PlayStation Dtg Simply Doesn’t Care ...

Discussion in 'TSW General Discussion' started by Mattty May, Feb 9, 2021.

  1. kennyjamesscott

    kennyjamesscott Well-Known Member

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    The problem is they are not available and the drawing distance is appalling.
     
  2. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    I wonder why they decided to add 3,000 fully functioning signals if we the players aren't gonna use all of them. They should've just made then static
     
  3. kennyjamesscott

    kennyjamesscott Well-Known Member

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    To be honest, the whole route should have never been released for consoles. Not in that state. Plus I still think, it was wrong to turn layers off since with layers on I could understand the issues that route has but layers off and same problems stay... Like the buildings in Augsburg loading in at the last moment, power grid without wires, solar panels without the panels...
    I have even pulled in to Munich with the whole Hbf missing.
     
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  4. CK95

    CK95 Well-Known Member

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    It is mystifying as to how they thought it would be appropriate for consoles, on PS5 the textures are fine and the pop in is just the same as any other route (bar Munich HBF approach) but if you stack more than around 5 services between Munich HBF & Pasing the game will crash every time you approach Pasing from the Augsburg direction.

    The route never really had a chance on PS4/X1.
     
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  5. kennyjamesscott

    kennyjamesscott Well-Known Member

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    I just hope (as a collector of German and British modern stuff) that this will never happen again on any upcoming route where the route is just not ready for the light of day.
    With two big blunders DTG had last year, it must have taught them something the one would hope.
     
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  6. CK95

    CK95 Well-Known Member

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    I think the thing that kills HMA on consoles is the S4 services, they’re a frequent busy service that adds traffic in Munich...bizarrely at the expense of traffic across the whole route, I have no doubt that there are other factors in the routes performance, but what’s the real use of a service that comes through a portal and leaves through a portal after a short distance, when it only serves to be a negative factor for performance.

    Germany may see a route that will be as busy and will probably result in being more restrictive on consoles, but I don’t see it happening with a UK route.
     
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  7. kennyjamesscott

    kennyjamesscott Well-Known Member

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    Ahem, Clapham Junction. You are welcome :D

    Well, at least they know the limitations know with the routes and what they cannot do. At least I do hope so.
     
  8. CK95

    CK95 Well-Known Member

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    I wouldn’t worry about that, if we do get it it would probably only have 2 usable platforms, it’s the DTG way.
     
  9. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    Not a problem on PC.
     
  10. CK95

    CK95 Well-Known Member

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    An overall pointless response in the Playstation forum.
     
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  11. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    The inclusion of the S4 is one of the things that gives the Munich-Pasing stretch its life, and even there DTG cut way back. The S3 and S4 are running ~20 services per hour, but they had to leave out the S-1, 2, 6, 7 and 8, ALL of which run on the modeled section. OTOH, the S-3 is the only S-Bahn that follows the main line towards Augsburg, so the inclusion of any of the others would be just as limited as the S-4 is: Hbf to Pasing at most, and often only to Laim.

    [​IMG]

    While you say "at the expense of other services," there are only 2 RB and one RE per hour that run to Augsburg, and they are modeled; the rest turn elsewhere at Pasing or even before and so would be even less satisfying to drive than the S3. What is missing from the traffic, besides five S-Bahn lines, are the ICs and the Austrian trains but, again, the OBBs all turn southward immediately and leave the map.
     
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2021
  12. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    Not really. The imperative for DTG to keep routes within the very narrow parameters of last-gen consoles is holding back the game's development.
     
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  13. CK95

    CK95 Well-Known Member

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    And I definitely agree with that, I’ve long held the opinion that DTG shots themselves in the foot releasing TSW 2 so soon before next gen release, they’re now stuck in a position where they have to ensure development for a platform the doesn’t necessarily support DTG’s own development vision for the game.
     
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  14. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    I agree but hey dtg decided to not continue developing tsw2020 until at least next gen comes out
     
  15. RailRoadEngineer

    RailRoadEngineer Member

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    Why don't DTG adopt procedural techniques to generate complex environments?
     
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  16. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    I believe the issue is that although the map is drawn on a tiled basis, the entire signalling system is loaded at scenario start, so the complex envioronment, ie the one we actually interact with, is all there right from the off.
    Don't know if they're looking to change that either
     
  17. skyMutt

    skyMutt Well-Known Member

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    The problem on consoles isn't necessarily the amount of services a route has, rather its the raw amount of layers it has. Seeing as that the DB BR 423 is already there and comes with the route, it's no problem to include some extra services between Hackerbrücke and Pasing, in fact it helps to bring that part of the route to life as it's busy irl as well. I don't think that adding more services impacts performance that much. However, I get the impression that the whole reason that this layer problem exists in the first place is because there's a bunch of different kinds of trains that can be used in Munich. Off the top of my head, I believe there's about 8 or 9-ish different trains (layers) that can be utilized on this route, and each of those trains have to be loaded into memory. Obviously the more types there are, the more memory it uses up. That might not be an issue for PC's, but the PS4 only has like 8 GB's of RAM. The whole issue has revolved around trying to make this process run more efficiently especially for consoles.
    I think the fact that the S4 line was include was a nice little bonus that didn't impact performance too much. Not as much as including a whole new train/layer (*cough* BR 101 *cough*)
     
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2021
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  18. CK95

    CK95 Well-Known Member

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    It wouldn’t work like that at all, just because there is a 423 on the route somewhere, it doesn’t make a second 423 free of any memory use, whilst there may be a difference in size between a 423 and say a 146/Dosto consist, multiple 423’s would still hold their memory size.

    Weather the portal usage has any effect on how many trains are loaded into the base files of a route is another matter that we don’t have much info on, but there are presumably more 423’s running the S4 than 146’s running RE’s in the space of an hour.

    As for the S4’s providing life on the route, they do so for a very short amount of mileage, and the cost of that is decreased life across the entire route, and less gameplay value, we don’t get RE/RB services, so we don’t get to use a chunk of stations along the line, where as the S-Bahn trains that run the route without the S4 would still provide the same gameplay the S4 does.

    Ultimately it’s a mute point, because we have what we have, and that isn’t changing until (if) we get all the layers, there’s also the point of the 423 coming with the DLC, so if it was another layer instead of that, there would be a further DLC dependency.

    Personally I just think that the S4 doesn’t add anything beneficial, all it does is bring the same gameplay that is already there, and depending on the asset size of other units, those services may even have a worse effect on performance than any of the other possible layers, just due to the amount of additional units it needs, but again, the reason the S4 layers stuck is probably just simply down to the fact that they don’t have a DLC dependency.
     
  19. skyMutt

    skyMutt Well-Known Member

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    Admittedly that's a fair point! Honestly I was under the silly assumption that since there's already an asset loaded in, it wouldn't be a problem to include 1 service or 1000, the performance impact wouldn't amount to much since the asset is already there.
    Bit of a facepalm, looking back at it now. :D
     
  20. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    But that simply isn't so. There are only 3 RB/REs per hour along the Augsburg route, and they're modeled in-game (assuming you have MSB or RSN for the rolling stock). While lots of regionals come in and out of M-Hbf (including many private operators), they almost all head elsewhere no later than Pasing, and often sooner than that, just like the S-Bahns. The busiest line out isn't the one to Augsburg, but either the one around the south of the city via the Ostbahnhof, which handles all the south- and south-east traffic, or the line to Ingolstadt and points north.
     
  21. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    On top of the assets themselves you also have to remember that those trains have to DO something, meaning the dispatcher, signalling and so on all have to monitor and DRIVE those assets, so your CPU is doing all of that work for any asset even if it's not showing on your screen. Matt has said a couple of times on streams that looking to optimise the signalling was a big part of the layer issues on a couple of routes
    Obviously in real life there are multiple processors for each system, your computer only has one processor to do everything (and one lot of memory)
     
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  22. kennyjamesscott

    kennyjamesscott Well-Known Member

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    And two services :D
     
  23. kennyjamesscott

    kennyjamesscott Well-Known Member

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    You proud?
     
  24. CK95

    CK95 Well-Known Member

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    A) You’re still in the PS forum so your PC focused input here is pointless.

    B) The amount of services is my entire point, less services would probably lighten the load on performance, whilst there would be less services, there would still be more gameplay because even 3 Regio Services add more varied gameplay than another layer of S-Bahn.
     
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  25. Mr heff

    Mr heff Well-Known Member

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    Personally, I love the route. Apart from the bugs, I don't really care about scenery. It's the in-cab experience I enjoy.
     
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