PC Sand Patch Grade - Fully Fuelled

Discussion in 'Troubleshooting' started by shackcat, Aug 27, 2020.

  1. shackcat

    shackcat New Member

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    I went and watched an old Youtube video of TSW with this scenario, it is quite apparant that this scenario was ported across to TSW2 and very little Quality Assurance was done on it as the majority of the bugs are tasks required in TSW that have been left out in TSW2.

    On starting the scenario the player needs to carry out a number of tasks in the Lead Loco.
    No instruction is given wrt to the position of the MU-2A Valve - is should be Lead or dead, if this is not done, scenario will not process forward.

    Once connected up to end of the consist player is directed by game to place MU-2A Valve into Trail 6 or 26, this then triggers the scenario but player then needs to place MU-2A Valve - Lead or dead position or you will stall out on climb part of the scenario. I believe that if this is fixed the work around would not be needed.

    My work around for this scenario is to do the following as listed below before going to assume enginees position on the Lead Engine:

    So the correct setup should be (according to the wiki): https://train-sim-world.fandom.com/wiki/Driving_the_SD40-2,_GP38-2_and_GP40-2

    Locomotive 4 (TRAIL):
    MU-2A valve -> TRAIL 6 OR 26
    Cutoff Valve -> Cutout
    Engine Run , Generator Field ,Control & Fuel Pump: OFF
    Radio -> Off

    Locomotive 3 (Should be setup as a lead train):
    MU-2A valve -> Lead or Dead
    Cutoff Valve -> Freight
    Engine Run , Generator Field ,Control & Fuel Pump: ON
    Radio -> On

    Locomotive 2 (TRAIL):
    MU-2A valve -> TRAIL 6 OR 26
    Cutoff Valve -> Cutout
    Engine Run , Generator Field ,Control & Fuel Pump: OFF
    Radio -> Off

    Locomotive 1 (LEAD):
    MU-2A valve -> Lead or Dead
    Cutoff Valve -> Freight
    Engine Run , Generator Field ,Control & Fuel Pump: ON
    Radio -> On

    Spolier Alert:


    I have still not finished this scenario as there is a very slow train in front of me, max speed required for this scenario is 30 mph. It has only taken me 6 hours to get this far :(
     
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  2. fabristunt

    fabristunt Well-Known Member

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    I did this scenario yesterday. You missed a couple of things:

    - the auto-brake handle (the red one) in the 3rd loco must go to the handle off position, it's past suppression, which is after full service. I should also work on the release position.

    - the most important thing: in the 1st loco, the one you will drive, turn on the Banking comm switch. I believe it's a new feature, I don't remember it being in TSW2020. Its the yellow switch with DISP written on, you'll find it on the radios above the brake handles.

    This way you will have all 4 locos pushing, not just the first two :)
    Regards,
    Fabrizio
     
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  3. breblimator

    breblimator Guest

    Try to set the Cut-off Valve in the lead DPU loco in CUT OUT position. CUT IN / FREIGHT don't work for me. Although I believe CUT IN is the correct setup, in theory :)
     
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  4. Rudolf

    Rudolf Well-Known Member

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    I support this bug report. The instruction sin the scenario are not complete and there is no proper documentation. This is a really bad piece of work, which is a pity because multiple working at Sandpatch is a great game feature. I really do not understand why DTG makes this work only half.
    In my route Guide for Sandpatch you may find a more accurate description that given above.
    You can download it here: https://www.hollandhiing.nl/trainsimulator.

    The only thing missing is the use of the Disp setting for banking communication, which is newly modelled.
     
    Last edited: Sep 19, 2020
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  5. Dovregubben

    Dovregubben New Member

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  6. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    I cannot seem to crack this one. I followed the above and most of the route I could get up to about 25-30mph. 2miles from the summit the train stalled on the 1.7%gradient.

    checked the above and all appeared ok. tried rocking it on the throttle, tried balancing throttle against breaks, all I can seem to do is roll backward or wheel spin. Tried this a couple times now.

    I’ve looked at train 3 and the power is on, should the throttle lever move? It doesn’t.
    Both valves are set to freight in loco 1 and 3.
    Both switches set to lead in loco 1 and 3
    Both set to trail in 2 and 4

    I have banking comms on too and have tried sand
     
    Last edited: Oct 1, 2020
  7. Dovregubben

    Dovregubben New Member

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    Hi chieflongshin, as already noted by others, the guide to running the Multiple Unit Control System (is sorely lacking in-game to say the least.

    Each MU consist of 2 locomotives e.g. MU-1 (engine 1 and 2), MU-2 (engine 3 and 4) and MU-3 (engine 5 and 6). MU-1 and MU-2 are connected whereas MU-3 is traling the last freight car.

    To your question: yes, all MUs (#1, #2 and #3) should respond to the throttle setting and brake setting of the lead locomotive (Multiple Unit). Obviously you want all 6 engines to pull the weight rather than just the 2 in lead...

    MU-lead:
    Cut-off valve: Freight.
    MU-2A: Lead or Dead.

    Control and Fuel Pump: ON
    Engine Run: ON
    Generator field: ON

    MU-trail:
    Cut-off valve: Cut-out
    MU-2A: Trail 6 or 26

    Control and Fuel Pump: OFF
    Engine Run: OFF
    Generator field: OFF

    Why these circuit switches must be set right on the MU-trail unit:
    Control and Fuel Pump – OFF: by controlling these functions from the lead cab, the ability to shut them off in case of fire is maintained...
    Engine Run – OFF: this provides the power to actuate the governor solenoids i.e. controlling the power output of this engine.
    Generator Field – OFF: main alternator off.

    Given that the brake valves «Cut-off» and «MU-2A» are set accordingly your primary MU would pull a lot of dead weight a.k.a. Dead-in-tow, but should still be able to crawl along. You have to make sure that the brakes are set right – the «automatic» and «independent brake» on the trailing MUs are set to «handle off» and «off» respectively.

    Furthermore, make sure that the radio fuse is «ON» to operate MU-3 remote from MU-1 in distributed power mode. The MU-1 and MU-2 are connected through a jumper cable and thus do not need the radio to function properly.
     
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2020
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  8. pdxpony

    pdxpony New Member

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    I know this thread is a few months old, but just in case this helps anyone else...

    I had a hard time with this one too. When trying as described above, I could NOT get the train to budge... I could throttle up to notch 6 and would just spin the wheels. I tried probably half a dozen times thinking that I missed something.

    This last time, I intentionally left the auto brake on the third loco (the leading engine in the rear MU) set to "release" instead of "handle off" which I had been doing. Worked like a charm!
     
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  9. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    Bingo. The lead engine of the rear pair should be set up as if you were driving it. Because you are driving it, by radio remote control. "Handle off" is for the trail element of each MU pair.

    Agree that the scenario instructions are woefully inadequate. They should cover every step of this setup in detail.
     
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  10. GrayDawg

    GrayDawg Well-Known Member

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    Yes, it's mind-blowing how things like these are not covered, and covered in depth at that. Not everyone has the patience, the deep love for all things train, like some of us do. The rest are just left out there hanging dry, and not having a clue what to do. Some come here, we try help them, cool, but what about the rest...and I think, the rest, is a LOT of people out there who might just..WTF, I'm outie. I'll go play "whatever" instead of this heap of doo-doo.

    I know DTG, as of lately, has said that they are going to try and rectify this "oversight", but then again...I just hope it's not going to be another thing on a long, long list of we-are-going-to's, promises, it's coming's. Game/simulator like this should be in depth well documented, and that includes every feature of it and then some in nice long PDF's, with pictures, and preferably videos to follow it up too. If there need to be a fulltime, or two, people working on this, so be it. You can't skip on stuff like this. There are simply no excuses for doing so!!
     
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  11. Cambridge Bob

    Cambridge Bob New Member

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    Here is a simple solution, follow all the game instructions that you get once you couple your pair of locomotives to the back of the train. But, before you leave the locomotive to move to the front of the train make sure you turn on BANKING COMM the button to the left of the radio volume control. Once you move to and enter the front locomotive (#8013) open the fuse box panel behind the engineer's seat and turn on the fuse for the radio, it is in the top row of fuses. Close the fuse panel cover, sit down in the engineer's seat and turn BANKING COMM on that engine's radio. Proceed to prep and move the train as instructed and everything should play out fine. If you don't do these steps the DPU's in the rear of the train won't respond to commands from the lead engine and you won't have enough power to climb the steep grades. I was able to move from a stop on the 1.7% grade where I kept stalling previously.

    I don't think the problem discussed above is a bug but actually due to a failure to follow prototype procedures. In the real world when an engineer enters a new loco he checks all key control systems to make sure they are working including making sure the fuses are set correctly.

    I am pretty pleased and impressed with TSW2, excellent graphics, detailed scenery, and good train physics.
     
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  12. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    This doesn't quite compute. If the indy brake is at full application, the BP won't reach 90. (Besides, with the parking brake set there is no need for the indy brake)

    DTG aren't helping by confusing the terminology here. Distributed Power refers to the completely automated remote-control setup which, in game, is only available with ACW4400s. Communicating by radio with a live engineer in the rear MU is the old-school way of employing helper engines, but is not DP.
     
    Last edited: Jun 21, 2021
  13. jeff.engle

    jeff.engle Active Member

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    You are right! My 2nd attempt failed, trying to follow the "old" DTG instructions.

    Re-started Sand Patch Grade Fully Fueled, finally got over to the long consist and started setting up the trailing engines and the whole train started rolling backwards. I would brake and then very time I tried to set up the trailing engines correctly with the brakes off, it started rolling. Looks like I'll have to exit and restart... maybe tomorrow I'll have better luck. I was unable to switch ends by ctrl-+; and when I finally got to the front controlling cab I could not sit down - I didn't have the 'dot'. I can't believe that this can be so hard. I've done X-Plane (probably over 1000 hours of all types of quality airplanes) and MS Flight Simulator (alpha and beta testing too) and nothing has been as buggy and lacking of documentation as TS2021 and TSW-2 IMHO. I am stubborn though...
     
  14. jeff.engle

    jeff.engle Active Member

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    Cannot believe this! Got the 4 engines configured correctly finally using: https://drive.google.com/f/d/1GA7qAUt3PD1OhhGYe6dp9NKShQ9pzcoc/view

    Thank you Rudolf Heijink. I owe you a beer/coffee. It seemed to make the most sense for me.

    3/4 of the way up the climb I was unable to use the "1" key to get back into the cab after selecting "2" to view the train outside. All the other keys and functions for the x-box controller working fine including brakes and throttle (both keyboard and x-box controller).

    Made it to the top! But, since I was unable to get into the cab I was unable to exit the cab cleanly, but was able to uncouple using the free camera "8" key to get to the trailing engines. After 10 minutes of trying to open the door I was able to, but unable to actually enter the cab of the rear loco. "E" does nothing. "1" stops the camera and the train goes by. Tried using the "c" key as posted elsewhere to get out of this predicament, but didn't work for me.

    Totally frustrated! I am unable to complete the scenario.

    [Final Report] Started from scratch, and completed scenario with no problems following Rudolf Heijink's great scenario guide - did not exit the cab.
     
    Last edited: Jun 24, 2021
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  15. wisdomsson2000

    wisdomsson2000 New Member

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    Ok guys so I'm haveing trouble keeping the speed up on the engines most of the trip i get stuck at 11mph and that's with the engines set to 8 what am I missing?
     
  16. wisdomsson2000

    wisdomsson2000 New Member

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  17. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    The "0" key teleports you back to the driver's seat
     
  18. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    Sounds like you don't have the rear engines set up correctly. Still, you aren't going to crest that grade above about 17-18 mph.
     
  19. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    Lead loco

    set brakes to cut in
    Valve to lead
    Make sure banking comm switch on radio reads ON.

    you should be ok then if rears are set up ok.
    Do these three things above, use one of your cameras to fly beside rear locos. If you hear them throttle up as you do so you’re sorted, you’ll see the amp gauge and throttle switch move too if it’s right
     
  20. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    Just realised everything you need you’ve posted underneath of
     
  21. wisdomsson2000

    wisdomsson2000 New Member

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    Ok so i have tried several things on the rear engine setup and i still seem to be doing something wrong/

    Gen field on
    Reverser = out
    Mu-2a =lead or dead
    Radio in both engines on and both have Banking come on ( both being engines 1 and 3)
    I have tried the brake in engine 3 to either hand off or full service and neither allows the engine to move forward only full release lets me get going (i assume there is something that there is something not letting engine 3 communicate to engine 1 right but i have yet to discover my error) What am i doing wrong? do the slave engines 2 and 4 need to be comm off? i haven't touched either 2 or 4's settings except turning there radio fuses on.
     
  22. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    What service are you doing?
     
  23. wisdomsson2000

    wisdomsson2000 New Member

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    ok so i found i can get the train to move if engine 3 mu is set to cut off and brake to control release but I seem to setill have an issue between 1 and 3 talking to each other becasue 3 isn't powering up when 1 is.
     
  24. wisdomsson2000

    wisdomsson2000 New Member

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    Fully Fueled
     
  25. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    All right, I think I see the problems here. The Gen Field switch must be OFF in every cab except yours. Turning on any of those three switches in a remotely-controlled cab activates local control, which cuts out remote control. In other words, your helper engines aren't helping, they're idling.

    The MU2A in every cab but yours needs to be in "Trail 26", for the same reason. Trail means that it takes remote commands (and therefore it doesn't matter what position the brake handle is in), Lead/Dead means that it doesn't (Dead is used for a shut-down engine being pulled as dead weight).

    There is no need to turn on Banking Comm in any engine but the lead- but the lead and Engine 3 do need to have the radio fuse ON, or else comms don't work (doesn't matter in 2 and 4)
     
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  26. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    As above. Ensure Radio fuse is turned on. Check it's turned on in loco 3 before you run to the new loco 1.
    When you are in loco 1 turn radio fuse and banking comm switch on.
    Set brakes up as per solicitr post and.
    Use camera 3 to look at back of train and you should see throttle moving on its own.

    With camera 3 you can flick some of the valves over if you need to saving you a long run.
     
  27. wisdomsson2000

    wisdomsson2000 New Member

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    Ahhhh that makes perfect sense ok thanks. Will try and let you know how it goes
     
  28. wisdomsson2000

    wisdomsson2000 New Member

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    So I used your setup but i STILL can't get the 2nd set of engines to throttle up when the main cab does . I have set the radios and put the three trailing engines on TRAIL 26. Question I noticed the comm radios on engines 1 2 and 4 all have yellow numbers on them indicating there on but engine 3 stays black no matter what I do. Could this be my problem with the engines not communicating?? IF so any ideas hwo to correct it? engine 3.jpg
     
  29. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    Last edited: Jan 18, 2022
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  30. PBrogaard

    PBrogaard Active Member

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    Thanks a lot! I've been failing this as many others. Since release I've tried some settings described in the manual and here on the forums, but the https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1o7zeIn-Nshe7_bzqkd7hQg2QrV0G9xNvBevPoxTunA8/edit#gid=0 finally made me succeed. Even after I started the scenario and doing nothing but following objectives and came to a halt at MP 198. Going to the rear exterior camera, opening the windows and setting controls from there saved me the walk.
    It's 2022 DTG, and there is still no proper guide for this first release. Come on :) Or have I missed something? Again. Thank all of you who have contributed on this topic.
     
    Last edited: Jan 18, 2022
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  31. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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  32. brennie g

    brennie g New Member

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    You sir have won the internet, for me anyway, followed all the other options that others posted and nothing worked, followed this quick set up and boom my train started moving. If I was next to you id kiss you. PS: I signed up to this forum just to thank you ;)
     
    Last edited: Mar 26, 2022
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  33. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    :)
     
  34. BaleineSSJ

    BaleineSSJ Member

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    It's 2023, and the scenario is still broken. Good thing there is this topic or I would still fiddle with the controls :)
     
  35. xaphan#3782

    xaphan#3782 New Member

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    It’s 2024 and this is still a thing on PS5. Thank you for this thread and the above guides.
     

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