Sehs Unfinished

Discussion in 'TSW General Discussion' started by helderbrincolas, Feb 2, 2021.

  1. helderbrincolas

    helderbrincolas Well-Known Member

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    DTG clearly knows how to give value to the customer when it comes to the quality of its product ... It is clear to everyone that SEHS needs further development and that you are launching an unfinished product for 30 €. Stop it and let go of that weak mentality that just wants money and money. Class 395 sounds obviously need more work. AND HOW IS IT POSSIBLE TO USE THE SAME SOUND THROTTLE OF THE 377 ON THE 395 ???? I really gave up on you and your menatality DTG, i love TSW but you can't manage the game and treat the client in the way that he deserves ...
     
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2021
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  2. lmcpfc2014

    lmcpfc2014 Well-Known Member

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    they are still improving the route, maybe they will have this fixed soon. Based on feedback from last nights stream a lot of people were happy with how the route is. They've got to release it eventually otherwise they won't make a good enough profit
     
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  3. helderbrincolas

    helderbrincolas Well-Known Member

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    They've got to release the route when it's ready.
     
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  4. aaron1807

    aaron1807 Member

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    I honestly think posts like these are just completely unwarranted, the devs put a lot of time, effort and passion into the work they do. Then there's certain members of the community that will never have any appreciation for the work they do, instead just slam them at every opportunity they get. DTG is a relatively small indie games studio and IMO they honestly deliver a very good product for the price we pay, yes there's a few bugs and issues here and there. Although, they are usually fixed through patches and updates which is actually one of my favourite things about TSW, it's an ever evolving game which only improves with time and there's not many games which you can see all of these changes happening with their fortnightly roadmap articles.
     
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  5. helderbrincolas

    helderbrincolas Well-Known Member

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    If they only didn't think about money they will release SEHS when it's ready. I say SEHS like and example but other products got release and the quality was a joke(M3 LIRR). But keep suporting unfinished products
     
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  6. Luke8899

    Luke8899 Well-Known Member

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    Create your own private business and see how far you get by not thinking about money.
     
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  7. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    When MS released FS2020 you couldn't fly through tower bridge. It go fixed but there are still hundreds of known issues
    DTG are a much smaller company so when they release a route its an approximation rather than reality remade.
     
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  8. aaron1807

    aaron1807 Member

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    From the stream I watched last night I would say SEHS is ready, yes bar a few minor issues with lighting, sound and buttons not working correctly, all of which was mentioned is being worked on for a fix in a few weeks. The game isn't unplayable, so I don't see what the issue is with releasing it now and upgrading post release. Additionally, at least with the stream they highlighted the issues and thus I don't have a false set of expectations for certain things to be working when I actually play the game.

    I for one will be purchasing it because I've waited a long time for this route specifically and those smaller fixes are not enough to put me off the game.

    If you don't support their business you can kiss goodbye to more TSW DLCs because they'll have no income.
     
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  9. CK95

    CK95 Well-Known Member

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    That is getting into a subjective look on the product, if DTG think it's finished from their prospective then in their eyes it is ready.

    Personally I agree that the 395 is not where it needs to be sound-wise, however I don't expect a new sound mix for it at this point, but while it does sound very off, it weirdly sounds somewhat like a 395, as for the 375, I did not expect any changes to be made from the first preview, and to be honest I suspected it would be a 377 clone job before we even heard/seen it, i'll probably just not use it except from the scenarios & training, then pick up the 465 to substitute it.

    I think that they've gotten the route into a much better spot, it's been transformed from a lifeless derelict looking mock up of SEHS, into a fairly busy good representation of SEHS, and the niggles that were seen on stream, such as tunnel lighting, wipers & gauge lights will probably be sorted out post patch, as in this instance it seems that said patch is actually in development, unlike other times they had said things along the same line.

    We may also see the sound be increased for running sounds and flange etc, but the 375 is just a write off if you expect any more than what is there currently.
     
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  10. LeadCatcher

    LeadCatcher Well-Known Member

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    It is clear {?} to everyone (enter product or software of your choice) needs further development and if (enter company or corporation of your choice) was not only concerned about money it would not release an unfinished product.

    Sigh, which forum am I? I ask since it seems like the above boiler-plate comment is in every forum for every company just after they release a product.
     
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  11. Snek

    Snek Well-Known Member

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    Sorry but that's not entirely clear to me so please refrain from masking your opinion as "everyone's". Speak for yourself first. All I see is a route on the same standard as all others, with good looking scenery and upgraded service mode and some flaws.
     
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  12. helderbrincolas

    helderbrincolas Well-Known Member

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    I just can't with this community ahahaha you clearly don't know what a good product is
     
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  13. doublefine7

    doublefine7 Well-Known Member

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    I really think that the OP does not have an idea of how software development works. Besides having a look at the production costs which needs to be paid (which is the first reason why I disagree with people arguing with the "money"-argument) you have to be realistic about your expectations. If you expect a simulator, try Zusi 3 which is actually a real simulator. Train Sim World 2 is a train sim game. Yes, surprise, its a game. And if you look at games as art, then you would know why people (including myself) arguing that the devs are the only ones deciding how the game looks like etc.

    But if you look on games from the merely consumer perspective, yeah well, then you will never be satisfied. Because it is in the core of IT that developing through trial and error comes with bugs and flaws. And to be honest, I am super-happy that DTG openly communicates about the problems. And the fact that they worked hard to clearly improve the route from the first preview stream within days is proof enough that DTG DOES care. They DO want to improve and provide a high quality product. Is TSW a high quality product? To me: No, but that is reasoned in the fact that I played Zusi 3 and I do know what a real sim can do. But nevertheless I do enjoy the game as it is because I am able to also look on the positives of a game, not only on the negatives.

    Claiming that DTG is all about the money is clearly not true and if you would have followed the roadmaps, the updates and the stream in the last few months, then you would have seen that DTG does improve. They do better. But hey, it is easier to talk about the negative side of a thing than appreciating the good stuff right? Because people tend to think off of positive stuff as a natural thing.
     
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  14. Mattty May

    Mattty May Guest

    As a business I do not criticise DTG for needing to make money. I think Matt said they’re not rolling in money and the car park isn’t filled with Aston Martins etc. I’m grateful for having TSW even though some of the issues can be frustrating and annoying at times.
     
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  15. DTG Natster

    DTG Natster Producer Staff Member

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    helderbrincolas You are absolutely entitled to your own opinions and we appreciate the feedback you share. But please refrain from calling other users names who disagree with you. I have removed one of your above messages to avoid arguments.

    Snek I have also removed yours that quoted the above message.
     
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2021
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  16. Purno

    Purno Well-Known Member

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    I do know I haven't been able to find a better product.
     
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  17. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    Maybe you could enlighten us?

    I see the views of the mythical everyone are being represented by one person again!
     
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2021
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  18. mattdsoares

    mattdsoares Well-Known Member

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    WCML South for TS1 wasn't ready and was released anyway. Go take a look at that at release. The scenery was actually literally unfinished and stuff was missing.

    There's nothing to suggest SEHS isn't ready. You may object to their re-use of some train sounds (which they have ALWAYS DONE), but that doesn't make it unfinished. Your distaste for the artistic license they take with some aspects of the route are nothing more than that. Personal distaste.
     
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  19. Clumsy Pacer

    Clumsy Pacer Well-Known Member

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    Looking on Google the car park appears to contain vans and hatchbacks upload_2021-2-2_14-49-9.png

    While there are some missing things (mainly bushes and staff halt at Hoo Jn), IMO this product is far from unfinished. You seem to have missed WCML South for TS1 which was basically a vague representation of what is perhaps maybe the WCML. ALong with absolute terrible performance that basically meant you needed a NASA computer to run it at a frame rate higher than about 3 frames a week.

    Saying it's clear to everyone it's unfinished is wrong, in fact, looking at this thread I made, quite a few people who were vocal about the state of the route in the first stream are rather satisfied - even pleased - like myself: https://forums.dovetailgames.com/threads/sehs-thoughts-after-a-2nd-stream.34557/

    Every piece of software is going to need work on it in time, but to hold back this route until everything that could concievably go wrong is fixed, this route would probably release in 2024 - you cannot predict how a user is going to use a product.

    If your main issue with a product is the throttle handle sounds the same as another train's, then that's a pretty good sign.
     
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  20. helderbrincolas

    helderbrincolas Well-Known Member

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    You guys really think that i'm listening to your opinions. My post was for DTG if you guys want to make statements and etc great for you because i'm not even reading them, i have more to do than spending 24/7 in DTG foruns.
     
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  21. theorganist

    theorganist Well-Known Member

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    And yet here you are!

    Well maybe you should have sent them an e-mail rather than posting on their public forums?
     
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  22. Clumsy Pacer

    Clumsy Pacer Well-Known Member

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    Then why not email them or something?
     
  23. erg73

    erg73 Well-Known Member

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    It is a free choice of each person, who likes the route and will provide some entertainment will buy it at full price or maybe wait for an offer. And those who don't, won't buy it. It is as simple as that. That is the strength of consumers because they have the ability to decide to buy a product or not to buy it.
    Then DTG, depending on the sales figures, I imagine that they will draw conclusions and study whether they are on the right track.
    I'm the first to say that they should make the routes more polished, but I also appreciate the effort they are making. They have implemented at the last minute things that were discussed in the community. They also want to implement something new on each route; in SEHS it's the level crossings, improved PIS at the stations...
    But they also make the same mistakes over and over again, and they are accumulating the work of other previous routes that were launched without being polished or well tested.
    I also think they should work a bit more on the scenarios. In this route they are all 20 to 35 minutes to complete, and they don't seem to be very inspired from what I could see in the broadcast. And for me it's a step backwards, because in HMA and TGV they seemed to have made an effort to offer better experiences.
    They are slowly improving their game, it is a small studio and they will not be without difficulties. But I hope they'll take the step they're missing to go beyond where they are now.


    Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator (free version)
     
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  24. tbaac

    tbaac Well-Known Member

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    Off topic obviously, but it would be quite easy to argue that FS2020 isn't ready/finished. PMDG for example (makers of some of the best and most popular add-on airliners for FSX and P3D) obviously don't think its ready yet. Its very pretty, and nice for a GA flight but finished product? Its a WIP, and that's despite all Microsoft's money.
     
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  25. mattdsoares

    mattdsoares Well-Known Member

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    LOL, and yet, this is your FIFTH post in this thread alone over a 2 hour span. But sure bud. Whatever you say.
     
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2021
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