail of the assets themselves or more content (timetables are just plain bigger)

 

Been a few years since we went to the cinema. Not necessarily the cost, but just because there isn’t much of interest - reboots, remakes or comic book adaptations.

 

What are the the two new trains?

 

The 350/4 and the 807. But I wouldn’t call them new trains. Just a different version of the other 350s and a 7 coach version of the 805 without the diesel engines

 

It's such a niche market now that pricing is no longer market-based. I can't remember the last time I bought discs, I don't see them for sale (except for console games), and I can't even imagine playing a disc, since there's simply no room for it in modern technology.

 

More? Oh please having a reskin/ barely different sub class aka 350

and the 807 which is no different from any other 800 family

compare to quite few tsw 2/ 2020 routes which would give you two completely brand new trains and quite a bit of new rolling stock to the game

Length isn’t anything without interesting trains which effects most routes

also for the same price you get west coast main line Preston to Carlisle with 90 miles and 4 trains by default

 

I don't have insider info or anything but I am expecting £32.99 for this route. it's 108 miles after all

 

ignoring the fact that three of those trains are reused? preston carlisle undoubtedly gives you a bigger stock offering but it’s unfair to argue that TVL will have reused stock, then point to another route which itself has a mostly recycled roster

 

Preston-Carlisle had one new train, not four

 

Said stock was heavy remade and got new sounds and the best part actual liveries and not some fake bs version (I think that was a few of their sub classes)

 

Didn’t say new at that point did I?
But still you get more trains than this route

also you could technically count all the types of class 08, I’m not including it but there’s like 5

 

this is true, but the same could be said for the 350 and 807 to an extent. technically no AT300 is 100% reused, they all differ slightly. the 350s were also reworked for birmingham crewe

 

I suppose hardware costs too - data centres causing prices of computer parts to go up massively, so CPUs, memory, GPUs, storage etc. all costing much more than they used to. I would assume DTG use relatively high spec hardware to develop the game

 

I have made this point on the forum many times, even back in TSW2020/TSW2 days, that the routes that come with more than one new train are generally only the first route of their type in the game but the standard is always just one new train per route for subsequent routes of the same type.

The first UK route came with three new trains. The first vintage BR UK route came with three new trains, the first steam route came with two new locos etc. The same thing happened with German routes and US routes. It still happens now, with the first Dutch route coming with two new trains, the first Czech route etc. It always reverted to just one new train and maybe a reworked train from other routes, plus loco DLC and layers from previously owned content. That’s generally how it is in TSW and has been from the start.

Even with TSW2 Rush Hour release bundle in 2021 there were only two new trains across three routes, the MBTA train and the 387, although that was really just a (big) reworking of the 377. All other trains included in Rush Hour were reused. The Dresden route got no new trains at all. Some trains had some updates. This is all DTG content but third party developers are generally following the same path but with some putting extra value into their reused trains like all the variants and upgrades JT do to any older content included in their routes.

I’ve had to point this out a few times because people started saying “we used to get two trains as standard now it’s only one” a long time ago when one new train was always the standard. Those ‘firsts’ couldn’t really be released with one train/loco and that’s why they got more, the only reason they got more. Reusing trains in future routes is nearly always in the plan as well.

So to conclude, routes coming with only one completely new train is not new, it’s been around since the second route of any type came to TSW and is the norm. It’s understandable with the amount of work involved in making a train for TSW. It’s also why we don’t get multiple train packs like in TSC.

The question of value is an interesting one because I think JT do give the best value in their content because of all the updates and variants they do with reused stock, and because I play their routes more often than any other routes I get even more value out of them but that bit is value that is personal to me. This route looks to have good intrinsic value as well but I wouldn’t play it as often as Shap.

Apologies for longer post but it’s important to present the facts properly and not just as soundbites in an argument.

 

I appreciate new subclasses, as they're nice to have, and I also get that they aren't "just reskins". But I'd never say they're new trains, in the same way that something like a class 730 would be.