Glasgow Cathcart Circle(scotland?)

Discussion in 'Off Topic' started by SHINO BAZ, Feb 23, 2021.

  1. SHINO BAZ

    SHINO BAZ Well-Known Member

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    Just noticed this has been added to the future route dlc section,looking it up mentioned this route is in scotland,so would this count as the next new country,so what does anyone know about it,is it a good choice for a new route?
     
  2. Mattty May

    Mattty May Guest

    It will be U.K.
     
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  3. AtherianKing

    AtherianKing Well-Known Member

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    It is a new country, however I do imagine it will use the Union Jack/ Union flag as its route flag
     
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  4. SHINO BAZ

    SHINO BAZ Well-Known Member

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    So if scotland is it's own country whys is the route listed as a uk route on tsw2 wiki?
     
  5. Northerner

    Northerner Well-Known Member

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    It all depends on your definition of a country. The UK is the whole country, formed of the individual 'nations' of England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland which have their own governments with varying degrees of power but still share an overall government.

    Essentially it's another UK route so I reckon it will have a Union Jack by its name, as English routes have the Union Jack and not the flag of St George.
     
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  6. a.paice

    a.paice Well-Known Member

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    Like the Northerner says, England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland are countries in their own right but are grouped as part of the United Kingdom. This means they fall under the same sovereign- currently Queen Elizabeth II. Thus they fall under the same flag which is the ‘Union Flag‘.

    Most people don’t know but the ‘Union Flag’ is only called a ‘Union Jack’ when it is flying on a warship of the Royal Navy.

    In this case why doesn't the German and French route have a European Union flag? The European Union is not a sovereign state in itself and is just a voluntary membership of countries.

    I love the Union Flag and think it’s the coolest looking one in the world- much better than just the cross of st.George.
     
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  7. stujoy

    stujoy Well-Known Member

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    It’s not a new country. Some people in Scotland do want to become a separate country but for now they are still part of UK.

    National identity is important to people and some people usually refer to themselves as being English or Scottish or Welsh but in legal terms their nationality is British. Like a lot of places in the world we are country that has been squished and squashed together from all sides. I regard myself as British, English and Welsh for example.

    So the route is in Scotland, which is part of the UK. All the other UK routes are in England, also part of the UK.
     
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  8. AtherianKing

    AtherianKing Well-Known Member

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    The new Scottish route is a new country for TSW as all other U.K. routes have been in England, both Scotland and England are countries even though both are within a Sovereign country
     
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  9. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    Well, if you really, really want to get didactic, England and Scotland have not been separate countries since the Act of Union in 1707 created the Kingdom of Great Britain (before that, from 1603 they were two separate countries in personal union under the Stuart monarchs).
     
  10. AtherianKing

    AtherianKing Well-Known Member

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    So if as you say Scotland and England aren’t countries then what are they ?
     
  11. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    Provinces. Like Bavaria or Ontario.
     
  12. AtherianKing

    AtherianKing Well-Known Member

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    they are not provinces, even a quick wiki search of Scotland and England (even Wales and NI) as well as other sources state they are countries with the U.K. being a sovereign country, I don’t even think to the best of my knowledge that the U.K. as a whole has a single province

    just to add if you mean Bavaria as in Germany it’s a German State like an American state there both Federal
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2021
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  13. nuno.andradegb

    nuno.andradegb Member

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    That's a great way of getting a few scots here grumpy with you haha

    I shall explain to you all the simple (not) way things go here in the UK:

    UK (sovereign country) > England, Scotland, Northern Ireland and Wales (countries) > Counties > Cities and Towns.

    Although the border between Scotland and England is marked with road signs, you do not need to stop to show your passport, as you are inside the United Kingdom.
     
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  14. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    Bavaria (as in Germany) was a sovereign kingdom until 1871 and an autonomous kingdom within the German Empire until 1919. Just like Scotland (and Texas), it used to be a country.

    Scotland and Northern Ireland are equivalent to US states, Canadian provinces or German Lander. Wales doesn't even have that status, having been wholly absorbed into the realm of England some 800 years ago.
     
  15. Mattty May

    Mattty May Guest

    The U.K. is England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland - United as one sovereign nation.

    Great Britain is England, Scotland and Wales.

    England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland are separate countries.
     
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  16. AtherianKing

    AtherianKing Well-Known Member

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    Scotland still remains a country despite its inclusion within the U.K. as the U.K. is a sovereign country not a country

    US states (Former Countries) joined a union known today and back then as the United States of America which is a country made up of states (50) to be precise. The difference between Scotland and a US state apart from a lot of things is Scotland never lost its status as a country when it joined the union

    Wales has the closest links to England legally as in laws but still remains a country as with England

    Scotland and Northern Ireland are countries with their own respective parliaments that can pass laws for their respective areas
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2021
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  17. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    That's a nonsensical distinction: "country" vs "sovereign country"?

    And, yes, Scotland (and England) gave up its existence as a country in 1707, just like the Republic of Texas did in 1845. Wales has not been a country since Edward I conquered it and deposed its last native Prince, and absorbed it into the English crown (you'll notice that the Royal Arms have the red lion and the harp, but no dragon, and the Union Flag has the crosses of SS. George, Andrew and Patrick, but not David).

    Local parliaments? US states, German Lander and Canadian provinces all have legislatures. It don't make 'em "countries." I note also that the Scottish Parliament and Ulster Assembly (not a Parliament) were created by Act of (Westminster) Parliament, i.e. by the gift of the United Kingdom, and quite recently: 1998. The Commons could, if it liked, equally give Yorkshire or Somerset the right to form a local parliament. The original Scottish Parliament was dissolved in, again, 1707, when Scotland ceased to be a country, and for the next three centuries law for Scotland was made on the Thames.

    What Scotland is, is a semi-autonomous region.
     
  18. railway12

    railway12 Well-Known Member

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    Well very interesting, one year ago I argued with some forum members saying that scotland is not a country. Instead I would see it as nation or part of the UK. If you take Brexit as an example which scotland did want to prevent. It could have easily done so if it was a country. As a country you are independent, but this was not the case, so scotland thought of leaving the UK as an own country, but that idea was dismissed pretty fast.
     
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  19. nuno.andradegb

    nuno.andradegb Member

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    This is quickly turning into a very political discussion here haha

    England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland are all countries ruled by the sovereign United Kingdom. People have difficult accepting/understanding this because it's very different from the norm.
    Higher earners in Scotland pay more tax than higher earners in England. Scotland issues their own bank notes (that are still accepted anywhere in the UK) and runs their own National Health Services (which is better because you get a lot more free stuff than in NHS England, plus free prescriptions).
    I understand the US has a bunch of states with their own little laws, but the UK does not have states, it has countries.
     
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  20. Coastway trainspotter

    Coastway trainspotter Well-Known Member

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    Ok
     
  21. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Unfortunately the reforendum was only undertaken in Scotland by Scots. I do wonder if they included the wider UK if Scotland may have been booted out. Maybe that's why it WASN'T opened up!
     
  22. AtherianKing

    AtherianKing Well-Known Member

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    What you regard as U.K.’s distinction is of your own opinion but the fact that England Wales Scotland and Northern Ireland are countries still stands regardless

    The Act of Union 1707 is an act that established a Kingdom not changed 3 countries into 1

    No other country, state, region, administrative, zone, municipality, overseas territory, overseas dominion, overseas possession, town, village, city, constituency, county or any other type of area can’t be compared to another in order to proves its current status as history of 2 different places are never the same i.e. Texas and Scotland

    Northern Ireland’s legislative assembly is named the Northern Ireland Assembly or Stormont

    What a places flag is or looks like doesn’t regard its status, an example of this would be if the U.S added another state but didn’t change its current flag wouldn't make that state any less of a state

    What Scotland is currently is a Country within a Union
     
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  23. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    Looks like I entered the world of Politics lol.

    As a American I think of England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland as states of a union. (In this case, countries within a Kingdom) It's sorta like the states of the United States Of America or States of The Union. The Union being the United States Of America. The way I see it Scotland is a U.K country and it would make full since to have the Union Jack Flag next to the Cathcart Circle Line since the route is in The United Kingdom.

    Now on a side note I decided to watch on The Sun's Youtube Channel MPs behaving badily in the House Of Commons and as a American, I have to ask how in the world does anything get passed in the House Of Commons because in that chamber it seems to be more of a daycare center with little kids arguing especially during the Brexit debates. Those videos to me were so funny as well that it could be a comedy tv show
     
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  24. AtherianKing

    AtherianKing Well-Known Member

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    I would have to agree with you about the House of Commons, they only seem to do their utmost when it comes to either wage increases for themselves or something that would negatively effect them or their political party, however I would have to say the same thing about the United States especially with the videos showing republican politicians moving slowly around congress and the senate or when new legislation passes the House of Representatives and then doesn’t even get passed the senate based on party politics
     
  25. nuno.andradegb

    nuno.andradegb Member

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    That's not the nicest thing to hear as someone that lives in Scotland. It's not about booting out Scotland, in fact, polls show a majority of Scots want out of the UK (a mistake imo). Westminster doesn't want to award the SNP another referendum because it was a one-in-a-lifetime referendum and Boris is very interested in keeping Scotland in the UK.
    Just a side note, the reason why the rest of the UK doesn't get to vote for the independence of Scotland, is because the rest of the UK does not vote in our elections, does not pay more taxes like we do, and doesn't live in Scotland...
     
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  26. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Look at it from the other side of the coin. Scotland puts MPs into westminster, votes (and vetoes) on laws that don't affect scotland (because those issues are devlolved over the border) and yet not the other way round. A referendum on breaking down the country affects the whole country so should be undertaken by the whole country. And I would imagine Scotland would really be independent by now had that been the case.
    I believe the same would be true for Wales and NI too and I'd happily go along with that, being Welsh...
     

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