The Start Of A New Journey? Might Not...

Discussion in 'TSW General Discussion' started by George C. Barnes, Feb 5, 2022.

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Will you buy the "New journey" DLC?

Poll closed Apr 5, 2022.
  1. Buying just after launch/At full price

    36 vote(s)
    30.3%
  2. Wait until a bigger discount

    25 vote(s)
    21.0%
  3. Not interested in/Not gonna buy

    33 vote(s)
    27.7%
  4. Wait for reviews and then decide

    25 vote(s)
    21.0%
  1. George C. Barnes

    George C. Barnes Member

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    https://steamcommunity.com/app/1282590/eventcomments/3183484418859367979

    The number of services is far more than enough for almost all current routes/locos, for me, I'm really don't want new extra journeys if those journeys still stay at their current poor quality. I doubt how many people will finish ALL services even in a single route. I got to level 120 in TSW2, that's not very high, but even though, I'm still far away from really finishing all services for even one route.
    I mean, what extra do you provide in your "official services" compared to the scenario editor services I made up?
    A services info doc?
    A route info doc?
    A halting stations or mileposts doc?
    Even a little scenario such as "a car broke down on the rail and I need to performer EBrake by myself and re-routing to another track"?
    You simply provide NOTHING! Just drive from A to B.
    So why I wanna buy (I suppose that your gonna sell it, not as a free update) your "new" services that have nothing "new"? I can make up one on my own.

    DTG, please look at me and tell me, is "repair fences, putting up signs, etc." supposed to add in a TRAIN DRIVE-based simulator? Those gameplays were literally trash, the game designer whoever made up this idea should be ****** out. Can't you just use the efforts for "putting broken signs" to "finish onboard electronic systems"? Tell me, how many functions did you cut off from onboard electronic control systems? You are a train simulator, not a construction simulator, focus on the train, please?

    I know, you just want free money, don't you? Selling me the same DLC twice with nothing really new, right? Fine, that's your game, you can do whatever.
    But beware, we were buying "sh*t" DLCs doesn't mean we like those, it's just the way that we want or wish you and those third parties could be done better next time, and "a better next time" is nothing like this. Our patience is limited, if you keep failing us, you will face your own consequences someday.

    With the growth of the number of sim games, you were already not the only one or two train sim games that we could only choose on the market. There were a lot with similar graphics but much better gameplay. You are losing your position, don't you see that?

    I'm saying this is not because I hate this game, instead, I love this game. We would all be happy to seeing you moving aggressively and beyond other train simulators. DTG, please stop putting rotten and start taking advantage of other sim games as well as your community feedback. We all wish you could have better features, but that's more depends on yourself than us.

    Best Regard
     
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  2. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    Fix the ones we’ve got first that are broken and prevent you actually advancing a routes journey mode. Or fix the broken save game which means you can’t guarantee a service will resume correctly, so again stuck with being unable to advance.
    Might be worth £1 in a sale, but no more.
     
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  3. trainsimplayer

    trainsimplayer Well-Known Member

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    The Köln and Bakerloo timetables are incredibly bare. You can be waiting 20 minutes for a train in the tunnels on Bakerloo, whilst in real life it wouldn't be near that amount of time. As for Köln there isn't much to do, or see, and the base timetable only has two trains, on a busy international (Many services continue into Belgium and such) line.

    Firstly, by services you can mean many things.
    1 - Timetable Mode. This is a regular timetable, no funny business, no random events closing the line, just another day at the office.
    2 - Journey Mode - a hand-picked selection of Timetable services and Scenarios, with the weather and such being set.
    3 - Scenarios, which is were something like what you say would happen.

    Also, Dovetail's services are meant to be simple - primarily in timetable mode - whilst scenarios can have different settings. Also, you may be able to make these types of scenarios, however not everyone can. So I wouldn't make a point of it.

    Get Cathcart or something then. Most trains have a start and end point.
    Don't buy it then. This expansion pack (as stated on previous streams) is aimed at people who want a fresh experience on the core routes, or aren't skilled in Livery or Scenario designers.

    It's purpose was to encourage the to get up and go for a walk around - a major selling point of TSW1.
    They aren't mandatory, and it's there for people who enjoy that type of thing.

    The onboard systems are almost certainly done by a different team than the people who add the collectables, at least in DTG.

    Eh? How are they selling you the same thing? The expansion pack adds new gameplay to the core routes, which I note everyone has with the game, with some existing rolling stock being modified.

    Who's We/Us.

    I don't think that's true. TSW still strongly caters to it's market of UK/US/DE, with Rivet Games bringing Switzerland into the fold.

    For the most part TSW has improved in the last year significantly. Bar BML's outstanding issues, and crashes on the Rush Hour routes in general, the game has done well, with DLCs at a good quality.

    This pack is an experiment, the same way DLGW was, the same was TSW itself was, and it's a first time venture into this type of thing.
     
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  4. meridian#2659

    meridian#2659 Well-Known Member

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    For me every expansion is welcome. In this case köln achen gets a lot of enhancement beside the additional services.

    The main benefit of those packs: people who are not interested for whatever reasons can just skip whitout loosing anything.

    I like to have empty stock on tracks, have as many services as possible and im not spending time in the livery designer.

    So this dlc exactly the right thing for me and i hope there will be more.
     
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  5. Tank621

    Tank621 Well-Known Member

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    How am I meant to know if I'll buy it at full price or discounted if we don't even know the price yet?
     
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  6. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    I don't play any of the base routes so no reason to buy an expansion for those routes...
     
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  7. Tom Fresco

    Tom Fresco Well-Known Member

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    Me neither, im not into spg, would be into bakerloo if it had the realistic timetable, and SKA ist just empty without layers, which i luckily have, but even then if you have been to Cologne Hbf, it doesnt capture the feeling of the very busy station, which i hope improoves with the extra AI Traffic in the Pack.
    So im looking forward to see more variety around cologne with fitting rolling stock like the 425, 101 and static wagons in the yard.
    This pack can get me back to a route which gets enhanced by a proper timetable.
     
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  8. LeadCatcher

    LeadCatcher Well-Known Member

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    Another rant thinly disguised as a poll. And the poll question poorly designed to reflect the opinion of the pollster.

    I do not have a problem with the OP putting forth his opinion, just doing so will generate discussion - l disagree with his comments which is immaterial to this reply. Just rather tired of all these polls as of late.
     
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  9. Tonto62

    Tonto62 Well-Known Member

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    I won't be buying this because I have no interest in the base routes. The concept though is a good one and if applied to a route I enjoy, Tees Valley for example, I would buy it straight away.
     
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  10. Crosstie

    Crosstie Well-Known Member

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    Yes, I agree. Why do some people feel the need to express their opinion in a useless poll instead of simply stating their point of view.

    Polls should be labeled as such in the title and perhaps have their own sub forum, where most of them could be easily ignored.
     
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  11. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    I'm into UK heavy rail and timetables with adverse signals, preferably on a network basis
    If I didn't have to have bakerloo installed I wouldn't
     
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  12. redrev1917

    redrev1917 Well-Known Member

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    Depends on the price point tbh - if its similarly priced to a Loco DLC or the Arosa Line Pack then it will be a day 1 purchase for me. If its closer in price to a new route then it'll stay in my basket until a sale.
     
  13. redrev1917

    redrev1917 Well-Known Member

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    If you go into your PAK folder (if default it will be here C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\steamapps\common\Train Sim World 2\WindowsNoEditor\TS2Prototype\Content\Paks) you can just delete the route, like I have done. Downside is if you do a file verification of get a patch then steam will automatically redownload it apparently, although this hasnt happened to me (yet).
     
  14. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    The comments on steam about this pack are really something. I get why people feel that way though. Personally im not interested in the Bakerloo or SPG version of the pack so an option to buy it sepreate like how rush hour was would be nice to see in my opinion
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2022
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  15. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    I wonder how many experiments dtg have to do frankly. Can't they just be confident in what they release? Honestly when I hear experiment, it sounds like a beta.
     
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  16. fanta1682002

    fanta1682002 Well-Known Member

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    very simple i would not buy it
     
  17. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    Personally I don't see the issue with the poll. It's either you will buy it, you won't buy it, wait and see what others say first or wait for a sale. The wait for a sale can be argued odd since a price hasn't been announced but frankly I don't see the issue with that to be frank.

    It's yes, no, maybe, or yes but at a later date with a lower price. Reasonable options quite frankly
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2022
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  18. trainsimplayer

    trainsimplayer Well-Known Member

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    They haven't done and expansion pack like this on TSW - so it's a commercial experiment more than anything.
     
  19. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    If they haven't done something before and don't know what the reaction would be then the word fits. I'm sure they know how to make a timetable and add stock (kind of, sort of working, mostly...)
     
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  20. redrev1917

    redrev1917 Well-Known Member

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    debating if you will buy it at full price or only at a discount price is rediculous when we dont know the price point.
     
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  21. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    Not really sure how adding additional services to a pre existing route would count as a experiment to be honest. They already did that with rapid transit and that got praise from what I recall. The issue was the safety systems on RT not working properly though
     
  22. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    And yet there are some that have already said they buy at day one without knowing the price. I bet those same people would pay $100 at day one if DTG were to announce the price at $100
     
  23. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Adding timetables and content to three routes, and selling them all in one pack is the new thing. They've added timetables before, and GWE:DL was a trial in itself, but this is multiple routes...
     
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  24. redrev1917

    redrev1917 Well-Known Member

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    Which makes this poll completely nonesense as a guage to how popular this DLC is going to be, if it was £100 are those X number who voted day 1 really going to go through with their purchase?
     
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  25. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    Frankly there are some that would although let's face it dtg wouldn't charge that amount of money. I do agree that the wait for a sale option is odd since we don't know a price though but the poll seems fine
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2022
  26. Tigert1966

    Tigert1966 Well-Known Member

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    I voted day 1 without knowing the price. But only because you can pretty much guess the price range and I already know I‘ll want 2 out of 3 parts. Plus last I heard polls are not legally binding so if it is too expensive, I just won’t buy it.

    The poll is, in my opinion, totally useless though. This forum is a minority of users so it won’t reflect the user base at all.

    I had my doubts about Diesel Legends and Rivets Arosa expansion and have really enjoyed both, so I think I‘m safe that I‘ll enjoy this one.
     
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  27. ShaneS89

    ShaneS89 Active Member

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    I'll be getting this for the new SKA timetable, I've no real interest in the other routes in the pack but I can see why they were chosen. If they were to do timetable packs for some of the other German routes I'd probably jump at them too, with the amount of stock now available they could transform the older routes like MSB.
     
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  28. tallboy7648

    tallboy7648 Well-Known Member

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    Yeh i see what your saying. I mean let's face it the new content isn't really special or groundbreaking in my opinion at least. All we get is additional services for SKA with effectively an semi inaccurate train and portions of the logos of the livery on the 423 not being accurate along with the style of the train's PIS. A SD40 in CSX livery. A 1972 stock in a sliver livery which somebody could probably have done that in the livery designer or livery designer 2.0 (whenever that releases) in probably less than 30 minutes along with a few services that apparently DTG can now add despite them saying that they couldn't add additional services to the Bakerloo line and some extra scenarios.

    Sure selling them as a bundle hasn't been done before, but the concept has been done before in one way or another. So really it does seem like a cheap way just to get some money in the bank. Otherwise the ska timetable for example would've been a free update since the RT timetable was a free update

    I do like the idea of adding additional services, but considering that the RT timetable came as a free update, it'll be interesting to see how much they charge for it.
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2022
  29. Crosstie

    Crosstie Well-Known Member

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    No, of course not. The Diesel Legends Pack was $23 (£17; €20 ) and I expect this Expansion Pack to be no more than that.
     
    Last edited: Feb 5, 2022
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  30. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Personally I don't want groundbreaking, I want to drive trains. I want to shunt, bring into service, take out of service, drive in service, load freight, offload freight...
    Other than that what is there to DO in a train which is a mass transit system rather than a high octane form of fun?
     
  31. DTG Natster

    DTG Natster Producer Staff Member

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    My advice to everyone before making up your minds on this.

    Watch the preview streams in full and ask questions to the team about the pack if there's anything you aren't sure about.

    We will be posting a questions thread for the stream next week.

    Don't make up your minds and decide you don't like it before you've given the pack a fair shot.

    Some of you are going to enjoy it and some of you aren't. This is okay.
     
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  32. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    The only two valid answers in this poll are "I will never buy it, no way, no how" and "I'll wait and see" (this is/would be my answer to every such poll, since I never buy any DLC until the post-release reviews come in). The others require material not in evidence, to wit the price.
     
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  33. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    I'm not sold on it at the moment. The Koln element, yeah perhaps, I like the German routes to be busy.
    One thing I do like with the German routes is the multitude of different track paths you can take depending on your service chosen.

    Bakerloo to me is a dead horse to me to be honest. Maybe I've not given it enough love but I don't think it was the best choice of tube route.I just find it dull, dont see nothing, don't really pass anything. It feels like a tube service operated during an apocalypse. I dare say this route was busier with trains and people in April 2020 during lockdown.

    SPG - Now these big American freighters are growing on me more. They did good with the bigger consists. I'm hoping horseshoe has some big ones. I'd love to play SPG with harder consists but its an older route now so the experience elsewhere would be welcome.

    New American freight trains to try would be good too.
     
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  34. meridian#2659

    meridian#2659 Well-Known Member

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    Cant share your opinion about bakerloo. Im glad they included this one, and since i enhance my experience my own way not a single route is getting boring to me . We all know the bakerloo is technically limited, so it wont probably ever have more services than now.

    For fans of the tube, i set my hopes in just trains, they sell a ts version of the metropolitan line. As for their first addon i highly doubt i will be another LU Route.

    Here a sheet for hypochondriacs, using the Bakerloo Line next time ;):
    1.jpg
     

    Attached Files:

  35. George C. Barnes

    George C. Barnes Member

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    As you said, the current services are not very good, but the point is I don't think the "new" services pack could make any difference or better. Well, I'll be happy if I'm wrong and DTG really did something, but I'm not sure that's gonna happened.

    I know how different modes work, I'm just suggesting that there is no needs to add more timetables due to few people being able to complete all of them even for now. And the majority part that the new pack have is timetable services.
    For those scenarios, most(not all) of them are not much different with timetable, which only thing DTG adds subtitles, no funny stuff.
    The "no funny business" is too much, making a poor gameplay-ability.

    If one could possibly finish all services for a route, I believe that one can make their own services using scenario editor.

    Players can walk in the game world never should become a "major selling point." I knew the old TS20XX can't walk, but dude, is 2022 now, not 2002, and it's TSW2, not 1.
    Also, DTG has limited production ability, if they put more effort into "walk-around" stuff, they will have to put less effort into train itself. Would you like to see DTG make less care/effort on trains?

    Typically, for this game (in my opinion)
    A new stuff = New route or New Loco
    A new gameplay = Something beyond current timetable mode and scenario mode (which DTG never achieved yet, maybe an RPG mode idk)

    The new pack, Hmmm...

    That's a good question. Guess, please.

    Simply publishing a new route or loco is not gonna reinforced their position. Not that simple. A poor new route or loco could even make things worse. Only a good quality with funny gameplay stuff will do so, but DTG's quality is not very stable, and gameplay is... well, boring. A timetable mode with no additional details (services info/route info/halting stations or mileposts doc) and a scenario mode with zero freedom (freedom != player can walk around). I won't say that's funny.
     
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  36. George C. Barnes

    George C. Barnes Member

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    Did you notice there is a Wait for reviews and then decide option?
    And you could change your vote after launch, if the vote is still valid.
     
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  37. George C. Barnes

    George C. Barnes Member

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    This is not a poll, it is a rant. Are you satisfied now?
    The vote was just set up in 30 secs so poor quality for sure.
     
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  38. Clumsy Pacer

    Clumsy Pacer Well-Known Member

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    Yes because the people who do the scenery and gameplay are also the people who model the trains, in the same way that people who look after a train company's twitter are also train drivers - they actually look at twitter and reply while driving a train at high speed.
     
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  39. George C. Barnes

    George C. Barnes Member

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    You could always make some estimate, and you can change your vote if your estimate is wrong.
     
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  40. George C. Barnes

    George C. Barnes Member

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    Please learn the difference between posting a tweet and making a game.

    You seem so sure that your metaphor is correct while it might not.
     
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2022
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  41. Lamplight

    Lamplight Well-Known Member

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    That’s not the point of more services. The point is to make routes busier/more realistic.
     
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  42. George C. Barnes

    George C. Barnes Member

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    I got your point, but imo, as a sim game it needs to be realistic, but it also desired to be fun. So adding a large list of services, yes, the timetable might look more real, but I'm not buying games just to look at the timetable page. When you play the new services, those might have no difference between old ones, same route, same loco, same goal, NO FUN.

    Again, I'll be happy if I'm wrong and DTG really did something new beyond the current gameplay modes, but I'm not sure that's gonna happened.
     
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  43. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    Exactly. BML is great because it's always in motion, trains headed in all directions all the time. Bakerloo is dull, even beyond its being a subway, because it runs about 4 trains an hour rather than 12.
     
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  44. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    You're rather missing the point. A full timetable isn't good so that people can read it, it's good because the route is full of life while you're driving it.
     
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  45. cloudyskies21

    cloudyskies21 Well-Known Member

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    Regarding this, I'm in the 'not interested/not going to buy' category. However, just so DTG understands my reasoning, this decision is based purely on the routes involved. I think the idea of expansion packs for routes is a great idea if it bolsters the freshness of an already decent older-released route, namely timetable expansion as opposed to a new livery. I mean, if East Coastway were to benefit from the addition of London services in timetable mode and updated AI traffic such as GX at Brighton, I'd buy instantly.
     
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  46. solicitr

    solicitr Well-Known Member

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    A perfectly valid reason. OTOH, one can certainly understand DTG's thinking, in making the upgrades to the three routes every player has.
     
  47. LeadCatcher

    LeadCatcher Well-Known Member

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    That is the nature of a railroad, especially commuter services - they run the same service like clock work because people depend on the schedule.

    Not sure what you would be looking for when the timetables are based on The real thing. Freight, especially main line freight, have their scheduled runs since the shippers depend on those schedules… in fact time zones were implemented just so railroads could keep to schedules and have predictable movements. That means successive runs will be repetitive and to be honest, rather like the timetable mode much more than the scenario based model of TSClassic.

    In TSClassic, there is nothing to represent a real schedule, each scenario is a set piece that stands on its own. The scenario authors can add much “game play” to their creations, but nothing approaching the representation of a 24 hour life schedule as we have in TSW2. If you haven’t tried TSClassic, you might want to since the scenario based activity sounds more to your liking.

    I use TSW2, TSClassic as well as Run8 because each have their own approach to representing railway operations.
     
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  48. redrev1917

    redrev1917 Well-Known Member

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    Wow an actual post with constructive feedback, written in a coherent manner. Are you new here?
     
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  49. George C. Barnes

    George C. Barnes Member

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    Do you mean more AI trains will run on the route due to the density of the timetable being increased?
    Well, I didn't think about that before.
    But to make players truly "feel" the life, DTG might need more opposite direction operating trains, or same direction but different track and speed, so that players could be able to see them, I hope DTG could figure out that.
    P.S. A train that runs in front of players' trains and keeps making yellow/red lights is also a choice, just a little bit annoying, lol.

    P.SS. The performance need also to be concerned, as many people already running under 60 fps even around 30 fps.
     
  50. redrev1917

    redrev1917 Well-Known Member

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    Have you ever actually played one of the Rush Hour routes? All 3 are filled with trains on different tracks at different speeds, with different station stops heading to different destinations.
     

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