Very interesting! Excited for this route, but very confused why Luzern-Sursee hasn’t been previewed yet. According to info from the roadmap stream two weeks ago, it’s supposed to release before Harlem Line. So maybe next week’s stream is more of an early preview, with a few weeks to go until the final release?
It really all depends on which route is closer to being release-ready. Skyhook needed more time with HSC, so Rivet may be in a similar position with Lucerne.
But also don't forget that Harlem Line was announced last year around Thanksgiving, so the team have already been working on the route, and gathering resources
When it was announced and when they started working on it are two completely separate things with nothing to do with each other.
It is not the first time, and it won't be the last, that two routes arrive at the last stage of development at approximately the same time and not even the devs know exactly which of the two is going to be finished first. And even if they do finish at the same time (or just with a few days difference), the marketing department might say "hey, release this first".
This route is wonderful, so well designed but takes nearly 5gb of disk space, but it’s well worth it.
Done my first drive and already I can tell I am going to have fun with this one. Few points meant in a constructive manner and is based on train 442 Croton to GCT, not sure if these are service specific or general issues. 1) The station stop at 125th Street doesnt have an arrival time on the HUD display (think it should be 11:11 based on the departure time of 11:12) Weirdly the evaluation page lists this as 11:23 2) The next speed limit on the HUD doesnt change once you pass the point although the distance to the next speed change does. This then corrects itself once the last carriage enters the speed zone. Not sure if this happens at every speed change but it certainly did in the tunnel section where the limit increases from 45mph to 60mph. 3) Im fairly certain I saw a floating signal on the viaduct just after 125th street, I'll try and do a screen grab if I spot it again. 4) On arrival into GCT once you open the doors and passengers unloaded it doesnt prompt you to close the doors and the run doesnt complete until you close them. Like I said nothing game breaking but just minor snagging to be picked up by the team, but overall a really nice route and the NY skyline and route in general is well done.
Has anyone managed to get gold on the M3A tutorial? I ran it for the first time and didn't quite get gold but didn't think anything of it, just gone back to try again and was 41 points short with no speeding (I dropped 1 point on a stop). Is it actually possible? Or am I just driving like a muppet
Great feedback, looking forward to this! I would add that its correct for the doors to have to be closed upon arrival at the terminal, most trains get fully shut down to be used later in the day. Since Grand Central is a terminal with 50 tracks, it also acts as a yard.
Yeah but usually you'll get a prompt on the top left HUD telling you to close the doors, but the command is missing. Not an issue for us seasoned players but for newbies it's got potential to cause confusion and frustration.
If I'm understanding you correctly, this is normal behaviour for when the speed limit applies from the back of the train (which I assume it does on this route) - the countdown on the HUD is to you as they player/driver (this goes for everything).
It's not acting like that at every speed increase, some the top right HUD changes from the front and some from the back. The bottom right HUD always goes from the rear as expected. It's just occurred to me perhaps a switch ahead of the train is changing and thus the next speed limit also changes. I'll explore further to see if this is the case.
I have an issue with the Harlem Line : at least the M7 train is accelerating WAY too much (I did not check the M3) ! I measured more than 1,25 m/s² (2,8 mphps) on a flat track from 0 to 30 mph, whereas it should not exceed 0,9 m/s² (2 mphps) according to the Bombardier specs sheet. I uploaded a video where you can see it : https://drive.google.com/file/d/1V-0yL3pbHOprnYzq-l7ShLJP3Hs9vhQ7/view?usp=sharing The M7 on the LIRR route accelerates in a more accurate way. What happened ? TrainSim-Matt what is your opinion on this ?
Apparently the acceleration on the M7A for Metro North is quicker than the one for Long Island, which is what you've posted.
Really enjoying the DLC so far. Both trains are fun to drive and it's a nice change from Bakerloo! Only issue I've found so far is that the M7 headlights don't light up the tunnels when in off board camera unless you're looking at the train head on.
The unit on this route is the M7A, not the M7. They are different from the LIRR stock, and Matt has mentioned that the Harlem Line units have different gearing compared to the LIRR trains. So maybe that's the reason? Can you get a similar info sheet for the MTA's M7A?
It would be highly surprising that the acceleration rate of the M7A could be that much higher even with a different gearing. It's third rail powered commuter train, by definition it can not draw as much power as other electric trains. For example the DB BR423, which has better IRL performance, accelerates slower IRL than the M7A does in-game. It's the same for the swiss RABe 511. According to this non-official website, the M7A does not differ that much from the M7 : http://www.trainsarefun.com/lirr/M7/lirrM7.htm Something feels really wrong in the M7A acceleration as reproduced in TSW 2
I forgot to mention that the 1,25m/s² I measured is better than the NYC subway itself (1,1m/s² for an R160 for example) and it is really close to some of the best subway rolling stock in the world (1,35 m/s²). In reality, a M7A is far from being that fast
I second this. Route looks amazing and I love the sound improvements for the M7A. It's nice to finally hear that humming sound you'd hear IRL once the train accelerates past 30 mph. However the acceleration does seem a bit too fast. Either that or I've just never been on a ride where the engineer went straight into full power from a standstill to experience its acceleration at 100% throttle.
But players shouldn't have to do that though. If the m7a does indeed accelerate too fast at full throttle then that needs to be fixed. I've been on an m7a many times and it is certainly not the fastest accelerating train in the world when at full power. Honestly many aspects of this route seems to have been rushed
Id doubt engineers would ever drive the way you did on the video so stating you've never been on a M7a which accelerates the way it does in game is a mute point IMO
Yes, in real life engineers often will not use full throttle and full braking, as they're told to drive efficiently. Of course, I don't know if the M7A performance is realistic or not, but simply going by feel as a passenger is not really a good way of determining it.
Sounds like DTG botched the Simugraph parameters. If the settings are wrong, sadly as we know physics tend not to get fixed with the usual excuses trotted out about botching the timetable, achievements etc. Think I will be waiting for a sale on this one.
It's really no where near as bad as one player is claiming tbh. The timetable is sufficiently padded (albeit I'm basing this off 2 runs) that you don't need to drive like a madman to make time.
You would be surprised how often drivers use the full throttle with commuters trains. It's not the same driving style as intercity trains. I've worked at SNCF in Paris for a few years and I can assure you that drivers do use full throttle often on the RER and Transilien commuter trains (when driving EMUs). With commuter trains you need to use the railway infrastructure at its best, with fast accelerations and braking to keep up with tight schedules, maximize train frequency and maximize the line PPHPD capacity (People Per Hour Per Direction). You still have some margin to keep up when you are a bit late, but not that much. It's another story on intercity, long-distance trains, where you drive more gently. But that's not what the Harlem line is about. Another example in Germany with the BR423 : (watch at 4m42s for example) - You can clearly hear the throttle hit the max notch when the driver starts at several stations, and you can see the traction indicator going to the max tractive effort allowed for this rolling stock. Anyways the main issue here is that the M7A is out of spec, it almost accelerates like some of the fastest subways in the world ... which is impossible in reality and needs to be corrected. When paying 30€ for a new DLC with recycled trains, I expect it to feature trains that are at least equal to the originals. So far, I'm underwhelmed.
Depends on the country and railway. In Japan for example commuter train drivers are often encouraged to not drive at 100% to be more energy efficient, so they accelerate slower and instead break harder.
You keep saying it's just it spec but so far to support your arguement you've 1) used data sheets for a different spec trainset 2) used driving techniques from European Rapid transit lines against a US route. With Harlem the timetable in no way requires 100% throttle and braking. Using this driving style is going to result in very early arrivals. I'm not saying the train is perfect by any stretch but IMO you are making a mountain out of a molehill and have provided zero relevant information to support your assertion.
Ok. Then prove that I'm wrong and please provide M7A specs sheet. But as you will see, 0,9 m/s² for the M7 can't translate to 1,25m/s² for the M7A. It's impossible. I thought TSW 2 meant to be realistic. At least it's how it describes itself Anyways I'm not willing to pay 30€ to have the impression of driving a kart, and I'm going to ask for a refund until this issue is fixed. Many other lines in the game are way more accurate and I'll stick to them.
I agree with you. However SNCF is very conservative and drivers are told to be efficient too, so it's pretty similar That is why I quoted this example I know very well, I think it fits in.
It doesn't work like that, you are the one who is claiming it's wrong so it's your responsibility to provide reasoning behind your claim. It's like me saying the moon is made of cheese and asking you to provide a price of moon rock to prove I'm wrong.
Knowing how the M7 performs, it's easy to guess how the M7A performs, even with a slightly different gear ratio or whatever. Period.
Well you've provide zero substance to substantiate your claims. You may well be correct but none of your reasoning stands up
Simply fighting doesn't have much use. Honestly it would be good to know for sure if the performance is realistic or not. DTG has said that they used real engineer's opinion and they said the M7A is fine this way, but we may never know, they might be wrong. So it would be good if we really had some info about real M7A performance, because in case it's really wrong, then it needs to be fixed. But if it's realistic, then good.
Hey folks, if you are having some difficulties, we have a "How to drive on Harlem" guidance here. This will continue to get updated as and when required. https://dovetailgames.freshdesk.com...991871-how-to-drive-on-the-harlem-line-add-on
You are right. That's the first time I really feel the need to complain about a train in TSW 2. What I'm saying is backed by the official specs sheet and my experience in the railway industry. So there is some substance. Let's wait for an official answer, backed (i hope) by a M7A specs sheet... Thanks for this guide about the signaling system, it's good to know
I found this thread, which is unofficial, from an OpenBVE train developer quoting the same figures for the Metro North M7 : https://www.nyctransitforums.com/to...7-emu-development-in-progress/#comment-810924 He also says, which makes sense, that the LIRR M7 is capped to accelerate slower than 0,9 m/s² at full throttle in order to reduce current draw on the LIRR third rail. It's well reproduced in TSW 2 as I'm measuring about 0,75m/s² if I remember it correctly. There has clearly been something wrong in the development of the Metro North M7(A) for TSW2.
So the M7 is capped but we aren't talking about the M7 but the M7a, have you a source that this has also been capped? In my simple head if it hasn't been capped and given the higher gear ratio we should expect the M7a to have far superior acceleration to the M7 (as seen in game) because you wouldn't go to the hassle and expense of capping it off it the lost acceleration was marginal would you?
Below that statement a further comment lists a number of other differences . Neither statements have anything that I can see to substantiate these conflicting statement
What do you mean I did? First of all an M7A doesn't do zero to 20 mph rapidly at full power as shown in the video. Do you honestly think that an M7A which is not very different to an M7 would accelerate that fast? The differences are minor. They produce the same power output. Both the M7 and M7A collect power from 750 V DC Third Rail. The M7A collects power from an underunning third rail and that's for safety reasons on the railroad. The idea of that is so if people for whatever reason touch the top of the third rail, all the voltage wouldn't be on the top part of the rail. They have vents on the roof and other minor differences that aren't performance related. In lirr trains get power from a overrunning third rail. The M7A IS an M7 but designed to run on the MTA Metro-North Railroad. You act like they are completely different when the differences are minor. Also in the Metro-North Railroad drivers do use full power as a efficient way to keep with time. My uncle works on the Metro-North railroad and uses full power all the time. He drives on the New Haven line but before did a brief stint on the Hudson Line. I remember him taking me on a ride a while back. It was nice to be honest Look if you don't believe me that's fine. But if you have never been on a M7A or inside a cab of an M7A when going full power, than your statement is moot.
