Uk Signalling Question-bml

Discussion in 'TSW General Discussion' started by Disintegration7, Oct 14, 2021.

  1. Disintegration7

    Disintegration7 Well-Known Member

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    Was playing service 1R28 12:09 Victoria-Reigate (recommended from the Awesome Service Mode Runs thread, and it's a good one).

    I ran across an interesting signal progression:

    Exit signal at Merstham station- flashing double yellow

    Next signal- flashing yellow

    Next signal (Approaching Redhill)- solid yellow with feather left (taking me to platform 3)

    Exit signal at Redhill- solid green with "R" indication for Reigate.

    What do the flashing aspects indicate? Is it a speed control system?
     
  2. facundo.dim

    facundo.dim Active Member

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    The flashing yellow lights are used for speed reductions. Telling you a diversion is coming.
     
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  3. Sharon E

    Sharon E Well-Known Member

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    They indicate that the signalman has set the points for the route that you are expecting for Reigate. Its a way to alert the driver that he has his route.
     
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  4. Haribo112

    Haribo112 Well-Known Member

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    Yes. The flashing yellows indicate that you’re about to diverge from the mainline and should expect to reduce speed. The solid yellow wij feather indicates in what direction you will go. The next signal is usually red. However, the dispatcher in this game sets a new path after you’ve closed the doors after stopping. This new route sets the signal to green allowing you to drive off.
     
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  5. Disintegration7

    Disintegration7 Well-Known Member

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    Thanks everyone!

    Interestingly enough, I felt like I almost derailed earlier in the run passing through South Croydon- I had solid greens but the track limit dropped from 45 to 25 real quick. I was on the leftmost track and hit a junction and got the overspeed warning on the HUD at the exact same time- i'm guessing there was no warning from the signaller because I was rejoining the mainline rather than diverging? Just down to route knowledge then?
     
  6. Clumsy Pacer

    Clumsy Pacer Well-Known Member

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    Flashing aspects are only used when diverging from the main route (which is why you weren't slowed for the 25 at South Croydon. Did the HUD not advise this?), and only if the speed limit drop for the divergent line is great enough that you need to force the driver to slow down (this doesn't appear to be operational at Selhurst going southbound on the fast line, but I think it aught to be).

    In some cases, the steady yellow is held, sometimes it clears to the aspect it should after the train has occupied the signal block for a certain amount of time. If the signal is held at a single, steady yellow, you MUST expect the next signal to be at danger (red).

    A similar system known as approach control is employed in some areas, whereby a signal will be held at red until the train has occupied a block for a certain amount of time, after which it'll clear - this is another way of forcing trains to slow down, as is a fixed distant (ie a reflective board with a pictogram of a cautionary semaphore signal on it), or a semaphore signal permanently at caution.
    [​IMG]

    UK signalling is route-based, whereby the driver will be advised of the route over which they'll be driving. They then must use their route knowledge to drive the train safely.
     
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  7. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    I believe that flashing yellows means "High speed divergence, points set", so that means you won't have to slow down a lot (though you might have to slow down to 40 or similar) and that you do HAVE the line. Whether you also have a yellow as in the next signal is blocked is not part of the progression, but part of normal signalling
    You might also be "blocked down" as in a normal double yellow, single yellow to reduce your speed and only then given the line across the points.
    As Cameron's Gaming says above, the driver will know the route they're driving and has to know that route inside out before they drive it so they will know which are fast switches, which are not and generally what the situation should be before they get there. If you watch some of the "commented cab rides" from the UK they often say things like "I need a yellow at the next signal to have the line across the points" and it's that level of knowledge and confidence that keeps things safe as much as following signals

    Last point, there is a REALLY high speed divergence in England which I believe is over 100 mph in either direction!
     
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  8. bescot

    bescot Well-Known Member

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    No. A driver will know that junction is 20mph but needs to be warned in advance by the signals that they'll be taking that path. The move at South Croydon Jn in real life is approach controlled. The signal at the junction should be held at red until you approach it at your reduced speed. It will clear to the next best proceed aspect with a no.4 route indicator as you get close to it - if the route is clear. It will never be greens all the way through unless you're going straight ahead.

    There are lots of 20-30mph junctions on BML which have approach control from red IRL, but this feature does not exist in TSW2 unfortunately, which is a huge shame.
     
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  9. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    This is one of the systems I would love to see implemented in game, but it does seem that signaling, controls etc are "per route" rather than a core aspect, hence things working quite differently even within routes themselves
     
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  10. bescot

    bescot Well-Known Member

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    I'd imagine a basic bit of script in the junction signals could allow the dev to tick a box to either do flashing approach, approach from red, or approach from yellow. The red and yellow approaches could detect when the train is approaching, and clear the signal. JTMS signals in TS1 operate brilliantly as theyre set up this way.
     
    Last edited: Oct 15, 2021
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  11. Clumsy Pacer

    Clumsy Pacer Well-Known Member

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    I wonder if they could do some form of work-around, with go via instructions without the dispatch beyond setting (like on the approach to Glasgow on Cathcart)?
     
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  12. bescot

    bescot Well-Known Member

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    Wouldn't that involve them going through each train timetable to insert it in all the required locations though?

    They'd have to suppress the bleep sound and instruction completed dialogue box too. That's all we need approaching a red signal.
     
  13. facundo.dim

    facundo.dim Active Member

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    I remember playing the HST in TS, going at 160mph and find diversion signals (the flashing yellows) and act accordingly in time.
     
  14. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Sometimes I wonder if the track and signals are even joined together in that fashion in game...
     
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