Problems Of Ice3 That I Found

Discussion in 'TSW General Discussion' started by jingyu.park, Aug 22, 2020.

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  1. jingyu.park

    jingyu.park New Member

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    (1) The color of the train surface texture varies greatly depending on the angle of sunlight.

    (2) AI ICE3 runs with the passenger lights off. This phenomenon is even more strange at night. Since the passenger light is off by default, the light on the AI ICE3 train seems to be off.
    *AI train: a computer-controlled train

    (3) Some AI ICE3 trains do not have a driver character in the leading cab. However, the train can be operated (may be moving) even though there is no driver.

    Please share problems of ICE3 that you found.
     
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  2. ProfCreeptonius

    ProfCreeptonius Well-Known Member

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    Here is what I found thus far:

    1. Very wonky motion-blur 20200822170759_1.jpg
    look just above the driver's windshield. Also in the cab the edge of the train glitches and flickers very weirdly at high speeds with motion blur.

    2. Windows are extremely dark from the inside - I was on an ICE 3, you can see much more through the passenger windows from the inside
    3. LZB doesn't announce speed increases.
    4. The B-Light doesn't work properly, mentioned already in another post.
    5. AFB works incorrectly - It should hold you at ~2 or 3 kmh BELOW V-soll.
    6. AFB fails to hold you at 120kmh, always preferring 122/123 for some reason.
    7. Without reshade/Engine.ini modifications the dashboard is extremely bright even without a light source shining at it.
    8. The right-hand display does not show the applied brake force, as such it's impossible to check the brake pressure on the ICE3.
    9. The 'Abfertigen' display shows all doors close live except door 14. (Refreshing the screen fixes it).

    My personal wishes for ICE 3:
    1. Services from Depot
    2. A bit less bright dashboard
    3. Reduction of motion blur on instrument needles

    That's about all I found for now.

    Cheers,
    Prof.
     
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  3. Dominik Tuchowicz

    Dominik Tuchowicz Member

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    I would love digital timetables with kilometric thingy on Displays on German routes.
    Old ZUSI3 have it.
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2020
  4. bosiger.thierry

    bosiger.thierry New Member

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    Unfortunetly I can't figure out what are LZB and AFB and how to use these features. I tried to clic here and there, but that led to a mess.
    Is there a litle manuel or tuto abot those subjects ?
     
  5. Dominik Tuchowicz

    Dominik Tuchowicz Member

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    LZB is a security system for going above 160km/h.
    PZB is a security system to go between 40 - 160 km/h.
    SIFA - vigilance system

    How it works? You need to put switches on, its locations depends on the train. In ICE3 it is hidden in the panel above the floor on the right side behind driver seat. Open this little "cupboard" and inside find SIFA, LZB, PZB isolators (on/off).

    What they do? I know that you can see instructions on Rapid Transit manual -for PZB.

    Shortly it is a system that will limit you to 40km/h until you release it (I think it is End), Acknowledge the signal just in front of it, You have to acknowledge signals (speed signals) in time if not the train will come to a full halt and be locked for some time when speed limit goes down via route sign or signal aspect or you enter a section above that speed.
    It can be spotted by usually yellow things on the track, thats where it triggers the counter to press "Acknowledge" button quickly.
    It is hard to spot it from distance on TSW due to Anisotropic filtering being extremely weak for tracks.
    If I am correct PZB works as a points on rails that send data to train cab that you have acknowledged by (Delete) or (Pg Down).

    LZB is a data cable that will show the next aspect or speed change to confirm if it goes down to check if you are vigilant for safety reasons. On TGV it shows current or upcoming speed change.

    Cologne - Aachen have both implemented.

    SIFA is most simplest thing. Press Q. A train driver have to press that button to "acknowledge" that he is there, healthy, concentrated every minutes he doesn't touch any controls to check actually if he doesn't passed out. On some trains it will apply brakes automatically if the driver leave his seat (pedal on the floor depressed).. Same as Alerter in US.
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2020
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  6. Dominik Tuchowicz

    Dominik Tuchowicz Member

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    AFB is a speed holder.
    When driving on LZB mode (above 160km/h, tracks need LZB data cable section for it, its always present above 160km/h to my knowledge, so usualy high speed tracks), you can activate AFB via MFD display menu (left side MFD, bottom left one probably).
    You select a max speed with AFB and the train will not go above that speed. Handy to do not trigger emergency stop.
    Like speed autopilot with throttle on, it will accelerate on hills and brake on descends to hold a bit below assigned speed.
    It is useful to focus on signal aspects and speeds limitations / changes instead of focusing on throttle.

    It usually doesn't work on PZB sections (less than 160km/h).

    Sorry cannot explain it further as I know TGV systems, but I lack on High Speed German trains.
    But it is like initial knowledge to know at least what it is.
     
    Last edited: Aug 22, 2020
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  7. bosiger.thierry

    bosiger.thierry New Member

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    Thank you Dominik for your in depht replay !
    I think that Dovetail could have provided some explanations about how to use the software they sell us...
     
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  8. Dominik Tuchowicz

    Dominik Tuchowicz Member

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    With pleasure. I can't tell exact details but at least you know what is what.
    I heard that they made some explanatory videos recently after being back slashed by the community for not releasing a comprehensive manual. Check that on Youtube (Tran Sim World channel). However I don't have a link to share.
     
  9. 7orenz

    7orenz Well-Known Member

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  10. jingyu.park

    jingyu.park New Member

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    Firstly, thank you for posting your opinion.

    I have one question, according to your 'personal wishes', is there any depot for ICE3 on Köln Schnellfahrstrecke?

    In my opinion, the motion blur of the gauge needle seems to vary depending on the type or degree of anti-aliasing. Because I didn't find it awkward.
     
  11. Paulo_1997

    Paulo_1997 Active Member

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    It is right after the station "Köln Hansaring".
     
  12. markandrei24

    markandrei24 Active Member

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    Problems experiencing ICE 3 (video)

    Jump to 16:56 to 17:13 and 23:44 (Note: Needs PC Browser to work)


    I am not sure if all problems below corresponds to reality:
    1) "Zug Besy" Display did not work (Speed and System Indicator in Digital)
    2) Traction bar on MFD did not work
    3) Right Display did not work (It's ON but Cannot change displays and should be same as left side)
    4) Cannot Turn on/off display (If parked or during unlock/lock cab procedure)
    5) LZB Does not announce Speed Decreases (If signal is clear. Only sounds if speed is "000" (Red Signal).) (Jump to 23:44)

    Video of ICE 3 in reality
    Jump to 11:29 (Displays off) 21:58 to 22:06 (Traction bar and right display) and 23:20 to 23:25 (Zug-Besy MFA Display) on this video



    Screenshot on the video
    Zug-Besy Display
    Screenshot (63).png

    Displays Off on Locking the other cab (Circled)
    Screenshot (65)_LI.jpg

    Edit: Watch the entire video (ICE 3 Cologne - Aachen Video above) to evaluate more problems found on ICE 3.
     
    Last edited: Aug 23, 2020
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  13. Monder

    Monder Well-Known Member

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    There's still the issue with the 2nd class car behind the BordBistro having the 1st class door with wrong shape and marking.
     
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  14. ProfCreeptonius

    ProfCreeptonius Well-Known Member

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    One picture = Thousand words?

    This picture = One word: AAAAAaaaaaa..... 20200823211223_1.jpg
    sorry I couldn't provide details. I don't know how i got to this. I experienced wheelslip in a custom-made scenario.

    Cheers,
    Prof.
     
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  15. delucadomenico2009

    delucadomenico2009 Active Member

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    Normally i used to play in manual mode so i don't like to use the AFB.
    Now for the pzb and lzb, they are much easy to understand than they seems.
    Pzb work as a limitator.
    Lzb as a speed guide.
    After you set the mode of the pzb, o - m - u. You can activate it from the pannel.
    (For ICE3 and talent 2 the pzb mode is set on O for default)
    Now a little easy guide to use it.
    Pzb U - max speed 100km/h
    Pzb M - max speed 120km/h
    Pzb O - max speed 160km/h
    Practice example if you are driving a talent 2 from koln to aachen, on the high speed part the speed limit is 250 but your max aviable speed is 160 (Pzb type O). You need always obbey to your pzb type.
    Now the pzb, start to work every time you pass a signal that is different than clear or after passing a speed limit signal. You need to acknowledge the signal immediatly after you pass it. In this moment on your HUD a yellow light appear and says 1000k/w and another blue light that says 85. Theese are your limitation. The yellow light means that you are in the 1st pzb restriction area. And the 85 indicate the speed that you need to reach (or maximum permitted speed). Now let's go the MOST important part.
    The pzb have a default speed limit that you need to reach when you are in the pzb restriction (or yellow area if you prefer)
    Pzb U - 55 km/h in 32 seconds
    Pzb M - 70 km/h in 28 seconds
    Pzb O - 85km/h in 23 seconds
    What means. An exemple. If you are driving a talent 2 (pzb O) and you pass a signal that says "switching line" (yellow/green light) at 160km/h you must acknowledge the signal and both pzb lights will activate. Now you need to brake until 85km/h within 23 seconds, or the penalty brake will be immediatly activate.
    Now let me show THE MOST IMPORTANT PROBLEM.
    The pzb section has be formed from 3 different areas.
    Yellow area - neutral area - red area.
    Theese indicate the space between you (distant signal) and main signal that you are approching. Normally a distant signal is at 1200/1000m from the main signal. So let me show how the section is divided. From 1200m to 500m is the yellow area. From 500m to 350m is the neutral area. From 350m to 5m is the red area. The pzb indicate you to decrease to 85km/h within 23 seconds BUT you need to reach 85 km/h before the end of the yellow area. So you have ~700m to get that speed than there is a deceleration ipotethic curve that is calculated. What means if you think that you will get the 85km/h before the end of the yellow area but for the pzb you are running too fast the penalty brake will be activated. What to do? As soon as you see a signal that is different of cleat, you need to start the breaking procedure before to pass the distant signal. This will help you a bit. The speed that you need to reach is always the same so it is easy to do some practice. Now let me do a little resume
    Pzb mode O
    Max speed 160kmh
    Yellow area 85kmh
    Neutral area 40kmh
    Red area 25kmh.
    Use the same neutral and red limit for all type of pzb.
    Another tip is that after the pzb will be activate, try to reach as soon as the yellow speed limit, than continue to slowly decelerate to 40kmh (german safety speed) so you can approach the neutral and red area without problem.
    Now. After the pzb will be activated you can't exit from the limitation. You can only exit from the limitation when you are out from the yellow or the red area (indicated by led on the HUD) by press pzb relese button on the left side of the desk. After that you can reach the track speed.
    Now the most easy part.
    If you are stopped and you repart again the led "85" and "70" start to light. Your max speed now is just 45kmh, you just need to relese the pzb and you can continue.
    If you are stopped at a red signal and the pzb red area Led is active you can depart but you max speed is 25kmh until you pass the next main signal. Than just acknowledge and you are free to accellerate.
    Hope that this one could help a bit. If someone needs more clarification i'm here to help.
    The LZB instead is very easy to understand.
    The lzb see up to 10km before your train and it predict and inform you about the next speed limit that is slower than your actual maximum speed. For exemple on the ice from koln, you are driving at 250kmh the hud on the desk will says 200. This means that your next speed limit will be 200kmh. Now in the middle of the desk there is an indicator that inform about the 10km above you. When you are approaching the speed limit, the indicator starts to decrease to inform you how many m remain until the speed limit. Now, the lzb like the pzb calculate a sefety deceleration curve to safety decrese speed or stop. When the indicator in the middle starts to decrease after a bit a big red "G" indicator will be activate, this means that the deceleration curve has been started and you need to start the braking sequence. Some tips.
    The hud does not indicate your current speed limit, because it can chage costantly during the way. You can understand your current speed with a red mark on your speed indicator.
    When the lzb area is finishing a yellow led that says "ende" will appear on the desk, you need to hold the pzb relese button for some seconds and than decrease until 160kmh (you wil go in pzb mode).
    If you are running on lzb area and the display says next speed limit "000" means that you are approaching a stop signal or another train is running in front of you. In case of another train is running in fron of you is better to asume a medium march speed to take a sefety distance to the train (normally 140kmh) .
    When you are approaching a speed limit (not a stop) normally start a soft breaking session when the indicator in the middle reach 5000m by setting the brake at 1A and increase it to 1B or 2 when the G indicator will appear.
     
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  16. ProfCreeptonius

    ProfCreeptonius Well-Known Member

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    Hi all,

    I wanna follow this up with a special emphasis on the most annoying ICE-3 Problem right now. Rest assured that it's not a PZB/LZB defect - PZB seems to work flawlessly, LZB could use minor tweaks, it's a graphical mistake:

    In TSW2020 one of the best graphical features in the game in my opinion was the extremely realistic and very nice motion blur (except around the wheels). It really strengthened the illusion of speed and to me was one of the distinctive features that TSW2020 had, but not TSXX. Now, I got TSW2 to get confronted with this glitchy mess:

    20200825113525_1.jpg

    Just look at the top edge of the cab on the border with the windshield. Look at those flashy glitchy white patches and that fuzzy zone forming around the edge.
    Capture.PNG
    Just... look at this ugly mess. What happened to my beloved motion blur?

    I'd love if this graphical issue could get patched, like, a.s.a.p. it makes riding at speed with motion blur on extremely annoying. I believe what is happening is that motion blur is attempting to blur bits of the cab with the background from outside the windshield. I suspect this should be an easy fix? Just tweak what motion blur... blurs?

    I know i could just "turn off motion blur", but that reduces the feeling of speed and generally doesn't look as good in my opinion. Also when running at lower FPS, motion blur makes the transition between frames much more seamless, contributing to the fluidity of the game, in my opinion.

    Cheers,
    Prof.
     
    Last edited: Aug 25, 2020
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  17. hyperlord

    hyperlord Well-Known Member

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    ProfCreeptonius +1 from me, I noticed the same issue. And at the same time this glitchy stuff starts, I imagine the sound has aproblem, too (crackling noises). At the same spot where the glitches appear, there seems to be a "special zone" on the windshield since with motion blur off and rain the raindrops behave different/odd in that particular area.
     
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  18. Monder

    Monder Well-Known Member

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    That's probably not an easy fix... as evidenced by the well known blurred wheels...
     
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  19. Anthony Pecoraro

    Anthony Pecoraro Well-Known Member

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    That's not unique to the ICE.
     
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  20. Myron

    Myron Well-Known Member

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    I found an issue

    the sound
     
  21. rennekton#1349

    rennekton#1349 Well-Known Member

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    You do realize the thread was from 3 years ago right and didn't include anything substantial. You could have started a new thread explaining what's wrong with the ice3.
     
  22. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    That's true in real life too.

    Actually the lights ARE on- you can check by boarding one - but not much light escapes the blackout windows.
     
  23. Myron

    Myron Well-Known Member

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    i don't care thank you
     
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