Long Island Rail Road - An Unfinished Route?

Discussion in 'TSW General Discussion' started by ZeenozPlays, Nov 30, 2021.

  1. ZeenozPlays

    ZeenozPlays Well-Known Member

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    Recently, I've created a video, talking about the Long Island Rail Road route, it's many inaccuracies, and what can be done to improve the route, make it more enjoyable to play, and bring it closer to its real-life counterpart.

     
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  2. heyitspopcorn

    heyitspopcorn Well-Known Member

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    I’d be happy if they fixed the signaling system and ATC. I don’t know why American in-cab signaling is giving them such a problem, but the fact that LIRR, NEC: New York, and NEC: Boston were all okayed for release with such dysfunctional safety systems is embarrassing.
     
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  3. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

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    They can actually add Express Services between Penn Station and Jamaica the Babylon branch and for Ronkonkoma Branch trains only stop at Jamaica Mineola Hicksville. because The actual 2021 timetable has Port Jefferson trains to Huntington make local stops from Floral Park to Hicksville. Queens interlocking at Floral Park has a Max speed of 80 mph
     
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  4. MrbKlegend89

    MrbKlegend89 Well-Known Member

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    The whole DLC was inaccurate..DTG did not do proper research on the LIRR....and now im hearing Metro North Harlem Line(to NWP) is in works...of course they get the short route but others get 50 mile type route smfh....also don't forget some inaccuracies of the missions of the scenarios like Kings and Queens...The West Hempstead branch is closed at Locust Manor because of track work or some sort....ummmm that branch doesn't operate at Locust Manor lol....let's me further know they didn't PROPERLY do their research....ohhh yea how bout when its "Ronkonkoma" trains in the game, but yet the ai trains leaves on the Port Jefferson Line lol....and change at Jamaica..u make all stops to Hunterspoint Av???
     
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  5. MrbKlegend89

    MrbKlegend89 Well-Known Member

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    I also said the same like at least add the DLC to Huntington, Ronkonkoma and Port Washington line....they could've added extra trains between Jamaica and Penn Station/Atlantic Terminal....and then u have more NYP-Hempstead timetable in the game which is WAY inaccurate
     
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  6. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

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    They can run there if not stopping at St Albans where it splits off from the Babylon Branch
     
  7. JackRyan

    JackRyan Member

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    I really hope DTG will revisit the route in the future...add Grand Central Terminal, the 3rd track and maybe extend the route to Ronkokoma or Huntingdon.
     
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  8. Dinosbacsi

    Dinosbacsi Well-Known Member

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    Why would they add Grand Central Terminal to LIRR? The terminal of LIRR is the NY Penn station.

    Anyway, to keep expectations to a more realistic level, I think the current length/scope of LIRR would be fine just by implementing a better timetable. Sure, it sucks having to stop at Hicksville, but at least there are seversl branches and terminus stations included, so you can do some end-to-end runs on them. So considering route extensions are not likely, hopefully we will get a better ATC and a busier timetabke st some point.

    As the video has pointed out, including an AI only Amtrak layer into NY Penn would be great. They could also populate the yard near NY Penn with Amtrak trains, and other yards with LIRR trains and even place a few freight cars onto the freight sidings along the route.

    The problem with a freight layer is that there are no ATC compatible freight locomotives as of yet, if I'm not mistaken.

    The scenery could also be touched up and greatly improved even withlut the need for a major overhaul. Even if they don't replace the tracks on the elevated section, the area could be improved by changing a few buildings. Fix things like station lights and crossing gates not making proper bell sounds.Also add whistle boards to crossings and bridge underpasses. Maybe improve the scenery around Jamaica a bit as currently that's the worst looking psrt of the route, the trackside is too bare.

    In short, the route could be greatly improved with relatively small changed, no need for a "big overhaul" or extensions that would clearly be out of scope for such an old route.
     
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  9. JackRyan

    JackRyan Member

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    Grand Central Terminal will be the terminal of LIRR from 2022 or so. Check east side access.
     
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  10. Dinosbacsi

    Dinosbacsi Well-Known Member

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    But the in-game LIRR is set in 2014 or something like that. This is why M3s still run and there is no ASCES.
     
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  11. DTG Natster

    DTG Natster Producer Staff Member

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    ZeenozPlays appreciate the effort you've made here. I will be sure your feedback is seen.

    As for those asking whether LIRR will be updated as a part of the Grand Central Terminal add-on, I wouldn't set your hopes on that.
    At the moment there are no plans for this to be looked at as a part of the update.
     
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  12. MrbKlegend89

    MrbKlegend89 Well-Known Member

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    True the problem is West Hempstead doesn't stop at all at Locust Manor...now if they would've said Far Rockaway or Long Beach branch in the scenario details, then that would've been cool...and I think West Hempstead trains in real life stop at St Albans am rush hour only
     
  13. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

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    Far Rockaway is the realistic one because Long Beach Branch goes to Penn Station. Far Rockaway branch terminates in Atlantic Terminal
     
  14. Lunar_Twisted

    Lunar_Twisted Well-Known Member

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    The LIRR needs another look again including fixing bugs and a busier timetable to name a few like the rush hour routes. Despite the issues with the route, it's my second most played route.
     
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  15. Sparmi

    Sparmi Well-Known Member

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    ...even as a non New Yorker I also find that the not perfectly fitting skyline is one of the biggest obstacles from LIRR to being a very good route. It's clear that New York is a constantly changing city and every year more skyscrapers are added, so as a developer you have to choose a point in time when the route is set. Of course, it is more time-consuming to remodel the correct buildings than to assemble rock formations that already exist as presets. But a bit more detail can also be crucial, especially for city routes.
     
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  16. mrchuck

    mrchuck Well-Known Member

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    I hope they’ll add the port Jefferson Branch when they do the dual mode diesel locomotive because the port Jefferson Branch is the scenic Branch on the Long Island railroad.
     
  17. Dinosbacsi

    Dinosbacsi Well-Known Member

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    Same. Though I barely play it nowdays, mainly because the M7 is totally broken regarding sound and in the M3 pressing Q doesn't move the alerter handle, which is pretty annoying.

    But I used to drive a lot on the route, it could be one of my favorites if it weren't for all the issues.
     
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  18. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    As with all US passenger routes except SF-SJ, the completely broken safety systems mean this one lurks untouched on my drive, and will continue to languish unplayed until the signaling is un-bollixed.
     
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  19. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    Where the incentive updating this when there’s money to be had on the new US passenger?
     
  20. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    Because, until DTG figure out how to make US cab-signal systems work correctly, any new routes will be in the same boat as the old ones.
     
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  21. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    It’ll just be sold as fixed in a new route and Adam will pick up preserved no doubt
     
  22. ZeenozPlays

    ZeenozPlays Well-Known Member

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    Glad that one of you saw this, I really do hope that some of the feedback I gave here, and others have elsewhere get taken into consideration when the team is either building new routes in the NYC-Area or if the Preserved Collection team goes back for another round on LIRR. I just want to see the route reach its full potential, that's all.
     
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  23. Mattty May

    Mattty May Guest

    LIRR was one of my favourite routes and the very first one I played in TSW 2020. The route does feel neglected and the sound on the M7 has been ruined. I hope DTG does give it some much needed attention to improve the signalling/sound etc.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Dec 1, 2021
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  24. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    I just find it a really quiet route. I’d have thought it should be far busier. Does the m3 add a significant amount more traffic or sub in for m7 slots?
     
  25. Mattty May

    Mattty May Guest

    No, the M3 substitutes the M7. As far as I can tell, it adds no new timetable services. A whole new Rush Hour timetable with improved signalling and sound would be ideal and very welcome.
     
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  26. MrbKlegend89

    MrbKlegend89 Well-Known Member

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    That is true cuz the Far Rockaway pass through there from Atlantic Term, Long Beach u see to/from Atlantic Term..well few of them on rush hours
     
  27. Mich

    Mich Well-Known Member

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    I know it doesn't, I don't own the route, but I remember how many people were upset by the lack of new services. I also remember thinking about how odd it was that they wouldn't add more services when that was pretty much the number one complaint about the route. Honestly I kind of thought the light timetable was done in part to allow for add-ons like the M3 to add more content.
     
  28. Dinosbacsi

    Dinosbacsi Well-Known Member

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    I think we all did, back when the route first released. Then the more traffic never came.
     
  29. Crosstie

    Crosstie Well-Known Member

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    I haven't played it for the longest time and I likely won't in the future partly for the reasons stated by the previous posters, but mainly because the route is so empty and lifeless.
    Quite honestly, I think there are a number of older routes that will probably not see any attention in the future and are done and dusted from DTG's POV. I think this is one of them. Whatever was and / or wasn't done in the May 11 update is probably the last chance for LIRR redemption.
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2021
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  30. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    Honestly after watching the video and looking back, DTG honestly did a disservice to the LIRR. Not only is scenery on the line woefully inaccurate, there are still issues like with the sound cutting in and out on the m7 that has been an issue for a year now that just made me not want to touch it again along with the M3 having audio issues of its own. The last time i played lirr was to just collect the all collectables on the route and I haven't touched it since.

    The reason why this route is has a dead feeling to it is because DTG modelled the ATC system incorrectly hence why there are so few services. A full timetable was actually made according to DTG but was never implemented because of the incorrect modelling of the ATC system. Honestly this route makes Train Sim World feel like Track Sim World with the lack of trains along both branches. I honestly don't see DTG fixing the ATC signaling system at all since it would be a big job. I hope i'm wrong though.

    I do agree that this route was rushed. I get that the route came out in 2018 but it seems like not a lot of research was done on the line fully hence all the inaccuracies. If you compare the tsw2 version to real life, you will see how inacurate many parts of the route is

    DTG have a chance to salvage this route and deliver on the potential that it rightfully deserves but I just can't see that happening unfortunately. It was my most played route in tsw2020 despite the inaccuracies since I use the railroad quite often in real life but it's a shame to see the state of the route in tsw2.
     
    Last edited: Dec 6, 2021
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  31. mrchuck

    mrchuck Well-Known Member

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    maybe they’ll add a rolling stock like the DM30AC’s locomotive and the c3 cabcar to the game to make Long Island city come to life.
     
  32. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    How much money will DTG. Make on a 2018 route vs a brand new one? I think there lies the commercial answer (preserved crew or not). There's a bit more to sweep up than Adam's team would take in their remit I believe
     
  33. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

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    They need to add in Elmont station only the 8 car trains Hempstead Branch Penn Station 6 car trains Atlantic terminal must stop there if Adam wanted LIRR given Rapid Transit Treatment
     
  34. SHINO BAZ

    SHINO BAZ Well-Known Member

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    Did anyone notice that in scenario planner there's no option to start or end a service at belmont park,yet on the map it shows it has a station marker.
     
  35. PegasusLeosRailwayFanatix

    PegasusLeosRailwayFanatix Well-Known Member

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    This is how an M3 Suppose to Sound like in terms of the horn and the propulsion and AC Vent and the route suppose to look like
     
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  36. PegasusLeosRailwayFanatix

    PegasusLeosRailwayFanatix Well-Known Member

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    I believe they even got the scenery and track object wrong as well, cause when I am doing a comparison it's not matching up
     
    Last edited: Feb 2, 2022
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  37. PegasusLeosRailwayFanatix

    PegasusLeosRailwayFanatix Well-Known Member

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  38. PegasusLeosRailwayFanatix

    PegasusLeosRailwayFanatix Well-Known Member

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  39. PegasusLeosRailwayFanatix

    PegasusLeosRailwayFanatix Well-Known Member

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  40. mrchuck

    mrchuck Well-Known Member

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    Hopefully they’ll include the M9 locomotive along with the Babylon Branch.
     
  41. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

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    Good point and there are Babylon trains run Jamaica Parsons Boulevard Archer JFK airport Long Island Railroad platforms non-stop to Penn Station. For the locals they're called private express
     
  42. mrchuck

    mrchuck Well-Known Member

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    well I hope they’ll do a m9 locomotive with a bundle like the Babylon Branch.
     
  43. Dinosbacsi

    Dinosbacsi Well-Known Member

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    Honestly I wouldn't be that excited for an M9, even if they made it. I mean it looks almost the same as the M7. For some proper variety the diesel hybrids with the bi-level cars would be much better.


    As for the scenery, you're right, it's awfully inaccurate at places. But that's not even the biggest problem, as at least it looks good for the most part, if you don't compare it side by side with reality. But my three biggest problems with it is the not enough trees at Garden City, very poor trackside scenery at Jamaica and the incorrectly looking elevated section to the west. Those could really use some improvements.
     
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  44. NateDogg7a

    NateDogg7a Well-Known Member

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    I tried GWE and LIRR on TSW2020 for free on Gamepass about a year ago. GWE was good but LIRR seemed so poor. Inaccurate signalling, vacant timetable, empty streets. It turned me off to the game. When TSW2 came to Gamepass I tried again and obviously stuck with it. But I wonder how many others have tried one of the routes that are maybe not as good, and just dropped it.

    My question is if it wouldn't be better to just discontinue a route like LIRR, such as NEC-NYP, and then bring it back as a new one. Would it be worth it to the community to pay again to get something much better? Or, would the attitude be more like, DTG made it, and they should fix it? Even if that's not realistically ever going to happen? I'm any case, it seems like this might perhaps be a tangent for another thread.
     
  45. skyMutt

    skyMutt Well-Known Member

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    I've mentioned this a few times and I'm indeed in favor of just redoing the LIRR but with a different branch, much akin to what happened with the two NEC routes. Threads like these keep being brought back every now and then, so at least there is indeed some level of interest in these routes still.

    Ideally DTG should be able to fix the current LIRR route, but the thing is that this was created soo long ago and with much more primitive techniques and route building compared to what we have today. I think it's at a point where just trying to bring the route up to date and fixing all these things would basically be close to the same amount of work it'd take to start from scratch.
    If they were to indeed bring back a new and improved LIRR, DTG has plenty of options and choices in terms of branches and rolling stock
     
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  46. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    Personally I would have zero interest in funding a remake of this route, a line has to be drawn somewhere. Find something similarly different and create anew. I wouldn’t want to buy my house again because someone fitted a new door.
     
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  47. mrchuck

    mrchuck Well-Known Member

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    I’m hoping they’ll do two locomotives with a bundle the m9 locomotive with the port Washington Branch or the dual mode diesel locomotive with the port Jefferson Branch or oyster bay Branch.
     
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  48. Dinosbacsi

    Dinosbacsi Well-Known Member

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    You're totally right. I mean... they kind of messed up the first release. Why should any of us pay again to get it made a second time? Imagine if the construction company messed up your house and you would pay the whole thing again to have it built properly. Just no.

    I would buy extensions or more train add-ons for the route, but I wouldn't pay money for a fix that should be in the route from the beginning. It's in their interest to fix the route, as that way it would actually sell.
     
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  49. mrchuck

    mrchuck Well-Known Member

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    I wonder if we’ll see the m9 locomotive along with the Babylon or port Washington route on TSW 2.
     
  50. driverwoods#1787

    driverwoods#1787 Well-Known Member

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    Perhaps do the Babylon branch due to it being elevated from Valley Stream to Babylon ranging from 1930s construction all the way to 1980 Massapequa Park Station 1975 Bellmore and Merrick Stations. Penn Station to Bellmore is 45 minutes both ways.
     
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