Knock, Knock, Is Anyone There?

In response to DTG.Protagonist stepping down from community manager, I can't help but notice communication has took a nose dive, and we're back with the old DTG bad habits.

For anyone of you who have been in here since the early days, communication was simply non-existent, with even spam/phishing threads being made by bots. That's how barren the forums became.

Then came along Sam (DTG Protagonist). He did a great job at blowing out the cobwebs and cleaning this place up by keeping the community informed, engaged in various threads, and would even have a chit-chat amongst the quieter times. It was a massive improvement compared to what we had before.

Now that he's involved in other roles within the company, its become apparent that over time, communication has took a nose dive. Gone are the frequent updates and fast responses. We're quickly approaching as to how it was before. The only responses I see now is those of official announcements, roadmaps or to remind people to stay on topic. But not actually contribute in the threads itself.

Granted Matt will sometimes respond with his impressive analysis of how things work and what's going on, amongst his busy schedule, but other than that, there's not much activity happening.

Don't let yourself fall into bad habits again, DTG. Your improvements were welcome by everyone across the forums.

 

Sam has posted 11 times just since March 1 not counting the Announcements thread.

 

I definitely have noticed a decline in communication in the forums there were no patch notes posted for Mar 9 and today Mar 17. Leaving me wondering what was updated. Finally after a few days Jamie did get back to us on the Mar 9 one, and someone here in the forums was able to figure out todays update.

But even with Nat not around right now it has been silent a little disappointed.

 

I must say, Jamie has not been nearly as talkative as Sam was when he had the CM job.

 

I noticed that too Jamie would always be responding in the forums and now almost nothing.

 

I think they have perhaps been bitten by sometimes saying things that then get used against them, the natural tendency then is to say less.

From the TS2021 forums:

Its a shame because I also like more open conversations but if people will do that sort of thing then it hurts it for the rest of us. See several threads around the forums like the DB101 cabcar where Matt said something on a private stream and it all kicked off.

There are other threads that accuse members of the staff of not caring/being lazy/being money grabbing/lieing etc and you get the idea. If you want them to be friendly and open, then return that in kind. Think of some of the things they read on here and then it is easy to imagine them not wanting to appear voluntarily when they don't have to.

It is often the phrase DTG this, DTG that, and yet really they are people doing a job, DTG is not a living person, its the name of the company they work for.

Sam is a pro, he has a thicker skin than most, I remember after the first SEHS stream he stayed in the DC for ages facing down the comments, often quite hostile ones. Think several of the DTG staff just left the discord due to the comments they got while there.

And no, it isn't their job, their job is to manage the community, not receive personal comments without flinching.

 

I'll give them the benefit of the doubt for the moment as they're trying to get a new community manager involved, but... yeah. Communication has pretty much tanked in the past week or so.

 

Folk in the TS forums manage to entertain themselves with discussions without relying on prompting from above, especially as the DTG staff don’t seem to interact there nearly as much as they do here

Seems like there’s plenty of discussion on the go here too!

 

I haven't been here long but there was definitely a noticeable improvement in communication during protagonist's time at the helm.
For starters, I remember that he organised and grouped the forums much better than they were before, which were very difficult to follow.
And then he participated a lot in the threads and answered many questions and concerns, always quite clearly and pragmatically. And always encouraging people to participate and express themselves freely, both in praise and criticism, as long as they respected others. Now there is none of that any more, and the darkness has returned. Only Matt or Sam himself pops up from time to time to give a note of quality, but little else.
These days I've been following the Rivet Games forums for the upcoming release of the Arosa Linie and I've been amazed at the interaction they have with fans, constantly answering questions and thanking them for suggestions, always with a good vibes and sense of humour. Why can't we have something similar here?

 

Unfortunately, the PR and customer service gigs involve dealing with a-holes. It's right there in the job description. Jamie has to realize that there are a lot more decent folks on here than there are spoiled, entitled, whiny jerks.

 

To be honest we need them more in the design desk rather than in the forums right now. Their participation here will be always welcome and I acknowledge their efforts but I prefer that they dedicate to corrections and production as several interesting projects are on the roadmap and some are not easy, like the steam one. Also remember that a forum does not produce any money at all so it´s normal that in case of assigning priorities it´s not on the top.

Cheers

 

While I understand the sentiment, Jamie and Nat's job doesn't involve building routes or fixing bugs. It's keeping us informed and (haha) happy- or at least grudgingly quiescent.

The Boo Birds can't be helped....

 

As Solicitr has point out Jamie and Natalie have nothing to do with the making of the routes, their roles are to keep us informed of was it is up and coming. And more importantly posting patch notes for their respective forums. And to take our feedback on what needs to be fixed.

 

So we're going to clone Sam and everything will be better.
More seriously I think Sam was the best CM we've had here.
Personally, I love Sam, I like to watch all of his lives with Adam, I hope that he will continue all that for a very long time.
Before, I didn't watch lives a lot, but that was before.

Thanks Sam for everything you do.

 

I recall a comment from last week that Sam slipped a comment during a live stream and that upset Matt.
Related to the "new" DLC.
He didn't seem to show up on March Madness livestream schedule either which is unusual.

Either he is sick or something has broken.

The context of the quoted message from me above is - DTG has a habit of abandoning products as soon as released. It's a bit more complicated, but anyway. Big picture. People are worried that the same thing happens with TSW content. It's not easy, if not impossible to handle it as a CM in a way that pleases everyone.

As a player you can shrug it off and focus on the bright side, but there are always new players annoying you with the same, valid, problematic questions.

 

As usual we jump to conspiracy conclusions first.
Has anyone thought how tired Sam must feel always having to be on point dealing with all the dissent and complaints.
I’m surprised he held up so long.
Night after night despite his day job.

Natalie and Jamie just don’t have the contacts in the firm that he has.
Remember Sam was in the office before work from home was implemented, plus he has a freedom, due to his seniority, which the newcomers don’t.

 

Have we forgotten JD in all of this, you know the new communications supremo / director / lord of the universe.
Well, actually I kind of have because he's been vacant too.
I know Nat had some "Family issues" so has been quiet for a while anyway, but hopefully DTG don't take steps backward even fi all they're "allowed" to say is "if it's not on the roadmap..."

 

I think Natalie is currently off work at the moment because she hasn’t been streaming or posting, so there will be less involvement while they are a member of staff short. Also, the whole community team are relatively new and we have been spoilt recently with Sam because he is like a community guru of some kind, and he was always going to be temporary in the CM role. We do need to give it some time.

 

What was the comment that was made, if you don’t mind me asking?

 

This post here:

And this:

Hopefully it's nothing, really.

 

This thread is a classic exercise in trolling.

 

I don't know what your problem is, but I don't get the impression that communication has decreased. Sam and Matt interact very intensively on the chat. Jamie and Nathalie very often do not even look at the chat and sometimes do not answer any questions for several minutes.


Very critical questions such as "Why are you building new routes from the TS2021 in the TSW" were recently answered from Matt. I didn't think there would be an answer to it, but it did and the answer was very long.


Jamie and Nathalie go into the chat very little, I think because they can't or don't want to answer a lot.
JD went into the chat very intensively and I'm glad when JD is there and Jamie is not alone because Jamie is very calm.

Thanks Matt and Sam for your efforts and for your good streams!

I like your Streams more than from the others!

 

This is a very good point. Apart from Jamie who appears to be genuinely enthusiastic you barely see anyone else over on the TS1 forums and it hasn't gone into meltdown!

We should surely give them some time especially if there is a new CM and Natalie is away due to outside issues, maybe it isn't a surprise if things have gone a little quiet, although I can't say I noticed.

 

The comments were on the reveal of the Diesel Legends pack. I think there is a bit of misunderstanding of British Humour as Matt was pretending, in my opinion, to be annoyed at Sam's ever increasing list of things to check/correct which originally was Matt's idea. To me its a nice bit of humour but to others it appears as if he is calling things out and you are unhappy about him keeping a list.

 

What? Where? I didn’t realise Sam had stepped down. Did he talk about about Meghan? Im telling you he’s going to good morning Britain to replace piers

 

This is a very current affairs and british thing. Also Sam was only temporary, and has been replaced by JD, but he'll still be on the streams.

 

Personally, I watch video streams very little, because not understanding English, I cannot translate, like here, with google translate.
Regarding Sam, I appreciate his coming here on the forums.
He is someone I regret.

 

Another silly thread, just like ‘Have DTG got themselves into an out-of-control situation?’.

Not saying the OP is at fault but why are some of you trying to twist tiny things into drama and prying into the poor DTG employees personal lives.

As for communication, we know three routes are on our doorstep, one of which is arriving next week and they are busy as usual with everything else. What more can they tell you?

 

Input from developers on official forums comes and goes. Over at N3V Central, rare these days to get much out of the team compared to the early days. The official Elite dangerous forums are another location where there is little official activity and if you think train sim forums can get salty at times...

 

I am looking forward to Friday's stream for Arosa, then on Saturday for Clinchfield.

 

Sam is Sam and you cannot expect anyone to replace him. For TSW I think Natalie is supposed to answer most questions and we still need to see how JD will help us or not. I do not think we got less attention in the forums. We cannot change it and give the new people the chance and time to shine. They have a hard time to do better than Sam did.

 

We would probably get more responsiveness if Jamie was not kept so busy streaming. And I for one, however happy with his contribution here, would like Sam to go back to doing his hilarious Colonel Failure thing with trains!

 

Thank you, my thoughts exactly. Op does great mods and I respect his answers in the posts most of the time, but it seems like they post weekly new threads that already like they only exist to stirr up drama or problems where none are, from the title alone.
I go into the discussions and when I read these titles I am already rolling my eyes.

The last one, this one, and some while back there were similar topics that gave me the impression of unhealthy and non-constructive, even unnessesary.
Freedom of expression to anyone, but I would recommend to ignore these kind of threads if you can already tell this will turn into 5 pages of people stirring up dust for the sake of it.

 

With posts like this I just vote against the poll choice that the Op is fishing for . Makes the poll and the topic irrelevant.

 

I am bringing my opinion now into this thread because I feel that the Question "Is DTG falling back into old times" is a subjective one. I do have that feeling too BUT: I was here in these old times and I might be contaminated with this "experience" which is kind of a bad thing. But things like this are a matter of trust and if you feel like you cannot trust it enough, then it is hard to get rid of that toxic experience. But my personal subjective view doesnt really matter, as I do have a much more important thing say:

If there is nothing to say, then just dont say anything. People tend to expect announcements or other news every day but to be honest: We get infos about new routes etc. almost every day right now, so on this "floor" we get more than enough communication.

And to the general discussions in this forum: Sam did a great job. He really did. But: I think it is unfair to expect the same transparency etc from Jamie, Nat and the other new CM whose name I unfortunately forgot (I am sorry ) Give them time and dont make a panic out of a bit silence. Because there may be a bit more silence here in the forums, but on the news-front we get quite a lot.

 

I think those of us who have been here since the literal beginning of TSW have different perspectives on things. OP and I remember a time where communication was almost non-existent, routes were announced through teasers with no roadmap, and when it seemed like community managers were being swapped in and out every 6 months. Since Sam got into the picture and the roadmap was introduced, communication has become exponentially better. However, I do see a lack of activity in the forums from DTG people in the forums in the past month or so, which is surprising since we just had SEHS, 465, and Diesel Legends release in that time frame and have multiple upcoming routes as well. While I don't think it's anything to worry about in the long-run, I also don't think OP's post is silly or trying to stir up drama.

 

Hmm , let me see. I'm trying to think of the word that you've just so eloquently defined.

 

I do hope whoever is in the streams with TrainSim-Matt has a bit Of spark about them. Sam’s frankness and humour made me not watch tv and watch two hour streams , that says a lot.

I enjoy listening to Matts knowledge and occasional squirm as it made really engaging viewing.

I hope they don’t turn into drab and boring monotone 90min route adverts. The humour goes a long long way

 

I still remember the early days of the Kuju Railsimulator when Adam Lucas and Derek Siddle regularly participated in the UK and US forums. They were not there every day, but there was a lot of openness and communication then and we got answers to questions. Not so much bug fixing, Railsimulator came on CD-ROM, but there were some patches. A bit of good old days ...

 

Sorry, if the community-folk chatter is a little quiet at present. One of Nat's primary responsibilities is looking after the TSW forums and she's on leave at the moment. Once she's back, activity will pick up once again.

Matt already covered this topic fully, but he and I are good friends. I'm sometimes a little unfair to him because I see it as part of my remit to represent the "voice of the player" when we do our streams together. When you folks have a strong opinion about something I try represent that in the tone of the question. The main aim here is to get you solid answers, even if the answers aren't the ones you'd prefer.

This can sometimes paint Matt as the badguy with me being the Champion Of All Players which is pretty unfair. At the end of the day we both represent the same company and, collectively, are responsible for everything that goes right or wrong with the game. Matt's level of passion for the game is self-evident, and you genuinely couldn't hope for someone more invested in a project, that he weathers the occasional interrogation is testimony to this.

We'll see how he feels afterwards

 

Sam was the best CM they’ve ever had, and his wit and vivacity always make streams entertaining. It’s disheartening that it was only a temporary assignment, DtG should up the salary (danger money? ) and tempt him back into the job permanently!

 

Im expecting a good showing from you two this weekend Matt. I’ll ensure I have beer and one random question for you both.

Life’s changed from Saturday night being all about what dirty hussy the pub could provide to you two. Not sure what’s happened there....

No pressure

 

The Clinchfield was a dirty hussy

 

Like it or not, the live streams are a bigger part of the communication now. The communication there is as good as it has been. Matt, Adam and Sam have a lot more experience with the game than any of the others so they are in a better place to answer questions and in Sam’s case he isn’t backwards in coming forward and asking Matt or Adam the difficult questions. That’s why he is still in a lot of streams, as well as for his entertaining style. It’s also clear that everyone gets on really well together, including the new CMs, and there is a lot of good humour in the streams. The newer members of the team will get better at things, with greater knowledge over time, but you can’t expect them to have the same personality that Sam has.

There is a hefty amount of things to get your head round with TSW and TS and even more to get your head round with trains in general. A lot of learning on the job and then add to that getting to grips with us lot. Sam’s still around, it’s not like he’s gone anywhere and Matt is more active on the forum than he has been in a while. Every single one of us wants the answer to that exact question we have and whoever is around at the time might not have that answer to hand or there may be no answer to give yet, especially as a lot of questions need the community team to then pass the questions on themselves and wait for an answer. They still can’t possibly do that for every question. I can get a bit shirty when I don’t get the answers I want but I have no issue with the overall communication or the way the community team is developing.

The roadmap has had teething troubles and that has been a bit of an issue for me but there is no way things are going back to how they were 18 months ago. That was a blanket ‘nothing to talk about on that at this time” on the streams and almost absolute silence on the forum, and nothing about anything that was happening until a week or two before a release. It’s going to remain better than that even if there are dips in communication when people are off work for whatever reason.

 

I was watching the Hauptstreke Rhein Ruhr launch stream the other day (just in the background while doing some work) and Matt said "It's a good idea, but nothing to talk about currently" countless times. Now the roadmap is here, the questions have stayed but the answer has changed, it's now "if it's not on the roadmap, it's not being worked on" or "go and look at the roadmap", which is a bit of a shame as it forces the people on the stream to repeat themselves and it just makes the streams sound like a broken record. I think the roadmap should've got rid of those questions but it hasn't.

 

It will always be this way. Questions that start with "Do you think you will ever..." have no viable answer we can give. The roadmap tells you what is happening, everything else should be assumed to not be happening. Of course there are discussions behind the scenes about future ideas, some of which we hint at on stream, but again until you see it appear on the roadmap it's not something we can confirm.

Also remember that every stream we do will have people who haven't asked a question before, and chances are it'll be one we've had before.

There are a thousand good ideas. If we were to say we'll definitely do them we'd keep you waiting for a long time while that happened.

 

Same