https://live.dovetailgames.com/live/train-simulator/articles/article/anglesey-arrival Just in case you missed it "What happens if I already own them? North Wales Coast Line: Crewe - Holyhead will be arriving January 20th. Owners of the already existing Arriva and Virgin Trains branded North Wales Coastal: Crewe – Llandudno and North Wales Coastal Route Extension: Crewe – Holyhead will receive this new version in their library containing Avanti West Coast and Transport for Wales. Do not worry the original routes and branding will still stay a part of your collection. " It does not mention if you only owned the first section - Crewe to Llandudno
Jamie has posted in the Dovetail article section that those of us who do not own the Holyhead extension and only own the Crewe - Llandudno/Conwy section won't get it free as an upgrade.
I hope there is a discount for owners of the base route given we already own half the route. I came along two months too late to pick up the route, and it has been a thorn in the collection for some time seeing scenario after scenario that cannot be played on the base route. As for how I got the base route? A 2018 key. But the second half has been unavailable even on key resellers.
Same here, I got the half-NWC via TS2018 from Humblebundle in their sale about three or so months ago. Very glad i didn't pay full price in hindsight. But perhaps not enough hindsight to wait until now! Come to think of it I did exactly the same thing with SWC/SWML too.
They didn't discount "part owners" of the SWC pre merge so I highly doubt they will with the NWC, slightly frustrating but still pleased Llanfairpwllgwyngyllgogerychwrndrobwllllantysiliogogogoch* will be making a comeback. Oh and welcome TfW to the official TS20xx family. It Makes little to no odds to me now thanks to AP and MJW but still it's nice that the talks were successful and we representin' officially. *No, I didn't fall asleep on my keyboard
I don't run NWC very much as I also did not have the full route. And I doubt I will get this full version - maybe in a Sale but...
Like others, I got NWC with a Humble Bundle sale on TS2018, but was too late to acquire the extension, which was no longer available. Not sure how much it was?
Yeah, I got it through humble bundle on sale late last year too as it was needed for several freeware routes.
TBF, all of you (myself included) who picked up NWC cheap through Humble Bundle can't really then complain about paying full price for this re-release (alternatively you could be patient and wait till it's eventually reduced in a sale, next Halloween or Christmas probably). The one's I genuinely feel sorry for are the ones who bought NWC before its withdrawal at full price on Steam or in the DTG store but for whatever reason did not buy the Holyhead extension who now have to go out and buy this re-release.
Wait, I actually didn't get it on sale (having just checked my receipts). I paid full price for it back in June (it did go on sale a few days after though) so Harrogate Loop and a few other freeware routes would work. It does irk me a little that if I want the full route, I'll have to pay again for half a route but tbh, it's the same situation with the new Chatham line. I own all parts of that already except the new addition to Dover Priory.
Dovetail has really been on the right track recently! (No pun intended) Re-releasing Marias Pass and now the North Wales Coast Line is back! This is fantastic.
I got TS2018 some time ago, but the Holyhead extension was no longer available. I posted about it here, saying that I'd buy the extension if it was re-released: Nwc And Holyhead Extension And I stand by my word, if the new route is made available with a sensible discount for owners of Crewe-Llandudno, then I'm gonna get it on the day of release. If there's no discount at all... that would be dissapointing and I would need to re-consider my options. :/ When the old versions of the route were available, Crewe-Llandudno was 24.99 GBP, While the Holyhead extension was 9.99 GBP.
We can’t be certain it’ll be the featured route in TS2023 (on discount next Xmas) can we? The UK route might be Chatham.
It it doubtful if there would be a discount for owners of Crewe-Llandudno They did not give any discount to owners of the Chatham routes - that route can wait until it comes down in price
It's more likely it will be Dover. They previously featured Faversham, and Faversham is redone on that route, so I can see them going back to that in the yearly bundle. It's part of the reason I haven't bought it yet, but also owning the Chatham Mainline portion (BTW, also featured I think in a yearly bundle, or at least on the GBRJ bundle) and having no discount for that really put me off for the time being. That said, I never buy new routes at full price. I want to see which ones get featured. That way, there's a good chance enough custom content exists for it by the time I would get it and a lot of potential use for it. As for NWC? We need the Chester expansion to Shrewsbury. I have been vocal on this. Crewe to Shrewsbury is also needed. I suggested add this and the Conwy Valley Line to the re-release of NWC, but it looks like it will be the same route with new branding instead. I am waiting to see if the suggested expansion is created. If it is, it will combine NWC most likely in a full route, and I have a suspicion a deluxe offering around it might be the surprise for the 2023 bundle.
It could be the new CML, but more likely a new UK route which should arrive by the time a TS2023 would be expected. I would like a Chester/Crewe extension to the Welsh Marches also, but as regards to merging it to the NWC/SWC routes, you're talking about a 4+ hour drive from one end to the other, which I doubt many people will do more than once.
No one ever has to run it end-to-end. The idea is to create more scenario potential, whereby perhaps a service may pick up at Shrewsbury for a run up to Holyhead, or you can start at Chester and head towards Newport. It's the links that provide scenario potential that come into play. You can also chart a service along the full route without using the separate route files, as a multi-scenario series.
There's a very good Conwy valley 3rd party expansion out there: https://backdatedtrainsim.weebly.com/conwy-valley-line.html
It's on BackdatedTrainSim as freeware. I was hopeful perhaps it could be added to the payware since it already adds directly into the payware route. The installer will need to be updated for the new version of the route, however.
I know, but I'm still voicing my opinion that it's weird to: Give a 100% discount to those who own 100% of the original product While giving 0% discount to those who own 78% of the original product. Makes for bad company PR if you ask me. Especially given the fact that the only new thing seems to be the branding textures.
On the other hand, the fact I never had an opportunity to buy the Holyhead extension from the time I first started playing means I don't qualify for the free update, so would be expected to buy half the line again as part of a full price route. Not as bad as having to buy two thirds of owned railway to get Dover, but I won't get into that here. There is one thing we agree on here: there is potentially bad PR in this. And this is two releases in a row doing this. Better decisions need to be made by the appropriate people to at least give a discount where appropriate. It's not all about getting new players. I'll wait and see what happens with the next annual version before worrying about buying either. By then, sales will be occurring.
It would be good If DTG gave a discount to those people who already owned part of a route when extended. As they don't I will just wait for a Sale to get a route By which time I might have lost the interest in it and I save some more money
It also gives you a chance to see if it gets used by scenario creators or not. The problem with NWC is it is already heavily-used. The problem with it being heavily-used, meanwhile, is that the scenarios reference the skins from the original version of the route, so stock would often have to be swapped with new versions. This is problematic even if the basic non-branded versions get added to the new version because the reference location is different than the original. So we'll see what happens with the new version. I suspect having today's liveries in there will make it as much used.
That's exactly my situation. We are in the same boat - I had the Crewe-Llandudno as part of a TS18, purchase, but never had the Holyhead extension. So if there won't be a possibility to get a discount on the new merged route, then I would end up having to pay 100% for something that I already own 78% of. (Crewe-Llandudno was 25 GBP, Holyhead expansion was 10 GBP) And don't get me wrong - the Crewe-Llandudno route is very good itself as a route. I'm gonna advise new people to buy the new merged route. I'm a fan of the route and I was one of the people who kept posting saying: "Hey, can the North Wales route and dlc be released unbranded maybe?". I'm still happy they did it. I just think it would be fair to have those us us who own Crewe-Llandudno get a proportional discount, so that buying the new route now we would pay something proportionate to what were would pay when buying the Holyead expansion in 2019.
I would look for a 50% discount, personally. That is proportionately fair. You really own half the route, as do I. Just like the argument with the Dover and Ramsgate route where I can say I own two thirds of the route in a sense, but even from the perspective of Faversham being a new production I really only own 1/3 of the route (after all, the old Faversham scenarios in the Workshop would not work on the new route) and would want at least a 33% discount on that route. We're talking being fair here.
Just trying to get my head around this new NWC update. (bear with, I am somewhated aged) I currently own NWC Crewe - Llandudno, Virgin liveried (2018 Release) I Don't have Hollyhead extension. With the new release do I get :- A - Another version of NWC Crewe to Llandudno with new liveried stock. - Free I then have 2 versions - (1 x Virgin & 1 x Avanti) B - Nothing - I have to buy the whole thing from scratch, C - I buy the new package but then have the whole route (including Hollyhead) "Avanti branded" & also keep my Virgin branded original as a separate route? Also I take it any workshop scenarios using the old Virgin branded pack will not work with this new version? So many questions ........... I do apologise
I bought the original Crewe to Llandudno route for 24.99. If I want the Holyhead extension I will have to pay another 24.99.That is ruddy ridiculous and unfair seeing as you can now get the whole route for 24.99 Not a good way to treat your loyal supporters, Dovetail.
I belive that C is what will happen, as I have the old branded South Wales Coastal (Bristol to Cardiff) And I had to buy the new South Wales Coastal which was the unbranded Bristol to Swansea version, and I bought it and I kept the old South Wales Coastal. So I believe it will be the same thing with the new NWC.
They SHOULD work. However, there are notable conditions. The first is that you have to move the scenarios to the new route's folder. You can use a guide thread I posted regarding scenario corruption via the Workshop conversion process to find the location of that, outside of the Railworks folder in a "workshop" folder, and just open the scenarios there, copying them directly into the new route's folder inside "Railworks/Content/Routes". The scenario should then function exactly as it did on the original route. The second condition only applies if liveries in the original route are used in the scenario. In this circumstance, you'll have to use a third-party tool to swap stock. Since you own the first half of the route, this may not be an issue for you; you should after all have much of the stuff included in the Holyhead expansion save maybe one or two liveries (hopefully stock references aren't made to the Holyhead folder over the base route), so the scenario will be able to reference liveries in the original route's folder correctly. Anyone not owning the first half (and if you don't, go find a 2018 key while you still can so you too can have Virgin liveries) will have to swap any stock referenced with the original route to the new stock referenced by the new route to make the Workshop scenario function correctly. However, it SHOULD function properly provided swaps are engineered correctly. If you know what you're doing, you can also change the reference in the ScenarioProperties file yourself, but this is advanced user stuff and you're better off using the third-party tool in order to not muck up something else that breaks the scenario.
Just want to add that things can get messed up if you have two copies of a scenario residing in different places (e.g. Donner Pass and Donner Pass Redux, or branded/unbranded UK routes). It is advisable to clone it to give it a new unique GUID. Scenarios suddenly disappear, I've had that case and it took me some time to figure out what the problem was (with 190 routes installed). (Original Seeberg scenarios copied to [WS] Seeberg route folder without removing the original ones.) TS refers to scenarios only by the GUID, no matter what they are named.
The South Wales routes, Bristol - Cardiff, Bristol - Swansea and Bristol - Swansea unbranded do have a unique id number although they are similar
Indeed. If you sub to a Workshop scenario, and then use my advice to move it to the route's new folder, make sure to then unsubscribe. Otherwise, you will have a second copy you can't use, and it may mess up in the menu.
The route is out now with a 10% discount on Steam. As mentioned elsewhere in the thread, the free update only applies to those who own the whole route from Crewe to Holyhead.
Think I'll hold back on this one. I can't justify £22.99 just for the extension from Llandudno to Hollyhead Also I would not be able to link my Backdated Trainsim Conway Valley extension which currently does not work with this new version.
I just bought it, for 51.25 Australian Dollars since it was on a 10% discount and I've never owned North Wales Coastal before, and I must say it's a good addition to my train sim collection! I really like it
You could probably jig it to work. Remember with SWC, which I own fully, that "BristoltoCardiff" and "SouthWales01" are the same, and "CardifftoSwansea" and "SouthWales02" are the same, just with branding being the difference. The routes are unique to each package of assets. So if you can figure out the install and how it works for the base route, you can probably jig it to work with the new version, or even rename the new version of the route (in Content) to the old name temporarily and do the install, then restore the name and test whether it works. The only complication would be if specific assets come from the old NWC, so you might have to create a copy in Assets under the old location (unpacked in this case, I'd suggest) until BTS gets around to updating the install to the new version of the route. If this interests you, I may be able to produce a mini guide for this, but the route will probably be updated within a week, so it may not be worth it.
I suspect that Backdated Trainsim will update the Conway Valley extension to work with the new route Half of the work will be changing the file references
Thanks for the offer, to be honest allowing myself to dive that deep into TS could be fatal, I know what I am like . As you say Backdatedtrainsim will no doubt have a fix in no time and to be honest I am quite happy running Virgin / Arriva era for the time being. If I want to run Avanti / TFW I can easily swap out in TS Tools, I already own all the rolling stock that comes with the new route. That is what is making it not cost effective, I would be spending £22.99 for just 9 miles of scenery. I am in no hurry, I may pick it up at some point in a sale whenever that may be.
I thought the part to Holyhead was more than 9 miles? And not included at all, even the track, without the extension?
How are folk getting on with the scenarios - any potential bugs detected? I have just been trying the Class 175 1K72 1823 Holyhead to Crewe scenario just now - on approach to Colwyn Bay, I get an AWS alert before a green signal. It doesn't appear to be for a speed sign - the next change is down just 10mph - but admittedly I don't know this route, and the scenario is at night. But next, before Abergele and Pensarn, I get an AWS 'ping' when the signal is at yellow! Can someone else try the scenario and see if they are experiencing similar issues?
Glad to see that Ai services are in the quickdrives once again, seems there is a dearth of missing Ai in a lot of quickdrives on different routes these days! Pity, DtG didn't update the route to today's standard particularly since network rail has upgraded the signals on the route now. https://www.railwaymagazine.co.uk/5539/north-wales-coast-upgrades-complete/ https://www.networkrailmediacentre....e-gbp-50m-north-wales-railway-upgrade-project
I don't know if its considered a bug or that I'm just a bad driver but the Class 158 scenario "Returning to Holy Island" has some very challenging stops, in terms of time management. I ended up almost failing because of how late I was to some of the stops. (I'm not sure if it's the same for the other Class 158 scenarios, I haven't tried them yet) However one thing I did notice with the Class 158 is some sort of texturing bug in the window next to the driver's seat, it's in the top right of the window. Some sort of black square, and it's strange because you can see the tree overlapping it slightly. However I used the outside view and this mysterious black square is not there. (I put a red arrow next to it just to be sure you know what I'm talking about)
It's because DtG uses default 158's, that is an old old bug with the window, not there with AP's enhancement pack upgrade.
That window bug has been around for a long time, multiple other DLCs that include a Class 158 have the same issue.
I ran this one recently and had same problems. Ended up 'spadding' and re ran it again, quite confusing really and I find it hard to see the semaphore signals from distance, it's a tricky one to complete.
