I'm curious to know how many are driving with these systems enabled and how it effects their experience of a route. I'd love to know what keeps people interested in a route when not using safety systems.
My aim is to get as close as possible to realistic operation, within reason, that's what's fun for me personally. Before I could use a keyboard and the new controller system to only acknowledge SIFA, I usually run with only PZB. Since then I've always used every safety system on every system. I have used those systems for so long that they are integral and essential part of the experience for me, and I can't imagine running without them, and is the main reason why I simply do not enjoy the US routes, until they fix ATC/ACSES and CSS, and I'd go as far as saying that I'm not enjoying Chemntiz too much because of the lack of a community-made Buchfahrplan, which doesn't allow me to realistically run hudless. That said it's still enjoyable to run with routes that do not have these systems, mainly the UK. In fact some of my favourite DLCs are British.
When it comes to German routes, I drive with all systems enabled and HUD completely off. It makes it feel as realistic as possible, but unfortunately it only works like that on the German routes. On the British routes, I also have all systems enabled, but I keep the next-station part of the HUD on, since the mileposts are pretty much unreadable and there is no other way to safely know in which notch the accelerator/brake lever is. As said before, those systems are essential and it feels wrong to not have them on. One reason I couldn't touch RT in a long time now unfortunately with the PZB bug on the Talent :/
It's actually kind of the opposite for me. Route learning for the UK routes as you said it's tough, and requires some willingness and time, but once you get it it's just so incredibly rewarding, for example I'm getting back into ECW and SEHS and I could tell you my braking points and speed limits off the top of my head. The small size of the TSW routes makes it possible to do so without the weeks and weeks of study a real driver would need, but it still requires more work than relying on mileposts. For the german routes instead I can't go Hudless without the relative documentation, like Buchfahrplans (which I get from here)
I have tried to learn PZB but no matter how careful I am to acknowledge stuff I always seem to get caught out & it just spoils it for me! I need to go re-watch Matt's tutorial!
Well, obviously I don't know the German routes by hard, but that is what I like, I don't have to I don't need to know any speed limit, I get told all I need along the route. And I have a list with the station locations, so no need for HUD or learning anything there either And for the throttle/brake setting, the information given on the in-train displays and gauges feels more informative for me than on the british trains For the British routes, I know the speed limits, but I'm still hesitant with the stations and I couldn't tell if the throttle is in 1 or 4 without looking down all the time
Oh yeah about the throttle I just count the key presses and keep the throttle position in my head, the sound of the handle moving is essential. I also do this for operating the brakes of german trains, sometimes I just feel so stupid just counting 1, 2, 3 etc... lol I'd love to use my HOTAS to control modern UK traction, but I guess it's not a priority for DTG...
I agree, route learning is quite fun. However it does concern me that in the UK we haven't come up with a better system to avoid overshoots...
At first not confident with PZB since I only used Sifa only on Main Spessart Bahn and after my experience with PZB emergency stop recovery on Main Spessart Bahn. I started being confident on the use of PZB on all German Routes that I have SKA HRR and future OBB routes from the mistake
Before TSW I knew nothing about German trains never mind PZB\LZB etc. but, I took some time to learn the safety systems and I saw the routes in a whole new light and they became so much more enjoyable. Now I can’t play the German stuff with safety systems switched off!
After taking some time in learning how to use the German safety systems, I am finding it easy use. Now like TinTin_57 everytyime I do something German I have to have the systems turned on,.
After spending most of today with PZB on & using different trains than the other day I think on Nahverkehr Dresden some trains are bugged with PZB Acknowledgement! Hardly been caught out today except when I was speeding in start-up mode
I am constantly forgetting the exact rules of PZB but I do enjoy playing with it on nevertheless, it gives a much more involving experience, especially when making it through an entire route without setting it off. It changes how you see the route and actually makes route learning easier as it makes it easier to remember spots with significant speed reductions. UK routes tend to take me longer to remember where the big drops are coming, as it is purely based on geographic knowledge of the route or using the HUD. SIFA I usually turn on because it isn't difficult and really something so basic shouldn't be hard to follow, but I do find it one of the most annoying systems given how loud it shouts at you for complying! So I have no problem turning it off if I want peace and quiet. LZB is rather wonderful on the high speed routes, true it does take away the manual driving element, but it feels more like what driving at high speed should, the safety system doing most of the work and me monitoring for any necessary braking assistance. I am much happier knowing the train is at least partially taking care of itself at higher speeds than me having to make sudden decisions that feel all the more urgent because of the speed. Even travelling at 60mph on NTP can feel stressful knowing you have slow-reacting brakes and big reduction coming up.
I can't say I've experienced any of these bugs, when i started out i thought there were a few bugs too but there's so much nuance in PZB that takes a while to learn.
It's definitely true that PZB/LZB are very safe systems. I totally agree that it makes you more involved with the train, i find it very satisfying.
Took me a while learning PZB when I first got into TSW, watched a couple of playthroughs on German routes such as RSN and RT and now, I can’t play a German route without all three safety systems switched on. Makes driving British and American passenger routes easy in comparison. Even though both America and Europe have speed based signals while over in the U.K., we still heavily relying on drivers knowledge of route based signals.
I learned PZB/LZB/SIFA/AFB back in the ProTain Perfect days. It took a while, at first I did a lot wrong or was simply overwhelmed when, for example, SIFA and PZB yelled at me at the same time. In the meantime, it has become second nature and I drive with PZB and SIFA in a very relaxed way. At some point you operate SIFA quite unconsciously. I don't want to drive without the system any more, it seems like arcade to me. And LZB in particular, in conjunction with AFB, is ultimately even a great simplification. But as with automatic landing in an aircraft, you still have to be ahead of the machine and always be ready to intervene if necessary (e.g. if the AFB cannot maintain the braking curve correctly). So in a certain way it is easier and yet demanding at the same time.
I always have all safety systems on. Generally I'm used to PZB now and rarely get brake penalties any more. That said, only today I was approaching an Expect Stop distant on a freight to Freiburg (Sachs), was concentrating hard on my braking curve to get below 70 (in mode M), and a result I completely forgot to ack the 1000 Hz as I passed the signal! Muppet
