So Will Tsw2 Be Totally Obsolete?

Discussion in 'TSW General Discussion' started by shhweeet#4292, Aug 10, 2022.

  1. shhweeet#4292

    shhweeet#4292 Well-Known Member

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    As in you won’t be able to buy any new dlcs for it once TSW3 comes out. Will TSW2 still get supported by the preservation crew?

    Some things about TSW3 look interesting like dynamic weather etc. but tbh Im not really that excited by TSW3. I’m only interested UK trains to if I were to get TSW3 what’s the best and cheapest way for me to get it? I’ve got most UK routes except the new IOW and SOS. Glad to see PS4 is still being supported I bet there is a few not happy about that.

    Apparently all your TSW2 dlc’s can be transferred into TSW3 for free but what about the routes you got if you first bought TSW2 on disc like me? In my case I got London Underground, ECW, and Sand Patch Grade on disc when I first bought TSW2 so how will they be transferred into TSW3 or is it just TSW2 routes you bought via download only that gets a free transfer? Which if so I’m definitely out because I refuse to buy them again for TSW3 just because I got them on disc.

    Tbh I dunno why DTG didn’t just bring all these new features into TSW2 instead of forcing everyone to buy a completely new game called TSW3 which just complicates things and is a bit off putting because of all the hassle.
     
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2022
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  2. LIRRGuy

    LIRRGuy Well-Known Member

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    So far most likely, The roadmap should be out later today
     
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  3. Lenwigg

    Lenwigg Well-Known Member

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    There will be a way to do it. When TSW2 came out there were those that had the same problem coming from TSW2020. There was a way that it could be done and they will explain how no doubt when the time is nearer.
     
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  4. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    When TSW2020 went to TSW2 they put in a process where anyone who had hard copies (ie disks rather than digital only) would send them a message and then DTG issued soft licenses for the TSW2 versions.
    I would imagine something similar here, so just wait for the instructions on how to do it and it should be fine. You WON'T lose what you have in TSW2 and DTG will address it for TSW3
     
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  5. shhweeet#4292

    shhweeet#4292 Well-Known Member

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    Good to know there will probably be a way to transfer the disc based starter routes from TSW2 into TSW3 for free hopefully fairly simply and with no hassle.

    I’ve worked out as a UK only train fan that the cheapest way for me to get TSW3 without having to pay for routes from other countries which I’m really not bothered about is to purchase the SOS TSW3 pack for £29.99 because I haven’t got SOS yet. This gets me SOS obviously and the actual TSW3 game. Have I understood this correctly? It’s all a little bit confusing. If so I’m glad I never purchased SOS a few weeks ago when I was dilly dallying about whether to get it or not. Also if I’ve understood all this correctly it’s yet another reason not to buy TSW dlc’s right from the day of release but to wait a bit to see what happens otherwise you could well and truly shoot your self in the foot.

    I’m still at a loss as to why all these TSW3 changes couldn’t just be updated into TSW2 unless it really is about money. Depending on what you already own or want could be the difference between players just saying to heck with it I’m just sticking to what I’ve got or can still get in TSW2 especially if they are still on PS4 / 8th gen consols. If I’ve understood the various TSW3 packs available correctly? I’ve got off fairly lightly in the rip off stakes and it will give me more of a reason to buy and a way into SOS which I’ve never been to sure about. but like I said I’m not too sure if I’ve understood all the available TSW3 packs correctly?
     
    Last edited: Aug 10, 2022
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  6. ottselmaster

    ottselmaster Well-Known Member

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    This feels like such a con. TSW2 isnt even finished having issues and bugs not to mention missing preservation routes and now they are just going to abandon it because the new "update" is coming? Sorry I refuse to call tsw3 a new game.
     
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  7. Nick Y

    Nick Y Well-Known Member

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    The SoS bundle will only get you the training center and the SoS route. Basically you'd be paying £29.99 for the training part and SoS. Nothing else is included but you'll get the improvements such as dynamic weather etc on SoS.
    [​IMG]
     
  8. arek#2842

    arek#2842 Well-Known Member

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    Well, there is nothing else - just other routes.
     
  9. shhweeet#4292

    shhweeet#4292 Well-Known Member

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    That’s true Nick but ( And I’m speaking from my own personal situation here ) I only need SOS and the new IOW dlc and I will have all the UK routes which is all I’m bothered about. I will get the new SEHS as a free import into TSW3 as an owner of it in TSW2 and also the new IOW dlc as well should I buy it in TSW2 in a sale before TSW3 is released, so by my reckoning by getting the SOS TSW3 pack I’m effectively paying full price for SOS ( Which is a bullet I’d have to bite ) and a fiver for the TSW3 game itself.

    Swings and roundabouts but for me personally that’s a pretty good deal in the greater scheme of things I suppose. I’d be seriously annoyed though had I bought SOS when it was first released, or a couple of weeks ago which I nearly did because I’d then be paying £29.99 just to have TSW3.

    Again moral of the story here is never buy a dlc on first release at full price but wait for a sale. It might also save yourself heartache By feeling ripped off when something like the announcement of TSW3 happens.
     
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  10. shhweeet#4292

    shhweeet#4292 Well-Known Member

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    That’s true, and a few fancy weather effects. How many really new routes depends on whether you already own SEHS. Honestly the more I think about this I can’t understand why all this TSW3 stuff wasn’t just a TSW2 update?

    it’s not often I agree with the PS5 mob but if DTG expect me to pay £50 for the all dancing bells and whistles TSW3 deluxe pack should I want all the routes available etc then I’d expect a brand new TSW3 title no! I’d DEMAND an all new TSW3 title to fully utilise the full power of the PS5 with a new engine etc. As it stands PS4 support is still pretty relevant so said Sam in his recent SOS jaunt on YouTube, so until PS4 support really isn’t viable anymore all this really should just be a TSW2 upgrade / dlc add on. Expecting PS5 Players to pay £50 or whatever for what is basically a slightly glorified TSW2 game with a different name is a bit rich imho.
     
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  11. Trainzdriver328

    Trainzdriver328 Active Member

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    I just can't understand how DTG came up with the idea of developing a completely new game which is theoretically completely the same, just with new routes and features. Instead of maybe releasing that as an update for TSW 2: No, of course not. Develop a new game and then get everyone's money out of their pockets again. TSW 2 still has thousands of bugs and still has big potential and instead of focusing on them they are re-developing something "new". I don't understand that mindset, ngl.
     
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  12. TKessel

    TKessel Well-Known Member

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    Trainzdriver328
    Because you get this totally wrong. They do not develope a brand new game, TSW3 is an updated TSW2. And developing stuff costs money, because you have to pay people to actually work for you. So to bring you new features you have to pay money, that's how it works. But they are so nice that you get three routes for about 12,50€ each route instead of paying 90€ like every single new route is normally 30€.

    You don't have to spent money, stay with TSW2 and wait for a sale or full price now for your hobby, you decide that. And I assume you are not working for free so don't expect that from the employees of DTG.
     
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  13. OldVern

    OldVern Well-Known Member

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    IMO it has already been rendered obsolete and little to no point in playing on, if you even remotely anticipate getting TSW3. That's on the assumption that progress such as Journey mode, general statistics such as distance travelled will not transfer over. Might as well go and play something else for the next month or whenever you plan on getting it.
     
  14. shhweeet#4292

    shhweeet#4292 Well-Known Member

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    You’ve said it yourself TSW3 is an updated TSW2. No one is expecting DTG employees to work for nothing and yes developing new routes and features like dynamic weather cost money to develop but the point is they are expecting existing players to shell out for what is being touted as a brand new game called TSW3? PS5 players are getting a supposedly brand new game but it doesn’t fulfil the full potential of the PS5, and PS4 players are expected to shell out for a brand new game that will be just like TSW2 and still with some missing things like reduced AI etc. which is fair enough because a PS4 is an old console. TSW2 is a game that straddles the newer and older gen consoles because PS4 is still relevant because they are still apparently in the majority. So what we have here is both PS5 and PS4 players being forced to fork out for a totally new game if they want to carry on buying the latest dlc’s when they come along.but not getting anything really new. DTG can cover their costs of development by charging for the new dlc’s as they were via TSW2 dlc’s and maybe a small fee to upgrade TSW2 so it gets the new weather effects of players want that.

    As it stands no one is really getting what they are expected to pay for by being asked to buy this new TSW3, but I’d say PS4 players are probably the happiest because the PS4 is still supported so at least they can still carry on using their old console.
     
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  15. arek#2842

    arek#2842 Well-Known Member

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    Theoretically, yes, but I have serious doubts about the performence (frame rate) on PS4 with all this dynamic weather and better lighting effects. Even now TSW2 has some issues with keeping 25 FPS on PS4 on some routes, I doubt they've managed to make a major optimization in just 2 or 3 months that would fix that and also give space for those new effects.

    This "TSW3" thing is just marketing trick, catchy title, to bring your attention and seduce you to pay for it, while in fact it is just route pack with few additional graphics effects.

    Cheap trick from a company, that apparently has nothing more to offer in the subject of train simulation neither have any idea how their product should evolve to become better and better with time.
     
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  16. ottselmaster

    ottselmaster Well-Known Member

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    THIS! The game will run like utter ass on last gen. Think 15fps. Dtg wont care, itll be "Well play it on a ps5 then"
     
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  17. arek#2842

    arek#2842 Well-Known Member

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    But what for - to watch TWS3's 8th gen graphics in 60 FPS? No thanks :D
     
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  18. ottselmaster

    ottselmaster Well-Known Member

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    Its ok TSW4 will be coming in 2024. "Now with EVEN MORE Leafs on the track!"
     
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  19. LIRRGuy

    LIRRGuy Well-Known Member

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    Think its safe to say for now TSW 2 will not be totally Obsolete, but eventually it will sadly
     
  20. chieflongshin

    chieflongshin Well-Known Member

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    YouLl get your tsw2 preserved updates and fixes and then you’re on your own, a small snapshot in time with no new dlc
     
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  21. ottselmaster

    ottselmaster Well-Known Member

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    The fact they couldn't even do a "Farewell tsw2!" event shows they dont care.
     
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  22. arek#2842

    arek#2842 Well-Known Member

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    Yeah, I wouldn't be so sure about those fixes. I can't get you precise example, but reading this forum I've come across issues mentioned to not be fixed since TSW2020.
     
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  23. ottselmaster

    ottselmaster Well-Known Member

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    "Dont question, just consume product then get excited for next product"
     
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  24. SHINO BAZ

    SHINO BAZ Well-Known Member

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    This is clearly a double standed here some talk about poor dtg employees can't work for free(Not saying they should)But we the customers also don't deserve to be left with a still broken game.So dumping the previous game making us need to upgrade to the next version so are current broken game will get fixed because the previous version has been abandoned. Yea thanks alot.
     
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  25. Kitten

    Kitten Active Member

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    Love Red Letter Media.
     
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  26. Luke8899

    Luke8899 Well-Known Member

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    Coz like you do not have to pay for anything, so if you are buying TSW3, it is because you want to buy it, not because DTG are forcing you to buy it, and until the people on this forum develop the emotional intelligence to simply admit "I like this game a lot, I play it a lot, I come to this forum to discuss this game which I like and play a lot, and I am deeply excited for new content in this game that I like, play, and discuss a lot", you'll just keep going around in circles trying to play a game of 4D chess with yourself to find out this mystical reason why DTG, a commercial company, make commercial decisions beneficial to their existence as a commercial entity, and why you, as an adult with free will, buy what they sell you.
     
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  27. ottselmaster

    ottselmaster Well-Known Member

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    The existing Preservation Crew content on the Roadmap will be released within Train Sim World 3 first, with releases coming into Train Sim World 2 at a later date.

    THIS IS B.S. Really shows TSW2 is being treated like trash. Weve waiting who knows how long for stuff like Canadian pres crew updates.
     
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  28. Conrad

    Conrad Member

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    TSW3 is a marketing operation.Is not a new version.
    Next TSW4 with Unreal 5 and only current gen will be a new version.
    The post you quoted is right.
    And if there are a lot of people angry about broken promises, there must be a reason.
    But marketing is marketing...
     
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  29. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Why "only current gen"?
     
  30. Loco Dave

    Loco Dave Member

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    I'm thinking of running 2 and 3 together to overcome the dlc limitation.
     
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  31. shhweeet#4292

    shhweeet#4292 Well-Known Member

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    I was thinking the same thing but for a different reason.

    As stated earlier I’ll probably buy the TSW3 SOS starter pack. It gives me a reason to finally buy SOS even if it will effectively will be for full price, I’ll be able to play the extended SEHS for free, and it gives me an entry into TSW3 for a fiver.

    I will still probably play all the older routes in TSW2 though even if I transfer them all into TSW3 as free transfers. Why? Because not being able to transfer all my hours of progress gold medals etc that I’ve earned in TSW2 into TSW3 is a big deal for me.

    The only thing that would change my mind and play everything exclusively in TSW3 is if the new fancy pants weather effects did make a big difference to my enjoyment and immersion. If I ever get a PS5 ha ha then that might also persuade me to go totally over to TSW3?
     
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  32. Loco Dave

    Loco Dave Member

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    As I understand it, there's not going to be everything upgraded so it may as well stay in 2. Just move them to 3 if they are modernised.
    Hopefully the dlc problem will have been fixed after a while so that's when 2 can be discarded.


    edit
    Apparently old routes will get the new dynamic weather. With the likely dlc fix, 2's dead!
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2022
  33. GoldenTicket420

    GoldenTicket420 Well-Known Member

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    I can't believe this but as always Just like rush-hour I had high hopes Until I realize Train Sim World 2 Routes Will not receive any of the new features other than dynamic weather How unfortunate....... Just like when I preorder at rush hour And still to this day have not gotten Rush-hour Passengers For London commuter. I love and do support the game But there is a lack of effort Explaining What do you get Before release Even with the Roadmap And I don't know if that's intentional for marketing And getting people to buy But it's really not right Seriously!!!!!
     
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  34. TimTri

    TimTri Well-Known Member

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    I believe the routes that haven’t gotten Preservation Crew updates yet will still receive them (on both TSW2 and 3), and then the preservation crew will focus on the training center as well as other miscellaneous tasks (such as separating locos from “their” routes in the future). It appears like existing routes will no longer be brought up to date, only receive bug fixes.
    Theoretically, if you stay on TSW2, the only thing you’re going to miss out on is the dynamic weather (which is implemented into every route on TSW3 - old and new), the new UI and the minor bug fixes.

    I’m personally definitely going to buy TSW3, but I’ll probably keep TSW2 installed for a while to have a stable place to play my old routes since issues with TSW3 in the beginning are to be expected - it’s the same case with every new release in the gaming industry to be fair. I’ll also keep TSW2 because it will allow me to use the save game feature, a function I will dearly miss in TSW3 because it has always worked quite well for me. I hope they can still turn things around and somehow implement it.

    If they’re really going to stop maintaining older routes, I hope we get a permanent price reduction for them - maybe 20€ instead of 30€? It would only be fair since the older DLCs will get no new features and less support in the future.
     
    Last edited: Aug 11, 2022
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  35. shhweeet#4292

    shhweeet#4292 Well-Known Member

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    If I understand this correctly there is no profile / progress transfer from TSW2 to TSW3 and there is also no profile / progress transfer from PS4 to PS5. So! If a player still currently on PS4 does decide to buy TSW3, and transfer everything from TSW2 into TSW3 and then play everything as TSW3 they will be starting their profile / progress entirely from scratch which is bad enough, THEN if they eventually decide to / or can get hold of a PS5 and then gets the PS5 version of TSW3 to play everything in that they will then have to start their profile / progress yet again! if I’ve understood this correctly a current PS4 player could find themselves having to start their profile / progress from scratch twice!? Honestly! If that’s the case I’m kinda coming to the conclusion to just not bother with TSW3 at all, at least until I eventually get a PS5 and just keep playing as a PS4 player,( which I am at the moment ) TSW2.

    Having to restart your profile / progress twice along with no save feature in TSW3 makes TSW3 a bit of a waste of time for a current PS4 player from what I can see. In which case DTG may as well have made TSW3 exclusively for PS5 and continue supporting TSW2 for as long as PS4’s are still around as an exclusive PS4 game by making any new dlc’s available to buy via TSW2 for us poor PS4 plebs.

    As it stands I’m thinking my TSW journey has possibly come to an end at least until I eventually get a PS5.

    So I might be saying goodbye to you all for a while ( Maybe forever who knows? ) unless I am prepared to run TSW2 alongside TSW3. TSW2 for playing older routes / dlc’s minus the new weather and TSW3 for anything completely new like SOS and the extended SEHS.

    Honestly! Have DTG thought any of this through??? As it stands TSW2 is still relevant and far from obsolete for those of us still playing on a PS4 from what I can see
     
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  36. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    There are many things that haven't been fulfilled in TSW since TSW1, so "have they thought it through" would have to be a resounding no.
    It makes very little sense to me why all TSW2 content doesn't have it's status transferred to TSW3 so long as it's on the same machine (or exportable via some cloud system). They've already said there are NO changes between TSW2 content and TSW compatible content only SEHS and SoS, so why don't everything BUT THOSE TWO carry across completely?
     
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  37. shhweeet#4292

    shhweeet#4292 Well-Known Member

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    Absolutely no sense at all. Who in DTG makes these decisions? Are they employed on some sort of YTS scheme?

    If I decide to give TSW3 a complete miss ( I haven’t fully decided if spending £30 to actually get TSW3, finally get SOS, and to get extended SEHS is worth it or indeed worthwhile the bother ) because of my reasons given above then that’s DTG not getting any revenue from me at all at least until I get a PS5 should I still be interested in TSW by then? by which time an all singing and all dancing TSW4 that will fully utilise the PS5 processing power will probably be out.

    if a lot of PS4 players are currently starting to think like me then DTG could very well find themselves cutting off regular revenue from PS4 players who are still in the majority according to Sam, who might decide to just give TSW3 a complete miss.

    From what I can see DTG need to get the profile / progress transfer issues between TSW2 to TSW3 and PS4 to PS5 along with a fully working save feature totally sorted out before they do anything else.

    Other game developers must be looking in on DTG’s antics and be shaking their heads whilst uncontrollably laughing.
     
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  38. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Matt is Exec Producer
    Sam has senior input
    Adam (pres crew) is a senior producer
    They'll all have had input on "Do we make people's career transfer or not?"

    On which planet? DTG don't optimize

    Why just PS4? The status doesn't transfer on ANY platform. That PS4 players have two transfers if they're moving to PS5 then TSW3 as well is an addition, but in reality everyone's starting again from Sept 6th if they move to TSW3 (which is mad)

    Well those two issues do need sorting, but different devs do different things... The scenery artist wouldn't need to know, the sound engineers don't need to look. The train physics people DO need to be involved as well as signalling etc etc because that's what needs saving
     
  39. shhweeet#4292

    shhweeet#4292 Well-Known Member

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    Perhaps DTG need to employ different senior members of staff because this bunch sad to say currently don’t really have a clue it would seem? ( That will probably get censored )

    You say DTG don’t optimize Well! They are going to have to if they want to keep developing TSW for the PS5 via a possible future TSW4 title and keep the franchise viable and worth buying.

    I don’t really care who’s responsible for what and who communicates to who or who needs to know whatever, that’s DTG’s problem. As a consumer of TSW I do care if what I’m buying is properly developed and has features like profile / progress transfer and a pretty vital fully working save feature now routes appear to be getting longer fully available and working. As you rightly say everyone having to start all over again whether once or twice with regards to progress or restart a 2 hour route because of a SPAD, bug, or something more important come up where you have to quit tbe game is complete madness. I was specifically talking from a PS4 point of view because that’s what I’m on and that’s what affects me but yes others are affected in some shape or form as well. Either way currently everyone has a decision to make with regards what they want to do and put up with.
     
  40. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Absolutely. That they've rebuilt lighting, extended and rebuilt SEHS, completely rebuilt the Front end and didn't think "hey, these 40 routes are not changing, why not export their status so people keep what they've got?" is an odd thing
     
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  41. steveownzzz#6107

    steveownzzz#6107 Well-Known Member

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    It feels obsolete for me. Now that I know what’s in 3 I don’t even want to touch 2.
     
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  42. arek#2842

    arek#2842 Well-Known Member

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    Well, probably because it would require huge amount of time and a lot of devs to be involved. Time = money. As the updates for all the other DLCs would have to bee free of charge, then they probably come to conclusion it is not profitable for them to spend their time on it. Its cheaper and easier to just abandon those routes and start over with new ones having these features since the beginning.

    And as you are loosing your progress when jumping from TSW2 to TSW3, while TSW2 DLCs are not getting any updates (except dynamic weather) then for a current TSW2 it doesn't make much sense to switch to TSW3, unless you're super hyped for the new routes.
     
  43. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    The medal status of the routes is stored somewhere on the machines, so getting this put out and then imported to the new version should be possible.
    I understand from the roadmap stream that they can't put in achievements automatically (the stores see them as separate games so separate achievements) put whether you got gold on BML on the 09:00 run should be possible just by copying a database file

    I will for SEHS, new lighting and dynamic weather because I'm fed up of green light specials on every route. Not much variation in the game as it was. Hopefully TSW3 allow more "play" in the gameplay other than "start, stop, open doors. Start, stop, open doors..."
     
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  44. arek#2842

    arek#2842 Well-Known Member

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    Oh, I didn't mean the profile and progress transfer between TSW2 and TSW3, this should be easily achivable, I assume it is being stored in form of a file(s), so is it really that much effort to develop a transition of these values from one file to another? But maybe TSW code is such a mess even such task is mountain effort of work...

    I'm not sure if I've understand you here corectly, but the new lighting means new lighting effects, like better shadows, in cab lighting etc. It does not mean you'll get more varied runs when you'll be put on hold on red lights to pass other train(s)...
     
    Last edited: Aug 12, 2022
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  45. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    Maybe... Given each DLC is a standalone environment who knows if the data is compatible even within TSW2?

    OK I will clarify
    I will get TSW3 from release because I want
    • The new lighting system - showing off the environment (close up) better (even if the far view doesn't seem much better)
    • The new dynamic weather system
    • The fact that the new weather CAN change timings and adhesion slightly, so whereas right now you can put the train in DRIVE, wait for the pings to go by as AWS says "yup, this signal's green too" and then stop at the next station the new weather WILL change timings so you MIGHT get some yellows, or (GASP) a red...
    Fingers crossed they haven't banjaxxed that anyway
     
  46. arek#2842

    arek#2842 Well-Known Member

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    Ah, ok, well if that would be the case then this dynamic weather would be kind of a game changer and I would be also much more interested in TSW3, than now.
     
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  47. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    It was in the release stream somewhere...
     
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  48. shhweeet#4292

    shhweeet#4292 Well-Known Member

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    If the dynamic weather has an effect on the older dlc’s like NTP, TV, etc and gives the player the possibility of more varied runs with regards to getting more yellow and red lights due to weather and adhesion affecting timings then that would be a pretty good reason to play the older routes in TSW3 I agree. I missed that in the release stream.

    Does the original TSW2 SEHS dlc get a free transfer into TSW3 and if so get the new dynamic weather? or is it just the new extended SEHS that will be available to play in TSW3? I’m pretty sure I read somewhere TSW3 will be the extended SEHS only but I can’t remember tbh.
     
  49. ARuscoe

    ARuscoe Well-Known Member

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    The TSW2 version won't be ported over.
     
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  50. Can I ask what's so important about the achievements progress in tsw to everyone?

    Am I missing something, do the achievements unlock hidden features of the game or give you access to special content?
     

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